Question on receive technique

[AlexTax]

Hello there! Since it's really hard to study tabletennis techniques just watching and rewatching videos on Youtube, i was thinking to post here my question, where players with more experience and deeper knowledges could help me.
Supposing that you are playing against an opponent that serves always a good topspin service(short, low and tons of spin) i would like to know:
1. How do you usually receive this kind of service?(based on your skills)
2. What's theoretically the best way to receive it?

When i face a similar opponent i try to play a flip hitting the head of the ball,but most of the times it flies far away from the table,or just goes too high,giving the opponent a good oppourtunity to kill the ball.So,in my case, it's more safe to receive that service in a passive way,blocking with a steady and closed racquet angle...i guess that's because my low skills.What do you guys think about it?

 

[Shiro]

Usually, since its a just a pure topspin serve, i just leave my racket there for the ball to hit, but leave it slightly open, but no too much as the ball will just fly off. Or, i will give sort of like a sort push forward with my racket angle a bit down.

 

[keenansouthall]

I think the main thing here is to try and learn your "style" and what your strengths and weaknesses are. And more important than anything, practice practice practice!


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[Wafik Tawfik]

Hmmm .. if your looking for advantage in the game try side-spin flick FZD style . Its kinda hard .. but if youre looking for "play safe" choice .. Just stick with pushing low short service .. and block fast service .

 

[NextLevel]

Hello there! Since it's really hard to study tabletennis techniques just watching and rewatching videos on Youtube, i was thinking to post here my question, where players with more experience and deeper knowledges could help me.
Supposing that you are playing against an opponent that serves always a good topspin service(short, low and tons of spin) i would like to know:
1. How do you usually receive this kind of service?(based on your skills)
2. What's theoretically the best way to receive it?

When i face a similar opponent i try to play a flip hitting the head of the ball,but most of the times it flies far away from the table,or just goes too high,giving the opponent a good oppourtunity to kill the ball.So,in my case, it's more safe to receive that service in a passive way,blocking with a steady and closed racquet angle...i guess that's because my low skills.What do you guys think about it?

I think what you are doing is okay and it is not about your level but what the opponent is doing to the ball after. Sometimes, you have to play for rally and sometimes, you have to play for pressure. If you are beating your opponent in the rallies, then you play for rally with safe receive. If you are losing after safe receive because of your opponent's attack, you need to do more with the ball with either placement or power.


2. Best return is usually fast, well placed flick, but you can do anything (except push short unless you have incredible control. Pushing short will pop the ball up if there is topsin). You can push long with closed face or around the side like you do, you can chop the serve long, with closed face, you can do a sidespin swipe return with closed face to manipulate the spin better - the ball will be slower but it might give the opponent some hesitation.

The only thing is that you have to get back and ready for topspin rally. You have to figure out where to put the ball so that the opponent cannot get advantage immediately. But if you can flick the ball to somewhere safe or for a winner, that is the best return.

 

[SpinWins]

Adding to this, is there recommended way to attach heavy side/under serve? I usually topspin BH it to back right corner since the spin will make it fly off my paddle left. But I was wonder if there is other ways to punish someone for using this serve.

 

[NextLevel]

You can do almost anything to any serve if you read the spin perfectly and have the right stroke. The problem is that it is not easy to do both, especially the first. You can place a ball anywhere by adjusting your racket angle and swing trajectory.

 

[ttmonster]

I am not entirely sure about your current level, so it would be good if you can give us your approximate USATT rating. e.g I would not dare advise somebody who is already 2200 .
Anyways, there are quite a few things , most of which is common sense that we tend to forget while receiving serve.
1. The moment you are receiving serve you are in the defensive , meaning the server has advantage. At beginner or intermediate levels its better to accept this and opt for a safe but sound serve receive where you prevent the server to initiate a quality attack. Now , if you come across somebody whose serve is quite a few levels below , you should attack the serve , however always remember that in table tennis the person who puts one more ball on the table wins , so atleast 80 percent of your attacks should be on table and 60% should be winning points.

2. If you try to keep attacking the serve and it keeps going out , you should opt for a more defensive approach and at least get the ball in . In this scenario placement and spin should have priority instead of speed , a well placed ball is much harder to attack rather than a badly placed speedy ball , in fact the latter actually results into more disadvantage for the initiator.

Now for your specific questions , for a quality top spin serve , especially the ones the traditional penholders do , its better to block off the bounce with a close angle and place it to the body or transition point or backhand of the server . You can keep adding spin or power as you keep getting comfortable with the serve, there is no point in trying to do an over the table all out loop unless the serve is too high , I which case I would rather flat kill it with a close angle.

About the long pendulum serve to the backhand corner, what you are doing is just fine . It depends on how good your backhand loop is and what kind of shots you have in your arsenal. If the serve is too long and strong its better to return the spin back with varying placement , somethings body , sometimes backhand , sometimes forehand down the line. Good players get used to same return.
If your backhand off the bounce is strong , you can drive the ball by taking it early , again the timing is a little advanced on this shot and you would need somebody to feed you in practice to get this.

If the serve is weak and half long , there are many things that can be done and you should attack such serves more.

