WTT Champions Frankfurt 2024

[AutomaticBackhand]

Is LSD a prodigy? Or was fzd also playing this level at age 19?

FZDs teammates were better, more consistent and played more.

LSDs only significant victory over a teammate was that he beat Ma Long 4-3 at China Smash so far.
Beating XP, LJK, LGY as the next upcoming Chinese star is not "spectacular".

Beating WCQ doesn't mean much in recent times.

He would need to beat FZD in an important match now to be considered a special "prodigy".

Imo, he's expected to be winning like this and it's the fact that his teammates are not living up to the usual Chinese standard which makes him stand out.

Part of his advantage is that he is young and mentally much more mature and stronger than e.g. WCQ.

The dense tournament schedule doesn't "bother" him as much as other players, he can recover quickly and hasn't been playing non-stop on the international circuit for 2 years straight now like his CN Teammates or his other counterparts like Harimoto, LYJ, Moregard etc..

 

[NetProphet]

Lin Shidong is just too good for anyone right now.

He looks that way when he plays like this but to frame it all it has to be said that there are very fine margins between a lot of his victories and a narrow loss.
I thought Felix looked the same 2 wks ago when he blew LSD away 4-0 (Felix broke him and won the last set 11-3) but then Truls did the same to Felix here in FF 3-1.
LSD has to play almost faultless table tennis to win what he has, and he can do it because he's just that good.
But it's great to see that if his performance drops even a little there are a bunch of savage and hungry players ready to take him out!

The only player I can see matching him at his current level is a bang on form FZD and that's unlikely to happen this year cos I can see a rusty FZD arriving at the T16 Finals 🤷
And that's where LSD will receive the acid test. Four, best of 7 matches where he has to overcome the likes of LJY, FZD, Felix, Truls, Hugo, Ma Long, Harimoto in every round.
To keep his level for that extended run of games is the next challenge and to not get blown away on an off day.
I guess I'm just getting excited about the T16 in Nov cos it's a superb playing field at the moment really... looking too good for everyone on a given day is possible for a lot of these T16 players and come Nov 20 anything could still happen.
Pretty great stuff for us watching!

 

[NetProphet]

For men, China is really luck to find a young LSD who has just entered his prime and his playing level is so high that few of the pros can really threaten him when he is fresh and play at his normal level.

Not just that though. If Ma Long and FZD were here you'd have been odds on for a men's all China final also, so the China men's team, they're not as weak in my eyes as some are suggesting recently.

 

[NetProphet]

Our potential is higher than that of chinese.

It will show soon!

Peace.

Who is 'Our'?
Rest of the world?

 

[latej]

Who is 'Our'?
Rest of the world?

Yeah, as I said, it was out of frustration, sorry. There is no rest of the world. There is no spoon.

I just admire the uncompromising approach of A.K. and WCQ more. In case of WCQ it almost feels like he is incapable of doing anything else... And I admire that too, very much... For me, his FH is the best, even better than ML's... But you know what TT is about, it's not about the FH, it's not about the beauty... Cheers.... And, LSD is fantastic, admirable, it's just me, I wish someone wins the other way ;-) Peace.

 

[NetProphet]

Yeah, as I said, it was out of frustration, sorry. There is no rest of the world. There is no spoon.

I just admire the uncompromising approach of A.K. and WCQ more. In case of WCQ it almost feels like he is incapable of doing anything else... And I admire that too, very much... For me, his FH is the best, even better than ML's... But you know what TT is about, it's not about the FH, it's not about the beauty... Cheers.... And, LSD is fantastic, admirable, it's just me, I wish someone wins the other way ;-) Peace.

Ah, cool.
There are a few posts I haven't read so I didn't see you'd answered this already👍

 

[NextLevel]

He looks that way when he plays like this but to frame it all it has to be said that there are very fine margins between a lot of his victories and a narrow loss.
I thought Felix looked the same 2 wks ago when he blew LSD away 4-0 (Felix broke him and won the last set 11-3) but then Truls did the same to Felix here in FF 3-1.
LSD has to play almost faultless table tennis to win what he has, and he can do it because he's just that good.
But it's great to see that if his performance drops even a little there are a bunch of savage and hungry players ready to take him out!

The only player I can see matching him at his current level is a bang on form FZD and that's unlikely to happen this year cos I can see a rusty FZD arriving at the T16 Finals 🤷
And that's where LSD will receive the acid test. Four, best of 7 matches where he has to overcome the likes of LJY, FZD, Felix, Truls, Hugo, Ma Long, Harimoto in every round.
To keep his level for that extended run of games is the next challenge and to not get blown away on an off day.
I guess I'm just getting excited about the T16 in Nov cos it's a superb playing field at the moment really... looking too good for everyone on a given day is possible for a lot of these T16 players and come Nov 20 anything could still happen.
Pretty great stuff for us watching!

I think he still has to show that he matches up well with Harimoto and Felix. He also hasn't played the revamped Moregardh.

 

[TampaBayTableTennis]

exciting times!!!

 

[NetProphet]

I think he still has to show that he matches up well with Harimoto and Felix. He also hasn't played the revamped Moregardh.

