Is ma long the GOAT ?

[RidTheKid]

Carl, do you wanna se me hit a few fh?

There is no point discussing this subject with someone who doesn't understand the game well enough to know how spin can impact an opponent, who does not understand how an opponent can take away your strengths.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

What makes you so sure you're right? Can you back it up with actual sources or keep guessing?

I understand what you and NL are saying but I give it zero value. Food for thought: If you use same ball in all tournaments and your opponent who've beat you in smaller tournaments seem to play much worse in this big tournament, do you think it's because of the ball or nerves?

I could give you point by point analysis for WH vs ML semi final matches in 2011 and 2013 and you still would not get it because you don't understand the actual game.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Carl, do you wanna se me hit a few fh?

I would rather see you play a few matches against some LP players who are slightly higher level than you. That would show exactly what I am talking about and how yo would get brought out of your game by frustration in misreading spin.

 

[RidTheKid]

Please do

I could give you point by point analysis for WH vs ML semi final matches in 2011 and 2013 and you still would not get it because you don't understand the actual game.

 

[RidTheKid]

I'll try to make it happen. In the meantime, do you have a video of yourself playing?

I would rather see you play a few matches against some LP players who are slightly higher level than you. That would show exactly what I am talking about and how yo would get brought out of your game by frustration in misreading spin.

 

[RidTheKid]

And you think ML misread the spin on the ball in bigger tournaments but not in the smaller ones? Sounds plausible?

I would rather see you play a few matches against some LP players who are slightly higher level than you. That would show exactly what I am talking about and how yo would get brought out of your game by frustration in misreading spin.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

I'll try to make it happen. In the meantime, do you have a video of yourself playing?

This is the last footage I have of me. It is from several years ago. Not a match. Just warming up.

I will try and take one of the games from 2013 WTTC and give analysis later when I am off work.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

And you think ML misread the spin on the ball in bigger tournaments but not in the smaller ones? Sounds plausible?

I think WH pulled out some tricks that he knew were weaknesses of ML's from long observation and only used them on the big platform. Sound more plausible?

 

[RidTheKid]

You don't know me so stop with your assumptions, it makes you look insecure and ridiculous to be honest.

There is no point discussing this subject with someone who doesn't understand the game well enough to know how spin can impact an opponent, who does not understand how an opponent can take away your strengths.

Someone who views the game simply as a fan, who does not understand the subtleties of the game can miss a lot of the real action and tactics of the game. Table tennis is a subtle sport.

 

[rainneverever]

Simple question, is China National Games (every four year) a small and unimportant tournament? And how about China National Championships (every year)? Plastic ball was not used before 2014.

 

[ttmonster]

... and the way you argue makes you look like an internet troll ...

You don't know me so stop with your assumptions, it makes you look insecure and ridiculous to be honest.

 

[RidTheKid]

How do you get WH's question to ML after the game into the equation? No, it doesn't make any sense.

I think WH pulled out some tricks that he knew were weaknesses of ML's from long observation and only used them on the big platform. Sound more plausible?

 

[RidTheKid]

Incorrect. I'm not the one moving towards personal assumptions. I stay on topic, maybe you should try it as well.

... and the way you argue makes you look like an internet troll ...

 

[NextLevel]

Simple question, is China National Games (every four year) a small and unimportant tournament? And how about China National Championships (every year)? Plastic ball was not used before 2014.

Are they majors?

 

[ttmonster]

Dude you pick and choose the points to argue, the ones you cannot you just simply call them baseless so that you don't have to come up with any argument and you stick to your personal assumption that Ma Long's greatness is unquestionable ... how is that not trolling ... I would suggest you need to introspect if in your generous time in this earth do you encounter this situation happening to you in real life as well , where people just let you be because you are a know it all and only because you think so ? If that is the truth you need to make some fundamental changes in the way you think, its never too late !

Incorrect. I'm not the one moving towards personal assumptions. I stay on topic, maybe you should try it as well.

 

[yoass]

Round, and round, and round she goes

 

[rainneverever]

Are they majors?

In China, National Games, yes.
If one wins OG+WTTC+WC+National Games, he/she is called 全满贯 full Grand Slam winner.

 

[RidTheKid]

It's trolling to invent stories like the ball made Ma Long what he is today. That is completely baseless. And you would know this if you followed what happened. It's not trolling to constantly having to explain this like I'm arguing with flat-earthers.

Dude you pick and choose the points to argue, the ones you cannot you just simply call them baseless so that you don't have to come up with any argument and you stick to your personal assumption that Ma Long's greatness is unquestionable ... how is that not trolling ... I would suggest you need to introspect if in your generous time in this earth do you encounter this situation happening to you in real life as well , where people just let you be because you are a know it all and only because you think so ? If that is the truth you need to make some fundamental changes in the way you think, its never too late !

 

[NextLevel]

What you are talking about is ML's mental toughness in the biggest tournaments, which was shaky and it cost him. Presently he has learned how to handle it. It has nothing to do with the ball. ML has beaten both WH and ZJK consistently during the cell era. Same ball in small and big tournaments, different mental pressure.

You are giving the ball the center stage which is strange when we talk about the human psyche.

It wasn't just mental toughness. Even when commentating those matches, experts in China would point to Ma Long's countering technique as being unable to consistently put pressure on Wang Hao. Yes of course, Ma Long won matches where Wang Hao wasn't willing to give max effort as Wang Hao was a big title player like ZJK. But when the pressure was on, Wang Hao would push to open with his backhand as much as possible as did ZJK with multiple variations.

Ma Long has probably the best countering game, definitely on the forehand and not shanny on the backhand. Given the plastic ball forced more rallying, this gave him an advantage relative to teammates like ZJK. I suspect that with the plastic ball spin reduction, even if Wang Hao maintained his level, he would have lost to Ma Long given that his biggest weapon for causing Ma Long discomfort was weakened by the plastic ball.

 

[RidTheKid]

Full house winner?

In China, National Games, yes.
If one wins OG+WTTC+WC+National Games, he/she is called 全满贯 full Grand Slam winner.