WTT Contender Doha 2024
- Thread starter Metaxa
- Start date
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Active Member
I tried to watch the match via the horrible live stream. Shame on WTT!
Let me clarify, I am neither anti Harimoto nor at all pro Tomokazu.
What that boy has achieved at a very young age is phenomenal, meanwhile he has stagnated a bit and even had a much lesser period. As far as I can see, he also has another coach which is not a bad step in his further development. But...I fear that he will one day be able to win a major (read as an individual world championship or Olympic medal). It is what it is, that boy has his limitations and these will never be able to be improved to such an extent that he is going to be superior to some Chinese players.
When the first point fell in the final set of Timo's comeback, I already knew that Tomo was going to lose out. An old hand like the left-handed Timo (left-handers always remain a difficult cliff to get around) will not be easily sidelined. Besides, you shouldn't play diagonal balls to infinity against a left-hander. Those already have several million diagonally trained ball changes experience...play a ball parallel I would say and see what the consequences are.
Honour still prevails with such older seasoned players. Did you see how he stepped from the table to his coach after finishing the match? You could clearly see that after all these years his body was almost "used up".
Now should Togami have been in the final we would probably have had a different winner, for the simple reason that he has an even better aggressive game than Tomo but mainly because his reaction ability is a lot better and it has also improved a lot in his head compared to last year. We are not far off from Togami becoming the No 1 in the Japanese team I think.
Let me clarify, I am neither anti Harimoto nor at all pro Tomokazu.
What that boy has achieved at a very young age is phenomenal, meanwhile he has stagnated a bit and even had a much lesser period. As far as I can see, he also has another coach which is not a bad step in his further development. But...I fear that he will one day be able to win a major (read as an individual world championship or Olympic medal). It is what it is, that boy has his limitations and these will never be able to be improved to such an extent that he is going to be superior to some Chinese players.
When the first point fell in the final set of Timo's comeback, I already knew that Tomo was going to lose out. An old hand like the left-handed Timo (left-handers always remain a difficult cliff to get around) will not be easily sidelined. Besides, you shouldn't play diagonal balls to infinity against a left-hander. Those already have several million diagonally trained ball changes experience...play a ball parallel I would say and see what the consequences are.
Honour still prevails with such older seasoned players. Did you see how he stepped from the table to his coach after finishing the match? You could clearly see that after all these years his body was almost "used up".
Now should Togami have been in the final we would probably have had a different winner, for the simple reason that he has an even better aggressive game than Tomo but mainly because his reaction ability is a lot better and it has also improved a lot in his head compared to last year. We are not far off from Togami becoming the No 1 in the Japanese team I think.
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Member
WTT continues to have s....t video production. The video team cannot figure out that when there is a LH player, they need to change the camera angles so we are not looking mostly at the LH players back blocking the action. This is the kind of thing that is taught in a basic video production class in high school.
LYJ vs Timo SF was doubly bad with two LH players.
LYJ vs Timo SF was doubly bad with two LH players.
says
toooooo much choice!!
says
toooooo much choice!!
Well-Known Member
says
toooooo much choice!!
says
toooooo much choice!!
Well-Known Member
As far as Harimoto is concerned, How can you slag this fella off? ok maybe about the load shouting!! but he has won, is likely to win again, there are WAY WAY more players that will NEVER win a tournament at this level.
The Hype in Japan when he was younger must have been like THE Hype here in England that hangs around our National Football / Soccer team, or the Royal Family.
It's just pretty dam hard to win tournaments at the highest levels, look at Mens Tennis, dominated by 2, 3 or 4 players, usually spanning 1 to 2 decades!! with an occasional wild card win thrown in for good measure!!!
And you thought Boll was the underdog? - as did almost everyone - form not good - no pressure then. 20+ years of experience playing at the top level, Ranked world no1 on 3 different occasions I believe, He really wanted to prove a point!!!
Sure Boll is 42yrs old, so it means even more to him now than it ever did. He is running out of time.
Sure Harimoto was up, and looking like winning. How many times have we all been up in points in a few games only to piss it away!!!
I just hope that both Boll, Harimoto and all the other players keep striving to be the best, and win some tournaments, Throw a cat amongst the pigeons, Nah, throw some CATS amongst the pigeons, BIG ONES WITH BIG POINTY TEETH AND A MEAN DISPOSITION.
The Hype in Japan when he was younger must have been like THE Hype here in England that hangs around our National Football / Soccer team, or the Royal Family.
It's just pretty dam hard to win tournaments at the highest levels, look at Mens Tennis, dominated by 2, 3 or 4 players, usually spanning 1 to 2 decades!! with an occasional wild card win thrown in for good measure!!!
