What Causes This To Happen?

[SchemeSC]

Hey everyone,

What are some of the root causes of the right foot jumping forward on a FH Loop and throwing a player out of position?

Here is my normal FH Loop:

Let me just say that I am not overly concerned about this issue. In general I would say that my FH loop technique is about 99% as good as it's ever going to be. But, I am going to be working hard on improving my transition between FH/BH in the coming months, so I would like to at least have an intellectual understanding of the root cause of this. My current theory is that it happens as a result of being too far from the table and hitting the ball forward of the optimal point of contact, which in turn causes me to rely too much on forward momentum rather than rotation. But I would be curious to hear if anyone else has any thoughts.

Again, my rating is a bit under 1800 so I understand this is probably obsessing over a minute technical detail. I'm mostly just posting this question more out of curiousity and fun than anything else.

Hopefully the gifs run smoothly on your computers.

I do see my right foot crossing over fairly in matches and match type drills, however.

 

[ttmonster]

Your technique is perfect for your level, I would not worry about it too much. This is my opinion , others will probably chime in with more technical details, correct me if I am wrong the first ball had more underspin and it was shorter than the second ball. If that is correct , you are trying to put more power and reaching out a a tiny winy bit more in the first gif. I would suggest take a small step/hop like a towards the ball before the shot when you read it to be shorter in case it is shorter and you should be able to mimic your optimal technique in the first case. This is all true in theory but difficult in practice. If you can get some old penholders to block for you in single ball exercises, they can help you rectify this quickly.

 

[thekleifheit13]

My foot does the exact same thing when looping heavy underspin. My best guess, and I know you're probably not looking for speculation here, is that it has to do with raising your playing shoulder to create the extra vertical velocity needed to overcome the underspin on the ball. Looking forward to seeing what some others have to say here.

 

[Archosaurus]

Our strokes are somewhat similar, so I think I can offer something. Your stroke is very good for your level, by the way.

Most likely, as ttmonster has said, the ball is a tiny bit short and you have read it correctly and are reacting to it, but not in a desirable way. Your timing appears correct, but you're a tiny bit too far away. I'm often guilty of this. Consciously work on taking a small hop towards the ball and striking it from the same point as always, and I think this will fix itself.

It's probably not a fault with your normal technique, because it's quite good based on what you have shown. Good job.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

You use a lot more power from your hips in the first one and more rotational force and if you just watch the right hip and its followthrough on the first one you can see, as it rotates it pulls your right leg and foot along with it. I don't think there is much wrong with it given how much backspin the coach put on that particular feed. You can see the feed is loaded.

And on the second one there looks to be less backspin so you time your hips nicely and the hip motion is much more compact with less rotation and the power is transferred across your pelvic structure into your left leg instead of having the rotational force that is there in the first gif.

BTW, the two contact points look fairly similar to me, so I am not sure it has to do with reaching. But there is much more rotation from the core and hips in the first one.


Sent from Deep Space by Abacus

 

[Archosaurus]

@Carl

He begins at roughly the same position in both, but there is a little more sidespin and the ball is traveling more towards him in the 2nd gif.

I do not believe the problem is reaching out of position and causing a bad stroke, but instead reacting to the slightly different placement.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Yeah. The first ball is wider so he has to adjust laterally a bit. But his contact point is very similar.

I could be wrong. But to me it looks simply like he uses more power from the hips and core in the first one and it translates into rotation from the hips.

In the second one he uses a well timed pop from the hips to transfer the weight through the pelvic structure into the left leg. But I think part of why is that he swings with much more force from the hips and core in the first one.

Either way, both seem like pretty decent strokes vs backspin. The second one will be a bit harder to recover from. But, on heavier backspin, when you need to swing harder, that happens.

Sent from Deep Space by Abacus

 

[ttmonster]

I looked at it multiple times, what I saw was that the contact point is slightly later and away from the body and he is trying to wrap around the ball a little more , even though the eventual ball placement from the stroke remains identical .

If you can reach it earlier , can is the operative word here , you will find out that you can use the power from the feeder and won't need to use as much power from your hips/legs to get the desired result .

Again, the difference here is very slight and they are multiple balls in each GIFs. I am using the maximum deviation between the two GIFs to make my observations.

Yeah. The first ball is wider so he has to adjust laterally a bit. But his contact point is very similar.

I could be wrong. But to me it looks simply like he uses more power from the hips and core in the first one and it translates into rotation from the hips.

In the second one he uses a well timed pop from the hips to transfer the weight through the pelvic structure into the left leg. But I think part of why is that he swings with much more force from the hips and core in the first one.

Either way, both seem like pretty decent strokes vs backspin. The second one will be a bit harder to recover from. But, on heavier backspin, when you need to swing harder, that happens.

Sent from Deep Space by Abacus

 

[Archosaurus]

I agree with ttmonster.

I would not exactly say that what is happening in the 1st gif is wrong, but it's just being executed in an undesirable way due to unfavorable body positioning.