Is Dignics 09c good for serve?

[ThePongCommenter]

If you really care, you might try the wayback machine and scan for when the Butterfly website changed. It's really not the kind of thing I spend a lot of time on though.

If you are arguing the website is wrong and she is really using D05, well, that's a different story - I just pretend the website is right though it could be wrong for sure.

Page archived in August 2024 shows that she was using 05 and 09c with a posting date of 2024/04/18, though unclear if the 09c was on FH or BH. 05FH 09c BH is common with Japanese players.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Okay. Yet you expect people on TTD to trust your posts here?

On topics where I get first hand info, yeah. But people can choose to believe or not.

I am with Robin on what you guys were discussing. Outdated website are not reliable and do you trust me when I said that? since you went to checked and verified what I am saying 😊, so you probably trust it now.

And in all fairness, always discount what the official brands say, other than Matt for obvious reasons.

I, like Robin, probably thought you had some photo of her racket

 

[blahness]

Hello everyone,

I started out playing with MX-P and Tenergy 05 rubbers when I first began, spending a lot of time practicing serves. Over time, I developed serves that gave my opponents a really hard time, sometimes even players 200–300 rating points above me.

As I improved, I switched to Dignics 09c and focused more on my open game and receive skills, which got significantly better. However, I noticed an issue with my serves: they often ended up too high over the net, or my placement was slightly off. While Dignics provides a lot of spin, I realized that spin isn't always the most critical factor in my serves.

Eventually, I decided to switch to a non-tacky rubber on my forehand with a harder sponge, Tenergy 05 Hard. Since then, my serves have started to shine again. Though my open game is slightly less effective compared to when I used Dignics 09c, I feel this setup better suits my level of play.

I understand that pros prioritize counterloops, but at my level, I don’t encounter situations where it’s crucial often enough to make it a priority.

Have any of you experienced similar issues? If so, how did you address them?

How high are you tossing?

My feeling is that Dignics has a different mechanics to serve which almost requires that the ball sinks into the sponge quite a bit. The easiest way to do this is with higher toss (min above head level in my experience). I also have trouble really controlling low toss serves with Dignics (im using 05 but i used 09c before and it is not that different). Strangely i remember Tenergy being very good for low toss because it catches the ball tangentially very well even at low forces.

Ironically, with a higher toss i am getting a lot more spin, trajectory and placement control on my Dignics serves than low toss which often like what you said is easy to pop up and is not easy to serve at high spin and short at the same time (esp sidetopspin variants).

 

[andzejgolot]

I remember the bite on old celluloid balls with rakza 7 soft or rasant grip on my backhand...
ABS balls destroyed control and grip on the backhand side without tacky surface and Timo Boll tried to bring back the bite and Control with 09c. He still used tenergy 05 as his FH rubber so dignics 09 c was created as backhand loop rubber

 

[andzejgolot]

Its bouncy. I found my opps had problems with medium long backspin services because the quality is top notch+ the ball goes up like you said but it is diving fast

 

[Takkyu_wa_inochi]

It must be horrible that’s why no pros is thinking of using it

 

[sebi]

I think tacky rubbers are the best for serving, rubbers like h3, 09c and alike. I have 09c and service is a non issue rather they are really good. But i think you need more racket speed to get all the potential out of the rubber compared to tenergy 05 or dignics 05.

 

[Steinmejer]

I remember the bite on old celluloid balls with rakza 7 soft or rasant grip on my backhand...
ABS balls destroyed control and grip on the backhand side without tacky surface and Timo Boll tried to bring back the bite and Control with 09c. He still used tenergy 05 as his FH rubber so dignics 09 c was created as backhand loop rubber

Are you sure he still uses tenergy 05 in forhand? it is not what he shows in his glue videos and on butterfly sponsor list?

How high are you tossing?

My feeling is that Dignics has a different mechanics to serve which almost requires that the ball sinks into the sponge quite a bit. The easiest way to do this is with higher toss (min above head level in my experience). I also have trouble really controlling low toss serves with Dignics (im using 05 but i used 09c before and it is not that different). Strangely i remember Tenergy being very good for low toss because it catches the ball tangentially very well even at low forces.

Ironically, with a higher toss i am getting a lot more spin, trajectory and placement control on my Dignics serves than low toss which often like what you said is easy to pop up and is not easy to serve at high spin and short at the same time (esp sidetopspin variants).

well you are kinda right on high loss serve it is easier to get the right angle, however it is not my only serve and i serve differently depending on the player that i am facing... and yes i might have to work on the racket angle to get the same out of my rubber and might take time, but i do feel alot better serving with non tacky rubbers...

Its bouncy. I found my opps had problems with medium long backspin services because the quality is top notch+ the ball goes up like you said but it is diving fast

you are right there is indeed more spin and that is also why it bounces however it is the bounce i would like to be able to control better because some times i would like to value placement and hight over spin, because some people have no issues with spin but has issues with placement of the ball...