And you thought Boll was the underdog? - as did almost everyone - form not good - no pressure then. 20+ years of experience playing at the top level, Ranked world no1 on 3 different occasions I believe, He really wanted to prove a point!!!
Sure Boll is 42yrs old, so it means even more to him now than it ever did. He is running out of time.
Sure Harimoto was up, and looking like winning. How many times have we all been up in points in a few games only to piss it away!!!
I just hope that both Boll, Harimoto and all the other players keep striving to be the best, and win some tournaments, Throw a cat amongst the pigeons, Nah, throw some CATS amongst the pigeons, BIG ONES WITH BIG POINTY TEETH AND A MEAN DISPOSITION.
says
Shoo...nothing to see here. - zeio
Ahem, care to look up their results at Harimoto's age? Harimoto blows them both out of the water.
Waldner didn't get past the CNT players until he was 21.3 years old to reach the MS F of WTTC 1987. He didn't get 2 points off of China until he was 23.5 years old in the MT F of WTTC 1989. Also, he wasn't alone and didn't just have Persson, but also Appelgren and Karlsson.
ML lost to Boll and Samsonov on their first encounters in the majors, namely World Cup 2008, World Cup 2009 and WTTC 2010. He was losing a lot by CNT standard, which gave ZJK the opening and people who didn't know any better still assume to this day that he was robbed the singles spot for London 2012. Keep in mind he is the oldest to achieve Grand Slam at the ripe age of 27.8 years old. He won his first WTTC ONLY after WH retired, when he was 26.4 years old at WTTC 2015. He didn't win his first major until he was 23.9 years old at World Cup 2012 (not to forget ML 0-4 CCY in Grp, and if not for CCY 3-4 Crisan (instead of 0-4/1-4/2-4), he would've been out).
If only Harimoto had a TRUE teammate, he would've reached the MT F at Tokyo 2020. He got 2 points off of Germany all on his own. Niwa was as good as useless. Mizutani wasn't of much use either but at least he convinced me that he tried. Do I need to mention WTTC 2022?
Code:
Waldner Persson Samsonov ML LYJ Harimoto
----------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------ ------------------- -------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------
OG 1988 8th OG 1988 7th OG 1996 QF OG 2016 W OG 2020 4th 3-4 Ovtcharov (SF 3-4 FZD) OG 2020 R16 3-4 Jorgic
OG 1992 W OG 1992 QF OG 2000 QF OG 2020 W --------- ---------
OG 1996 R16 OG 1996 Lost 1st stage OG 2004 R16 --------- WTTC 2019 R64 3-4 Gionis WTTC 2017 QF 1-4 XX
OG 2000 F OG 2000 4th OG 2008 R16 WTTC 2007 R16 2-4 JSH WTTC 2021 R32 3-4 LJH WTTC 2019 R16 2-4 AJH
OG 2004 4th OG 2004 R16 OG 2012 R16 WTTC 2009 SF WTTC 2023 R16 1-4 LGY WTTC 2021 R64 3-4 Dyjas
--------- OG 2008 4th --------- WTTC 2011 SF --------- WTTC 2023 QF 2-4 LJK
WTTC 1983 R16 OG 2012 R64 WTTC 1993 R16 WTTC 2013 SF WCup 2019 3rd 4-3 ML (SF 0-4 FZD) ---------
WTTC 1985 R32 --------- WTTC 1995 QF WTTC 2015 W WCup 2020 QF 2-4 FZD WCup 2018 QF 1-4 Boll
WTTC 1987 F WTTC 1985 R64 WTTC 1997 F WTTC 2017 W WCup 2019 F 2-4 FZD (SF 4-1 ML)
WTTC 1989 W WTTC 1987 R32 WTTC 1999 R16 WTTC 2019 W WCup 2020 3rd 4-3 JWJ (SF 3-1 -> 3-4 ML)
WTTC 1991 F WTTC 1989 F WTTC 2001 QF WTTC 2023 SF
WTTC 1993 SF WTTC 1991 W WTTC 2003 R16 ---------
WTTC 1995 R16 WTTC 1993 R128 WTTC 2005 R16 WCup 2008 3rd 4-1 Kreanga (SF 3-4 Boll)
WTTC 1997 W WTTC 1995 R16 WTTC 2007 QF WCup 2009 3rd 4-1 Oh Sangeun (SF 3-4 Samsonov, Grp 3-4 Oh Sangeun)
WTTC 1999 SF WTTC 1997 R64 WTTC 2009 R64 WCup 2012 W
WTTC 2001 R16 WTTC 1999 QF WTTC 2011 R16 WCup 2014 F
WTTC 2003 R128 WTTC 2001 R16 WTTC 2013 R16 WCup 2015 W
WTTC 2005 R32 WTTC 2003 R64 WTTC 2015 R16 WCup 2017 3rd
--------- WTTC 2005 R32 --------- WCup 2019 4th
WCup 1983 F (Cai Zhenhua and Jiang Jialiang crashed out in Grp) WTTC 2007 R64 WCup 1996 3rd WCup 2020 F
WCup 1984 5th WTTC 2009 R32 WCup 1997 3rd
WCup 1985 8th WTTC 2011 R64 WCup 1998 5-8th
WCup 1987 7th --------- WCup 1999 W
WCup 1988 6th WCup 1986 9th WCup 2000 9-12th
WCup 1989 15th WCup 1987 11th WCup 2001 W
WCup 1990 W WCup 1988 5th WCup 2004 9-12th
WCup 1991 3rd WCup 1989 11th WCup 2005 4th
WCup 1993 9-12th WCup 1991 W WCup 2006 4th
