Luka Mladenovic EASILY beats Darko Jorgic - can you explain the power of AntiSpin?

[Rinforzando]

I can see Jorgic having some lower back discomfort, maybe this affected his performance ...

on the other hand - playing against anti, long or short pips, there is only one unwritten rule - do not complicate. as soon as you add strange rotations on the ball it is just to add power to the opponent. basically - try playing with "straight" rotation only. or no rotation at all. which is easier to say than do, but yes.

no comment on Winter vs. Polcanova, this is unnatural and I agree with ITTF on this department. balls are not normal, she just blocks the ball and some strange rotation is added to the ball ...

no strange rotation was added. Only spin redirection

 

[Chang]

Jorgic is known to be losing against defensive-style players. His 0-3 loss against Wang Yang was a humiliation, and I think it's due to his backhand-oriented style, while all the prime forehand-oriented players destroy defenders with little effort.

On the other hand, Luka has improved his attacking from forehand side. He used to have one of the slowest and least powerful forehand attacks, but now it looks like he gained some power.

 

[Metaxa]

yes but he is technically proficient with his glanti on bh. Maybe if he had two backsides he would have a better backhand because no time to spend training with the glanti

Mmmmm, I don't think that either. The movements with his BH are terrible, but it works for him.

 

[Yurifi]

no strange rotation was added. Only spin redirection

of course it was - in case of Jorgic - sidespin serve. and then you get strange rotations - not strange as in case of Winter vs. Polcanova, where all sorts of rotations happen, which actually shouldn't, given the nature of Polcanova's stroke and Winter's block (Polcanova topspins, Winter blocks and the ball is side spinning!?)

 

[Rinforzando]

Mmmmm, I don't think that either. The movements with his BH are terrible, but it works for him.

Let's say he developped his own technique with the Glanti ? Come on he is the best glanti player why would he have a bad technique with glanti ? On the other hand his technique with the backside is bad compared to other pros (both on fh and bh)

 

[Rinforzando]

of course it was - in case of Jorgic - sidespin serve. and then you get strange rotations - not strange as in case of Winter vs. Polcanova, where all sorts of rotations happen, which actually shouldn't, given the nature of Polcanova's stroke and Winter's block (Polcanova topspins, Winter blocks and the ball is side spinning!?)

It seems like you have low understanding of how physics work

https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/forum/topics/sabine-winter-switches-to-antispin.36350/post-506229

 

[ejprinz]

PechPong on YouTube has an excellent tutorial about long pips and anti (link). The 0th order strategy is to serve dead & fast into the pips or anti, then attack (this was a thing in the 1970's, so nothing new). Of course no side spin because that comes back weird. It really helps to have a practice partner or have your coach play long pips or anti every once in a while. The spin inversion is predictable.

 

[igorponger]

 

[timdm]

Without a very strong forehand, you will not benefit very much from an anti...

 

[Yurifi]

It seems like you have low understanding of how physics work

https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/forum/topics/sabine-winter-switches-to-antispin.36350/post-506229

maybe I don't know how physics work, but I know how to play table tennis and how to play against anti / short / long pips. what I saw in Winter vs. Polcanova match is not normal table tennis antispin application. yes, Polcanova overcomplicated serves, but to play a straight rotation on the ball, and the ball just flies of uncontrollably, well, that is not normal. i.e. the point at 0:49.

 

[Angerer]

So you rather wanna post a 5 year old match instead of the recent 0-3 defeat? It's a very old match.

 

[blahness]

Luka has very good feeling on that anti chopblock and Jorgic kept doing slow spinny loops to him which again imo is a mistake.

When I was using anti, I loved playing against ppl who gave me slow spinny loops lol. You could do so much quality and variation on the chopblock.

Fake/dead opening loops followed by powerful loopkills, now this is an anti destroyer. With fake/dead opening loops there is simply nothing the anti player can do unless they FH pivot which can be punished in the same ways. Then you get a light topspin ball which is much easier to loopkill off. Because the loopkills are too fast and anti players typically stay too close to the table it is actually quite difficult to defend against these.

 

[Metaxa]

Let's say he developped his own technique with the Glanti ? Come on he is the best glanti player why would he have a bad technique with glanti ? On the other hand his technique with the backside is bad compared to other pros (both on fh and bh)

His BH movements are abominably bad but he has indeed apparently learned his own movements with the anti. It is un-be-liev-able that someone with so little technique can still make it this far.
I keep asking myself then, why didn't this guy just learn good basic technique? Why didn't he just try from the beginning to push with an inverted and from there continue to learn your developments, block, counter, topspin, etc...why?

