Serve: Which is backspin & which is topspin?

[vytas]

I have been practising disguising my serve and feel I am able to make the two serves backspin and topslook very similar now.

Dan let me upload the video to his youtube channel so we could embed the clip on here. So the question is, which serve do you think is backspin and which serve do you think is topspin?

Vote in the poll which one you think is the backspin serve, the first or the second. I will let you guys know in a week which is correct

Discuss!

 

[TTournaments]

You could make a short tutorial how you did it! I'm very interested in knowing your technique! BTW First one is backspin, other one topspin!

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

You have to show the flight of the ball. The angle of the camera is pretty bad and the quality of the film is kind of bad. I was trying to watch the arc of the ball after contact and you cannot really see it. It does look like the second one is probably topspin and the first under. But because you cannot see the contact that well and you cannot see the flight of the ball which is cut off, it is hard to tell. In real life you would have a much better view. And if this was filmed decently you would see the flight of the ball much better.

 

[JustAlt]

You have to show the flight of the ball. The angle of the camera is pretty bad and the quality of the film is kind of bad. I was trying to watch the arc of the ball after contact and you cannot really see it. It does look like the second one is probably topspin and the first under. But because you cannot see the contact that well and you cannot see the flight of the ball which is cut off, it is hard to tell. In real life you would have a much better view. And if this was filmed decently you would see the flight of the ball much better.

I think the point of the video was to not show the flight of the ball. Everyone can easily see the spin from the flight of the ball. If not the first time of watching, you can replay it as many times as you want. No challenge that way. You can't press replay in real life and many times if you only know the spin after the second bounce it can be too late for a quality return.

I think he is doing quite good job in making the serves look the same. I would like to know however how big difference in spin is there between the two variations? Obviously mostly sidespin, but how much backspin and topspin is there? The difference doesn't even need to be big with good deception though. Anyways I too think the first one is backspin.

 

[Persistence TT]

1st backspin 2nd topspin , both with a bit of side on them. 2nd one is more like a sidetopserve. I found it without replaying the video

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Both service is illegal, lol
Just get your arm away faster, or there is a purpose for it to be there
First one is underspin.
Your 2nd one is easy to give away, as your contact is too hard. Try and soften the contact with a soft wrist, and also try and contact the ball closer towards the edge of the bat and not in the centre.

 

[Der_Echte]

Both service is illegal, lol
Just get your arm away faster, or there is a purpose for it to be there
First one is underspin.
Your 2nd one is easy to give away, as your contact is too hard. Try and soften the contact with a soft wrist, and also try and contact the ball closer towards the edge of the bat and not in the centre.

1) is... Underspin

I looked at the first serve and at the point where the ball was falling to his chin level, the forearm was still in front of body parallel to table hiding the impact point. On 1/10 second before impact did the arm move enough to show the impact from the BH corner area. Camera looked like it was just set on table without tripod. Dude, get a 3 Euro mini tripod that will give you 10 cm of lift and that will do wonders. Maybe the vid should be titled which serve was hidden the most until just before impact. It would be a photo finish thing. You would get away with that serve in Korea as anything goes there in Amature TT, but in N.A. you would have a certified umpire up your tail in a hurry... if you were in a match vs me. Remember, the arm must be immediately removed form the area between the impact and the player, your free arm and hand were remaining in that area until just before impact on those serves.

 

[Dan]

Haha good times, I remember playing against these serves of yours Vytas! Looking trickier! You need to do a tutorial for us on how to make the spin this deceptive

 

[vytas]

dont use these words against me man, i forgot English lingo so its been that long..but we could think of some slow motion at least;]

 

[Der_Echte]

vytas... Your English is absolutely outstanding for a non-native and knowing Dan gives you a lot of street cred.

 

[TurboZ]

I think the second one is backspin but I always have trouble returning these serves and guess wrong.

 

[guybr50]

If he can prove that those really are two different serves. Then he is really good!

 

[Spinandspeed]

What's right?

 

[tsunami902]

Just focus your attention to the color of the rubber as he executed those serviced. RED then BLACK. Figure it out.

 

[Der_Echte]

vytas, I caught a lot of grief when I showed a vid of a not so serious match vs a Korean old school J-Pen dude and no one knew I cheer the same way for him and the O50 yr old ladies when they make a powerful FH. Maybe where you play everyone hides the ball blatantly with a Capital B.

 

[Der_Echte]

If he can prove that those really are two different serves. Then he is really good!

I think Dan can personally vouch for those. It is a matter of blade angle and direction at impact. It is made easier when your service motion is a little long, smooth, fast, and similar swing plane. With such a consistent back swing and service motion, it takes feel and timing to pull it off. It is not something we all do right away without a lot of practice. You could also place a rebound board with a rubber glued on to see the type and amount of spin. It is sometimes a tool used by top amatures and some professionals to learn this.

If you are on your own and do NOT want to construct a return board out of need or boredome... consider laying down a towel on the other end and you will see well enough how much spin you made on serve in practice. Also, if you are not able to get on a table, try sitting or standing on a wood floor away from table and cut under the ball fast and thin and see if you can make ball go out a meter or two and roll back to you.

If your TT table is mixed in a room with billiards tables like in some rec centers, then do something visually impressive while you wait for the table by standing on one end of billiards table doing a serve (table is about same height anyway) and make ball go all the way near other end and spin back quickly.

That is one impressive trick for the rec center crowd, they will think you are top dog, even if it is simple enough to learn after a while...

 

[Persistence TT]

Both service is illegal, lol
Just get your arm away faster, or there is a purpose for it to be there
First one is underspin.
Your 2nd one is easy to give away, as your contact is too hard. Try and soften the contact with a soft wrist, and also try and contact the ball closer towards the edge of the bat and not in the centre.

yeap the free hand must be removed! the regulation is clear, nothing can block the view between the receiver's eyes to the ball and the paddle