WCup 1994 F WCup 1995 9-12th WCup 2007 5-8th
WCup 1995 9-12th WCup 1996 9-12th WCup 2009 W
WCup 1996 F WCup 1999 4th WCup 2010 5-8th
WCup 1997 5-8th WCup 2000 5-8th WCup 2011 13-16th
WCup 1998 5-8th WCup 2012 3rd
WCup 1999 5-8th WCup 2013 F
WCup 2000 9-12th
WCup 2001 9-12th
WCup 2004 5-8th
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
It's amazing how the actual results tell such a different narrative from the eye tests and the internal narratives that drive us towards "excuses". Looking at this, we still have another 4-8 years before a realistic assessment of Harimoto is possible.
This user has no status.
Member
Man what a win for Timo. Two of my favorite players in the finals. I found myself cheering for Timo. Probably because I knew he wasn't going to have many more chances. Those serve returns and steady BH/FH transitions proved to be too much for the young man from Japan.
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
so according to your experience in Japan
did HT hype himself up, or was it the media?
who said he was the chosen one, did he said it?
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
And honestly he didn't seem boastful at the time. He was so young and was beating ZJK and too Chinese players. He seemed somewhat realistic at the time. Thats why he seemed like the Zion Williams of TT.
But either his speed dropped, or other players acclimated to his style, not sure, he doesn't seem to be able to win over CNT players like he used to.
But either his speed dropped, or other players acclimated to his style, not sure, he doesn't seem to be able to win over CNT players like he used to.
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
do you know how many people said they will be olympic champion? when you ask them what is your dream?
what I have learnt, media is very clever with clickbaits and would script up the interview to their advantage. Who doesn't want to tell a good story? well, at least that is what I see.
So what he is confident he would win the OG?
The South African players at WJTTC2016 all said they want to make it at least to the QF. They had that belief in them, work hard, but none succeed.
Do I go on for years to say they all doomed?
Its life, HT is not the only one that failed Tokyo gold medal,
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
tell me,
what came first,Tokyo 2020 (in 2021)
or the famous Chengdu world team champs that he beat 2 chinese players in the same session? for the upteenth time, we all are talking about it, but you are denying that it existed.
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
you don't get to see this too often, maybe never again.
beating 1 of them is possible, beating 2 of them... (wr 1 and wr 2), very very difficult.
Tell me TB, who else in the past 20 years had done that?
so HT is doomed after Tokyo OG?? As I said, i'm not a HT fan, but your dooming of him, is really just dooming unjust.
beating 1 of them is possible, beating 2 of them... (wr 1 and wr 2), very very difficult.
Tell me TB, who else in the past 20 years had done that?
so HT is doomed after Tokyo OG?? As I said, i'm not a HT fan, but your dooming of him, is really just dooming unjust.
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
No need to go back over the same statements over and over, so I'll just leave it as is.
I haven't doomed him, he can still be #1 someday. Just his trajectory has gone off.
says
Shoo...nothing to see here. - zeio
Hmm, you gotta cite a source for the "very confident" part. The most I've seen him say is "the target is 2 gold at Tokyo 2020" since 2018.
「東京五輪『金』2つ取る」張本誓う 全日本卓球V
ベテラン水谷破り王者に
https://www.nikkei.com/article/DGXMZO25966220S8A120C1CC1000/
【動画あり】張本智和「東京五輪、2つの金が目標」【卓球・Tリーグ開幕直前インタビュー#2】
https://youtu.be/9I3IZ0areJ0?t=92
https://rallys.online/topic/tleague/movie-harimoto/
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
haha, well, he had his best year, a year after tokyo, and now you claim from tokyo he has gone off
why you so quiet regarding the 2 wins on the same day against wr 1 and wr 2?
do you have auto filter on and can't see the result but see everything else?
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
Similar threads