 

[Yurifi]

His BH movements are abominably bad but he has indeed apparently learned his own movements with the anti. It is un-be-liev-able that someone with so little technique can still make it this far.
I keep asking myself then, why didn't this guy just learn good basic technique? Why didn't he just try from the beginning to push with an inverted and from there continue to learn your developments, block, counter, topspin, etc...why?

maybe, and I am writing this with a big grain of salt, maybe he has some problems?
I mean, I was once called the most technically perfect table tennis player of my generation in my region. I was around 16, 17 years when I clumsily stumbled on stairs and broke my elbow (first time). I had to adjust my technique a bit after recovering, but was lucky enough to still be able to play with normal attacking rubber. then, at the age of 38 I broke my elbow again. I have big problems with topspin wrist movement on backhand and I am adapting backhand stroke technique again. I was already putting short pips rubbers into my shopping cart. but then my dad found a solution and now I am working on a stroke that works. it’s not technically perfect, but it seems it is working. luckily, backhand drive stroke technique changed in a way that makes stroke more comfortable for me but I probably won’t ever be a two wing looper again (even though hope dies last) but at least I am able to play good again. at least good enough to have fun. ☺️

so, maybe he had some sort of an injury / problem and he switched to anti because it enables him to play? just thinking, I am not saying this is a fact, but I know a few people who resorted to antis, short pips and even going full defence because of some sort of limitation. hell, because of a player like that I learned how to play against long pips so well … 😉

 

[Rinforzando]

His BH movements are abominably bad but he has indeed apparently learned his own movements with the anti. It is un-be-liev-able that someone with so little technique can still make it this far.
I keep asking myself then, why didn't this guy just learn good basic technique? Why didn't he just try from the beginning to push with an inverted and from there continue to learn your developments, block, counter, topspin, etc...why?

I'm curious what would be a good technique with glanti from your perspective and if you have any example from players with that said technique.

Good technique or not, it's working incredibly well for him.

 

[Metaxa]

I'm curious what would be a good technique with glanti from your perspective and if you have any example from players with that said technique.

Good technique or not, it's working incredibly well for him.

There are not that many players with anti but what I do know is that Sabine Winter e.g. has a much better technique with her BH than Luka and she not only by the way but also all the other anti players have a much better stroke because they more than likely have a good basic technique. (from/with another rubber).

Good technique or not, it's working incredibly well for him, thats not correct, you have to write, bad technique or not, it's works for him.

 

[Rinforzando]

There are not that many players with anti but what I do know is that Sabine Winter e.g. has a much better technique with her BH than Luka and she not only by the way but also all the other anti players have a much better stroke because they more than likely have a good basic technique. (from/with another rubber).

Good technique or not, it's working incredibly well for him, thats not correct, you have to write, bad technique or not, it's works for him.

Are you sure we are speaking of the same thing ? I agree that Luka technique with his inverted rubber on his backhand (so he has to twiddle) compared to other pro isn't good. But the technique with his frictionless anti is good imo. Low blocks, crazy spin reversal, lot of dampening. On the other hand, Sabine technique with frictionless is bad atm. When she blocks the ball is high, her strawberries are too shy, she tries to chopblock but there isn't any purpose with a glanti to do so, it even removes some of the spin reversal by doing so. Crazy right ?

 

[Metaxa]

Are you sure we are speaking of the same thing ? I agree that Luka technique with his inverted rubber on his backhand (so he has to twiddle) compared to other pro isn't good. But the technique with his frictionless anti is good imo. Low blocks, crazy spin reversal, lot of dampening. On the other hand, Sabine technique with frictionless is bad atm. When she blocks the ball is high, her strawberries are too shy, she tries to chopblock but there isn't any purpose with a glanti to do so, it even removes some of the spin reversal by doing so. Crazy right ?

Luka, has no technique on his BH, let that be clear. Nor can he push on his FH because it looks for his anti (which is normal). I don't feel like watching the video of the opening again but the first 1.35 says enough and it just goes on and on. That boy, no matter how good that he tries his best has never had training like he should have to develop his BH. His moves are from someone who learned to play in a garage, whether against himself or not. May sound harsh but that's how I see it.

 

[Rinforzando]

Luka, has no technique on his BH, let that be clear. Nor can he push on his FH because it looks for his anti (which is normal). I don't feel like watching the video of the opening again but the first 1.35 says enough and it just goes on and on. That boy, no matter how good that he tries his best has never had training like he should have to develop his BH. His moves are from someone who learned to play in a garage, whether against himself or not. May sound harsh but that's how I see it.

Poor technique with his inverted normal rubber which I totally agree but it's another story with his frictionless anti spin.

 

[NoSpin]

I admire a man who plays with 1.9mm 40 degree ESN rubbers on an ALL blade and still thinks he qualified enough to critique top60 players technique.