SpinSight users post your experience and reviews

[Caravenav]

I think the rubber manufacturers still don't realise how this system could impact sales. If Spinsight becomes popular and players realise the difference between new and old rubber, they will start buying more material. On the other hand, customers will have a real tool with which to test the performance and quality vs price of different equipment. If the big brands (Butterfly, DHS, Stiga, etc.) understood that, they would develop a similar system. Or maybe they don't want to show customers that they can get the same performance from another brand for 50% less of the price?

 

[Zezima]

Perhaps we shouldn’t care about those small benefits in spin, but you have a wider range of spin available to use. If you can vary the spin within those wider margins it is likely that your opponent has to make an additional range of adjustments to return the ball.
How much difference the adjustment is ?? how does 5% extra spin on a serve relate to a serve receive?? I’m not sure!!
When playing, you can’t say ‘I’m going to push the ball with 5% or 10% less spin’ you can make an estimation.
I just think that having a larger range of spin available is better than having less!!!

You mentioned FZD’s speed and placement of shots, the spin and speed sort of go together, the spin brings the ball onto the table, and kicks the ball forward. The ‘kick’ is usually more noticeable on slower shots but is still there on faster balls. What we don’t really see is the levels of spin the Pro’s can put on the ball, to do that you need to be on the receiving end!!

I am not gonna volunteer to be as the receiver vs FZD when the topspins is all I am gonna say haha

 

[NextLevel]

Perhaps we shouldn’t care about those small benefits in spin, but you have a wider range of spin available to use. If you can vary the spin within those wider margins it is likely that your opponent has to make an additional range of adjustments to return the ball.
How much difference the adjustment is ?? how does 5% extra spin on a serve relate to a serve receive?? I’m not sure!!
When playing, you can’t say ‘I’m going to push the ball with 5% or 10% less spin’ you can make an estimation.
I just think that having a larger range of spin available is better than having less!!!

You mentioned FZD’s speed and placement of shots, the spin and speed sort of go together, the spin brings the ball onto the table, and kicks the ball forward. The ‘kick’ is usually more noticeable on slower shots but is still there on faster balls. What we don’t really see is the levels of spin the Pro’s can put on the ball, to do that you need to be on the receiving end!!

After using Spinsight, I went back to watch this video which I saw a few months back. It is insightful if you have the right predisposition.

 

[Tyce]

Spin is more than just "giving the most amount". Maybe even more important is how much spin you can handle, overcome, and if you can consistently use high levels of spin even in bad positions.
Say your serves are 50rps measured at the net, were they 100 before the first bounce and braking rapidly? Or 60 and retaining through the right impact?

 

[Dr Evil]

I think the rubber manufacturers still don't realise how this system could impact sales. If Spinsight becomes popular and players realise the difference between new and old rubber, they will start buying more material...

Absolutely. Performance starts to decline from first use and becomes significant for some rubber after only a few hours (e.g., every hybrid I've tried including 09C). Peak performance almost certainly tends to be better for more expensive rubber, but average performance over its lifetime on your blade might very well be significantly better for cheaper rubber that you replace more often.

 

[OvrChkn]

I think matters will be about what those extra revs give you. Because there were extra revs on 09c and 03 vs 80 but what does that mean and how is that compensated for by 80s speed? but it wasn't like out of the world extra revs, maybe 5% and what does 5% mean in a TT match? The practical implications are likely significant but we will have to do more to find out what it means for each of us.

Is there a way for a user to log historical data and export it? If users have access to a .csv or any type of data export, we could use that for any side analysis (rubber vs rubber comparison for example).

 

[NextLevel]

Is there a way for a user to log historical data and export it? If users have access to a .csv or any type of data export, we could use that for any side analysis (rubber vs rubber comparison for example).

Haven't investigated that deeply yet.

 

[banbekas]

I have to say, it’s fascinating to see that the amount of spin you can impart on the ball ends up being roughly the same, despite using different rubbers and blades. In other words, it really comes down to technique rather than just equipment.

I’m now even more interested to see the amount of spin a well-boosted H3 can produce, since many believe it generates the highest rotation compared to other rubbers.

Funnily enough, given how poor our footwork is, softer rubbers are probably the best option for us to impart the highest amount of spin, regardless of positioning. Those who swear by H3 would likely see immediate improvement by switching to softer rubbers.

 

[NextLevel]

I have to say, it’s fascinating to see that the amount of spin you can impart on the ball ends up being roughly the same, despite using different rubbers and blades. In other words, it really comes down to technique rather than just equipment.

I’m now even more interested to see the amount of spin a well-boosted H3 can produce, since many believe it generates the highest rotation compared to other rubbers.

Funnily enough, given how poor our footwork is, softer rubbers are probably the best option for us to impart the highest amount of spin, regardless of positioning. Those who swear by H3 would likely see immediate improvement by switching to softer rubbers.

I was focused on spin in a loop to block, but I suspect in the context of match play, a few other variables such as consistency, ball speed and how much my ball troubles the opponent might have impact as well. Because generating a lot of rotation on a ball that doesn't hit the table is like one-hand clapping in the forest in a real match. Also, all the rubbers were in roughly the same class except Dignics 80, which was somewhat behind the others when I tested it but not by so much that I felt I was a different player. That said, I should have a better opportunity to test again on Sunday.

 

[merlin el mago]

Very interesting thread I will follow with interest.

