Why do people say LP's should be banned?

[Metaxa]

"Technical limits" : please explain what this means beyond something is wrong with the player because they cannot play with inverted. Because you keep saying that "technical rubber" is used because someone has "technical limits" as opposed to just accepting that the person might just want to play completely differently.

Why are you always asking people different questions and not asking yourself?
As I have written before, I have not known anyone who comes into a club with a wood with pimples on the outside, under his arm, never
A coach who notices after some time that his player is having a hard time with a certain stroke (technical deficiency) doesn't have to say: kid, your stroke is not going to be anything, you are never going to be able to do it but we have a solution for you, we are going to let you play with LP/SP or Anti, whatever you like or you can play fastest with.
I had no talent (this versus others who started in the same period) I trained a lot, very much, but I had various limitations. Not a hair on my head would have thought of upgrading my limitations with technical equipment. I would have trained until we could do it.
But it has been good. For me, after the special LPs, they could have banned all the other crap too. It might have caused me less frustration at the time and who knows, maybe an even better career. We're never going to know that.

 

[kapahoo]

Because they can’t play against them. I’ve never heard a player who has no issues playing pips players suggest they should be banned honestly 😂

Raising hand. 😉

Again. It is about what we enjoy in the sport. Most of the time I'd rather lose a close fun game than win a boring one.

All this "all you have to do is practice against LP"-talk.... That is exactly what we NOT want to do. Because it is not as fun game to play.
And also - a weird style with inverted rubbers (or even short pips) is not the same. Be as weird as you like, but with your wrist, not with your pips.

It is not a super big thing. Table tennis is great. Table tennis is good excercise for the body and the brain. Table tennis is mostly great fun. But the world would be a slightly better place without long pips rubbers in table tennis.

 

[Loop Lob Smash]

Raising hand. 😉

Again. It is about what we enjoy in the sport. Most of the time I'd rather lose a close fun game than win a boring one.

All this "all you have to do is practice against LP"-talk.... That is exactly what we NOT want to do. Because it is not as fun game to play.
And also - a weird style with inverted rubbers (or even short pips) is not the same. Be as weird as you like, but with your wrist, not with your pips.

It is not a super big thing. Table tennis is great. Table tennis is good excercise for the body and the brain. Table tennis is mostly great fun. But the world would be a slightly better place without long pips rubbers in table tennis.

 

[NextLevel]

Why are you always asking people different questions and not asking yourself?
As I have written before, I have not known anyone who comes into a club with a wood with pimples on the outside, under his arm, never
A coach who notices after some time that his player is having a hard time with a certain stroke (technical deficiency) doesn't have to say: kid, your stroke is not going to be anything, you are never going to be able to do it but we have a solution for you, we are going to let you play with LP/SP or Anti, whatever you like or you can play fastest with.
I had no talent (this versus others who started in the same period) I trained a lot, very much, but I had various limitations. Not a hair on my head would have thought of upgrading my limitations with technical equipment. I would have trained until we could do it.
But it has been good. For me, after the special LPs, they could have banned all the other crap too. It might have caused me less frustration at the time and who knows, maybe an even better career. We're never going to know that.

You are allowed to ask me questions as well, you are claiming I misrepresented you, but I am pretty sure I did not. Your hate and disdain for people who play with pips shines through everything you write, you come from a place where pips means that the person couldn't play with inverted, therefore he switched to pips to hide his inability to play with inverted. You probably never met people with a talent for doing certain things and realizing that inverted made those things hard to do, therefore pips were better for them. Hitting and driving the ball is one of those, blocking is another. I have even met players who are very good at hitting the ball with backspin or sidespin, again easier to do with pips, but I know one guy who did it to about 2300 level with inverted.

The game used to be played with pips and some people still play with pips. I worked with a coach who used to chop with pips. I was a hitter when I first played because that was my natural instinct like most players who never really learned to spin the ball. I tried pips for a short while, didn't like them, but many people used to complain that even with inverted I played pips strokes. If I had changed to pips, it would have had little to do with a technical limitation, it would have been simply to enable me to play the game I played best at the time, which was close to the table hitting.

I then had another coach who thought like you, but his own reasoning was not like yours - he felt that all the best players in the world were using inverted, so if you used pips, you were making it harder to be one of the best players in the world, so he always discouraged me from using them, and encouraged me to learn how to play against and beat them. So he would train all his students to play against pips so that we wouldn't lose points to pips players.

So I get the hate for something that you don't respect, but again, the game is about putting the ball on the table, some people do not want all the bells and whistles that inverted adds with spin production when they are doing this. To some degree, inverted and the higher levels of speed gluing etc. have ruined the sport. But people like you will never admit that with how you think.