I think tacky rubbers are the best for serving, rubbers like h3, 09c and alike. I have 09c and service is a non issue rather they are really good. But i think you need more racket speed to get all the potential out of the rubber compared to tenergy 05 or dignics 05.

i don't find i lack in racket speed or wrist and i do hav plenty of spin im more concerned the the bounce and placement...

 

[andzejgolot]

Are you sure he still uses tenergy 05 in forhand? it is not what he shows in his glue videos and on butterfly sponsor list?

well you are kinda right on high loss serve it is easier to get the right angle, however it is not my only serve and i serve differently depending on the player that i am facing... and yes i might have to work on the racket angle to get the same out of my rubber and might take time, but i do feel alot better serving with non tacky rubbers...


you are right there is indeed more spin and that is also why it bounces however it is the bounce i would like to be able to control better because some times i would like to value placement and hight over spin, because some people have no issues with spin but has issues with placement of the ball...

i don't find i lack in racket speed or wrist and i do hav plenty of spin im more concerned the the bounce and placement...

He used tenergy 09 c which is dignics 09 c today and tenergy 05 as forehand but listen... He is pro he can use everything right now and whatever he wants and his rubbers are different so I dont care if it is dignics 09 c National or dignics 05 National. He is retired super champion.

 

[NetProphet]

He used tenergy 09 c which is dignics 09 c today and tenergy 05 as forehand but listen... He is pro he can use everything right now and whatever he wants and his rubbers are different so I dont care if it is dignics 09 c National or dignics 05 National. He is retired super champion.

Tenergy 09c? 😂
Ok I'm assuming a typo here, still funny tho.
But if it doesn't matter what he uses then whtell anyone what he supposedly uses.
For the record I was sure he used D09c on FH because the extra dwell made it a bit easier to handle the crazy spin from Chinese players using H3 NEO and the likes.
Am open to correction here tho....

 

[Scarfed Garchomp]

Tenergy 09c? 😂
Ok I'm assuming a typo here, still funny tho.
But if it doesn't matter what he uses then whtell anyone what he supposedly uses.
For the record I was sure he used D09c on FH because the extra dwell made it a bit easier to handle the crazy spin from Chinese players using H3 NEO and the likes.
Am open to correction here tho....

T09C existed though seemingly not for the public, and Timo used it before D09C. Its on the LARC

 

[NetProphet]

T09C existed though seemingly not for the public, and Timo used it before D09C. Its on the LARC

Thank you for that, I guess Andjez can now laugh at me! 😁
I'd never heard of that, great bit of info, off to Google I go!

 

[Steinmejer]

He used tenergy 09 c which is dignics 09 c today and tenergy 05 as forehand but listen... He is pro he can use everything right now and whatever he wants and his rubbers are different so I dont care if it is dignics 09 c National or dignics 05 National. He is retired super champion.

Crazy.. yes he can use what i wants he is on a different level

 

[andzejgolot]

Thank you for that, I guess Andjez can now laugh at me! 😁
I'd never heard of that, great bit of info, off to Google I go!

Chill. He had video on his YouTube channel and he told to Dan or solo to camera that he put pressure on Butterfly to make sticky rubber because his backhand lack of dwell and spin on new balls. I see black on fh side so he used on fh too, but yeah chill chill

 

[Yurifi]

you must also know one thing - material of top guys isn't exactly the same as the material we get from tt11 or local shops ... even clubs don't get that special material, if they don't have top player(s), sponsored by someone. I was in a club where from time to time, we'd get some candies - that's how I got my beloved Moonbeam, which, back then, was not even available in our region ...

so it is hard to even compare what they have - yes, maybe Timo Boll is playing with Tenergy05, but how is it prepared? is it boosted? how much boosted. and those things affect game.

as for opening question. you have to find the right spot. the right compromise, if you wish. I played table tennis professionally. even though I didn't play for cca. 20 years, my technique is still quite okay (thankfully my dad/coach was a bit of a visionary and also I invested a bit of time into improving/adapting on my own as well since restart). by pure coincidence I realized, I need a tacky rubber for good serve. I don't need a tacky rubber to create crazy spiny loops, but it sure does help. now, I am currently playing with hard(er) hybrid rubber on FH and soft hybrid rubber on BH, both discovered due to my sickness called EJ (Hi, my name is Jure and I am an Equipment Junkie), and realized that, yes, Omega China Guang is a hell of a rubber but probably a bit too demanding for the level of table tennis I am currently playing (I should play more to really exploit this rubber to 100%). yes, I can block blindfolded with it, yes, I can serve much better with it, yes, opening loops are crazy spiny. but during gameplay, eventhough I am not missing many hits due to rubber, not at all - it just wears me out. it kills me, because I have to be so much more precise, have to hit the ball properly and from there it is just a dominoe effect. so, probably, I will destroy this FH rubber with some more playing (also testing for how durable it is, hopefully it won't destroy me first) and then switch to softer (not as soft as backhand rubber) rubber, just to the comfort of play.

and probably that is what Timo did as well.