 

[Deep74]

Is spinsight even available in uk? I looked on app and doesn’t work in uk and on website uk isn’t listed as country it’s compatible which is strange considering TTD are advertising it and also Craig Bryant

 

[dingyibvs]

I dont think rating cares about your quality of spin. Especially not the 10-15%.

Consider 2 players and tell me who is more likely to win:
Both around the same age (experience wise) ->
Player A: anticipates better -> gets into position (good footwork) -> pressures with that Topspin
Player B: anticipates worse and/or bad footwork (standing still) -> is forced to do an awkward or more passive shot back and doesn't really actively force his opponent into errors.

ofc there are more variables such as placement of your shots, how good you can block (active good placement blocks) etc. but in the grand scheme and thats my point is at a certain quality (and I consider 100+) the placement of your shots is more important than hitting 10% with more spin.

When I watched FZD he made his points mostly with placement and speed of the balls. Who cares about the spin on the ball if you can't even get to hit the ball?

So should we really care about those small benefits in spin?

How sure are you about that though? I certainly have a waaaaay easier time blocking 110s level loops than 120's, and that's in a practice setting so placement doesn't come into play. I mean, obviously placement is very important too, but I wouldn't underestimate the difference of say 10% in spin.

I'm actually wondering if we're misinterpreting the data. Many seem to think we're overestimating the differences between equipment, I wonder if we're actually underestimating what a few percentage differences in speed and spin does to our game?

 

[NextLevel]

How sure are you about that though? I certainly have a waaaaay easier time blocking 110s level loops than 120's, and that's in a practice setting so placement doesn't come into play. I mean, obviously placement is very important too, but I wouldn't underestimate the difference of say 10% in spin.

I'm actually wondering if we're misinterpreting the data. Many seem to think we're overestimating the differences between equipment, I wonder if we're actually underestimating what a few percentage differences in speed and spin does to our game?

We just started this journey, we have ways to go. An example, one off my regular practice partners who is a lefty has strong serves and a good forehand drive/smash. He can loop backspin, but his loop is inconsistent. With spinsight, we could see that his topspin never broke 100 rps. I mean never, This is a 1700+ rated player. his opponent, roughly 1500-1600, broke 100 quite a few times, especially on forehand but a few on backhand. He likes to push a lot, and I made fun of the fact that the person who has the spin likes to push and the person who likes to attack lacks the spin. It gave them both developmental projects.

I know I am limited by my legs, but I am going to test the impact of using longer moment arms to loop again. Also going to more aggressively do my physical work for both my arms and legs and core. Data gives you targets.

BTW, we used rubbers largely in the same top of the line range and focused on spin. We didn't look at many other variables.,

 

[TampaBayTableTennis]

you guys are using it with the extender that clips to the net post? ill have to get this set up sometime

 

[NextLevel]

you guys are using it with the extender that clips to the net post? ill have to get this set up sometime

yes - I will try and buy the tripod sometime soon as well as some nets suck...

 

[ajtatosmano2]

I am sure that spin and speed works together producing quality. The easiest to play against players for me are usually the people who play with (moderately) high spin + medium speed. Low speed + high spin is much harder to time well. High speed is just generally harder. If someone plays without much spin it's harder to generate it yourself, so you have to be more careful. But with extreme spin it's difficult again.

The hardest to handle player whom I've practiced with was an athletic, around 2200 TTR level player. His shots are HEAVY. I am sure you know the feeling, when the ball literally kicks your hand. Further away it was very hard to counterloop, you have to really work to lift it over the net and drops like crazy after bounce.

 

[Zezima]

How sure are you about that though? I certainly have a waaaaay easier time blocking 110s level loops than 120's, and that's in a practice setting so placement doesn't come into play. I mean, obviously placement is very important too, but I wouldn't underestimate the difference of say 10% in spin.

I'm actually wondering if we're misinterpreting the data. Many seem to think we're overestimating the differences between equipment, I wonder if we're actually underestimating what a few percentage differences in speed and spin does to our game?

How can you say that? Because spinsight has a errror tolerance of +-5%?

also if your opp gets to hit a 120 rps topspin even if you happen to block one he will mostlikely win the game anyway.

Also there is a different value I believe it was called spin factor. But again we are in early stages to interpret data in terms of what actually matters the most.

 

[IB66]

Is spinsight even available in uk? I looked on app and doesn’t work in uk and on website uk isn’t listed as country it’s compatible which is strange considering TTD are advertising it and also Craig Bryant

No, not yet available. Hopefully they are working on getting things sorted so UK players can use the App.

 

[songdavid98]

Many seem to think we're overestimating the differences between equipment, I wonder if we're actually underestimating what a few percentage differences in speed and spin does to our game?

Both are true.

You guys care about equipment way too much.
And 10% more spin matters a lot.

 

[vossi39]

How can you say that? Because spinsight has a errror tolerance of +-5%?

Still wondering, what is meant here.

Is the 5% for each measurement? Meaning if I consistantly hit for 100 rps, I get sometime 95 and sometimes 105. In the same setup? That would be strange and would not match what the video posted has shown. The measurements there in the same setup were pretty consistent.

I would assume that the +-5% is for different measurement setups. Let's assume you setup the measurement, do your rounds then dismount and come back the next day for another measurement and setup the whole thing again. For this scenario the differences sound reasonable to me.