The point to remember on this kind of serve and on any serve which is going away from you is to cut the angle off quickly instead of trying to take it too late when the ball is past your optimal hitting zone. However, there are players with really good anticipation and footwork who can get away with taking the ball late , but its too difficult to do especially on the backhand where the hitting zone is smaller and has gotten even smaller with the latest plastic ball .

Hope you find this useful, if you want our forum members to give you more specific advise on where you are going wrong, some video footage would be great .

Adding to this, is there recommended way to attach heavy side/under serve? I usually topspin BH it to back right corner since the spin will make it fly off my paddle left. But I was wonder if there is other ways to punish someone for using this serve.

 

[Pnachtwey]

I usually return top spin serves like any top spin ball. Why not? However, if it is short I do a wrist flick. Sometimes it isn't as fast as a proper flick but it will be more like a short slow spinny loop.

 

[Der_Echte]

There are MANY ways to receive a topspin serves and as Next Level noted, it depends on what your objectives are:

A) Stay Alive (Just land the return and not miss the table)
B) Prevent 3rd ball attack (Land it in a way to make opponent's attack too risky or you surprised him somehow)
C) Set the opponent up for a FALL (You return it in a way that invites an attack that the opponent misses or attack to a zone you are ready for a fast block and a winner) (Next Level does that to me)
D) Setup your 4th ball attack (You return it in a way that opponent refuses to attack and he sends it back - you are ready to attack with heavy spin or pure power)

OK - those are your basic objectives. Remember that NONE of what you do is worth spit unless you land your shot, so that is number one priority.

Now there are numerous ways to to make any and all of that happen vs a TOPSPIN or SIDE/TOPSPIN serve that is short or halflong

1) Just bump it back. Step in a little, extend over table with wide base and get to the bounce. Stick the bat out there and take it right off the bounce. You get more control immediate off the bounce. Read it half right and you got it returned. You are not hitting through, just getting there and holding the bat just behind it and covering it some. Variations are to adjust grip pressure, Use medium to light medium for starters.

2) Bump it back a little forcibly. Do the same, but allow ball to come up just a tad off the bounce and bump through it wit a medium firm grip pressure. Aim it to the middle FH zone if you want him to attack strong, at his crossover if you wanna watch him break hiz own ankles trying to step around attack, or very wide Fh if you wanna see him go off to the races to FH it where you block for winner to his vacant BH side.

3) Kill the spin. This is a demanding shot technically as you need to read the spin almost perfect. You step in and with a loose wrist and semi-open bat, you allow ball to get into your topsheet and at the moment of dwell, you make it looser and withdraw the bat a little. This kills the spin and returns a softer than it looks ball. You keep it low enough and opponent will think it is just a bump back with light topspin and will be setup for that, then too late realize he is setup too far back and makes and error or easy ball for you to attack. You can also do the change of grip at dwell and bump it back deep and dead. Richard Dewitt does this a LOT close to table to players who topspin attack him. Not only is opponent misreading spin, he now has to cope with less time and an unexpected placement on a ball he THINKS should be an easy follow-up attack, so he is dead-set on attacking strongly a ball he should leave alone and fight another day.

4) Chop it back. Many options on how much spin and pace you want to return, plus where to give it. Only you know your opponent and what you want to do. You are taking the ball on the rise with semi-open to open bat and at moment of dwell, going straight down. Experiment with your grip pressure and how quickly you impact the ball. You will learn how to make it short, or fast and deep.

5) FLIP it dead or topspin. Get right up to the ball, cover it some with loose wrist and at moment of dwell, make a quick acceleration very compact to turn ball into a medium topspin return. You figure out where to place it depending on what you wanna do.

6) Side Swipe it. This is kinda like the Banana flick, but vs topspin and you close your bat some more. Change your grip pressure to discover what the ball will do with different pressures. Variation is to go completely to the side. Do that right off the bounce and what opponent scratch head after they misread your return.

 

[AlexTax]

Thank you all for your answers!I'm really satisfied and now i have a lot of things to think on! Reading your posts i see that one of the most important skill i have to learn is variation,against a shot/spin there are plenty of solutions that could be play.
Thanks for sharing your knowledge with me!
Alessandro.

 

[NextLevel]

Here is an example of a 2500 player struggling with a topspin serve, usually short, but in a variety of locations. The penholder is almost always serving topspin.

 

[AlexTax]

That's the video i was looking for!I can almost see myself when the flip just goes outside the table.If you were the coach of this player what would you suggest him?

 

[NextLevel]

That's the video i was looking for!I can almost see myself when the flip just goes outside the table.If you were the coach of this player what would you suggest him?

The opponent was 200 pts higher and had beaten world #50 Quadri Aruna three weeks before this tournament. But let us look at how another player handled the same serve - that might give us a clue on what to do.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

The opponent was 200 pts higher and had beaten world #50 Quadri Aruna three weeks before this tournament. But let us look at how another player handled the same serve - that might give us a clue on what to do.

Nice to see how much the returns vary in this once. Mostly flips varying placement or full loops. But he pushes every so often to change the rhythm too.


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[TT4Life]

Zaman is a top player from my club he was over 2600 USATT rating but got his back hurt for a while now just getting back into things. Former Iranian national team too, very good guy.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Zaman is a top player from my club he was over 2600 USATT rating but got his back hurt for a while now just getting back into things. Former Iranian national team too, very good guy.

Well, his receive of serve is pretty darn good.


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