Yup
And the proof of that is for anyone to watch Felix V LSD in Montpellier and Truls V Felix on Wednesday.
Styles and tactics aside those performances levels were absolutely at a measure that would stretch LSD, or anyone for that matter.
It is amazing how LSD has been doing it so consistently though, the last 4 months have been pretty epic!
If Truls could get half of that consistency he'd have a title this year...

 

[NextLevel]

Yup
And the proof of that is for anyone to watch Felix V LSD in Montpellier and Truls V Felix on Wednesday.
Styles and tactics aside those performances levels were absolutely at a measure that would stretch LSD, or anyone for that matter.
It is amazing how LSD has been doing it so consistently though, the last 4 months have been pretty epic!
If Truls could get half of that consistency he'd have a title this year...

Waldner was also a big game player, it can be easy to forget this. Nothing wrong with only performing well at the biggest tournaments even if unfortunately you aren't winning the titles.

 

[ThePongCommenter]

The g is pronounced with a j sound. You can hear it 20 seconds into this video.

Timestamp 00:55

 

[ThePongCommenter]

Is LSD a prodigy? Or was fzd also playing this level at age 19?

Was FZD not also a prodigy?

 

[TensorBackhand]

Was FZD not also a prodigy?

I don't know. I didn't follow Table Tennis when he was 19. That's why I am asking. I'm trying to understand whether LSD is doing something unprecedented on the Chinese team or whether he is following a path of former Chinese top players

 

[NetProphet]

Timestamp 00:55

Brilliant!
At.3:00 he explains what was said during the timeout after which everything changed!
I remarked on this timeout after the match and was wondering what the hell they'd said to him that led to the turnaround.
Congratulations to Truls Moregard on some great advice! 🤯

 

[NetProphet]

I don't know. I didn't follow Table Tennis when he was 19. That's why I am asking. I'm trying to understand whether LSD is doing something unprecedented on the Chinese team or whether he is following a path of former Chinese top players

I would think they both fit into the category of Prodigy, Fan was on the CNT at 14 so they knew it early with him also.
But LSDs winning streak is unprecedented for a 19 yr old although the landscape is different now it terms of Tournaments, WTT and appearances etc so we'll never know what a 19yr old Fan could have done in the same environment but his record in Asia at the time is something I'm interested to look at now - it's a good question for comparison.

 

[TensorBackhand]

I would think they both fit into the category of Prodigy, Fan was on the CNT at 14 so they knew it early with him also.
But LSDs winning streak is unprecedented for a 19 yr old although the landscape is different now it terms of Tournaments, WTT and appearances etc so we'll never know what a 19yr old Fan could have done in the same environment but his record in Asia at the time is something I'm interested to look at now - it's a good question for comparison.

How about other greats like ZJK and Ma Long? How old were they when they broke into the top 1 or 2?

 

[der Stift]

Hmm, if you put it that way, then China has been lucky for decades since 容國團/Jung Kuo-Tuan/Rong Guotuan, who was born in Hong Kong but refused to play for the Brits. 谷愛淩/Gu Ailing/Eileen Gu is kind of like that, born in the US but chose to represent China after competing for the US 2 times.

Likewise, the Harimoto siblings, who were born in Japan (no citizenship by birth), were still Chinese citizens by nationality until they chose to represent Japan (which required citizenship) in 2014. Tieba users have been feeling sorry for Miwa's brother and brainstorming for a solution...

日本男乒团体人员还有更好选择吗？ (Are there any better choices for Japan's men's team?)
https://tieba.baidu.com/p/9244518916

Hmm, if you put it that way, then China has been lucky for decades since 容國團/Jung Kuo-Tuan/Rong Guotuan, who was born in Hong Kong but refused to play for the Brits. 谷愛淩/Gu Ailing/Eileen Gu is kind of like that, born in the US but chose to represent China after competing for the US 2 times.

Likewise, the Harimoto siblings, who were born in Japan (no citizenship by birth), were still Chinese citizens by nationality until they chose to represent Japan (which required citizenship) in 2014. Tieba users have been feeling sorry for Miwa's brother and brainstorming for a solution...

日本男乒团体人员还有更好选择吗？ (Are there any better choices for Japan's men's team?)
https://tieba.baidu.com/p/9244518916

容國團 was more than "lucky" to use a Wilson shakehand bat
to play as penhold and won the World Championship in 1959 to
start in all 😁

 

[NextLevel]

For me, all this tournament and ranking stuff is cool, but WTTC performance is the benchmark.

 

[rpb23]

Was FZD not also a prodigy?

Absolutely, FZD was a prodigy. He was more of a prodigy than LSD at earlier age. At age 16, he already was treated as top of pipeline backing up to the core member of ML, ZJK and XX bypassing more seasoned players like Fang Bo, Yan An, Zhou Yu etc. FZD's rise plus the growth of LGY and LJK directly pushed the above mentioned seasoned players into early retirement.

Compared to FZD, LSD's game at 19 is more mature and polished. At 19 FZD was already well known, but LSD caught everyone's attention only after the current great run during which he played non-stop 7 events, won 5, runner-up 1 and reaching semi 1, plus all mixed doubles he played, truly historical.

 

[M51]

FZD was monster at 16. So much so, that many were skeptical about his age, there were even discussions about it in these forums IIRC.