 

[Gozo Zyreruna]

You are allowed to ask me questions as well, you are claiming I misrepresented you, but I am pretty sure I did not. Your hate and disdain for people who play with pips shines through everything you write, you come from a place where pips means that the person couldn't play with inverted, therefore he switched to pips to hide his inability to play with inverted. You probably never met people with a talent for doing certain things and realizing that inverted made those things hard to do, therefore pips were better for them. Hitting and driving the ball is one of those, blocking is another. I have even met players who are very good at hitting the ball with backspin or sidespin, again easier to do with pips, but I know one guy who did it to about 2300 level with inverted.

The game used to be played with pips and some people still play with pips. I worked with a coach who used to chop with pips. I was a hitter when I first played because that was my natural instinct like most players who never really learned to spin the ball. I tried pips for a short while, didn't like them, but many people used to complain that even with inverted I played pips strokes. If I had changed to pips, it would have had little to do with a technical limitation, it would have been simply to enable me to play the game I played best at the time, which was close to the table hitting.

I then had another coach who thought like you, but his own reasoning was not like yours - he felt that all the best players in the world were using inverted, so if you used pips, you were making it harder to be one of the best players in the world, so he always discouraged me from using them, and encouraged me to learn how to play against and beat them. So he would train all his students to play against pips so that we wouldn't lose points to pips players.

So I get the hate for something that you don't respect, but again, the game is about putting the ball on the table, some people do not want all the bells and whistles that inverted adds with spin production when they are doing this. To some degree, inverted and the higher levels of speed gluing etc. have ruined the sport. But people like you will never admit that with how you think.

Inverted is the dark side now?

We are the bad guys all along?

Oh no! I am having an existential moment now.

 

[longrange]

Inverted is the dark side now?

We are the bad guys all along?

Oh no! I am having an existential moment now.

Of course:

Hiroji was the first person to use a sponge on his racket, a common feature of all modern table tennis rackets. Although, at the time it may have seemed as though this technological advancement gave him an unfair advantage, it has truly brought table tennis into the modern age and as the Olympic sport it would become.[1]

He won bronze medal in the team event at the 1952 World Table Tennis Championships[2][3] and a gold medal in the men's singles at the 1952 World Table Tennis Championships.[4]

 

[Loop Lob Smash]

Inverted is the dark side now?

We are the bad guys all along?

Oh no! I am having an existential moment now.

@Gozo Aruna just got reverse uno'd

After 15 years of marriage and being told he is actually ghey
(For context, see Gozo's page 8 irreverent (but funny) post that made me spill my coffee)

 

[Gozo Zyreruna]

(For context, see Gozo's page 8 irreverent (but funny) post that made me spill my coffee)

Thank you my friend for highlighting this. This is a teachable moment here.

Being irrelevant is one thing, being funny is my cup of tea. The point is sometimes I see TTD members arguing merely for semantics purpose to no end.

They forget TT is merely a sports/hobby for 99.9% of us here; meaning we earn zero income from it. So seriously, why so serious?

 

[NextLevel]

View attachment 29218A technically deficient player who hardly trained??🤣

Most people who know the lady pictured above and that she used long pips on her backhand would realize how ridiculous the technical argument is without context.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Inverted is the dark side now?

We are the bad guys all along?

Oh no! I am having an existential moment now.

throughout TT history, you probably have a bigger population ratio that thinks inverted is the dark side over pips, especially in the pro space.

seriously speaking, pips on the dark side is really minority. It is mostly in the amateur space you hear of these moaning.
this is where things are funny, amateurs wanting rule changes, but pros, no, in terms of pips
for inverted, pros accepted and adapted and 99% of them joined in. China was one of the last countries to fully join in.

if pros have amateurs mentality back then, table tennis would be dead by now

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

View attachment 29218A technically deficient player who hardly trained??🤣

best tt story of all time
just like michael jordan who couldn't make the team - this TT queen worked HARDER and fought her way into the team - despite discrimination against her for years.

people who know context and history will know

 

[igorponger]

Wayback Machine

All those involved in the competitive sport do have to obey the Rules willy nilly. All materials designed to make for Foul Play have once been discontinued from LARC altogether.

The glanti frictionless come next, soon.

 

[Loop Lob Smash]

View attachment 29218A technically deficient player who hardly trained??🤣

I did not know who she is. Hint: the answer can be found here:

https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/forum/topics/who-are-your-top-10-table-tennis-players.33577/#post-452292

 

[Der_Echte]

Nobody inquired the result of league played with LP in dash of car made slippery by sun exposure...

Is that as bad as tuning the dogcrap outta difficult for ordinary Jope to obtain H3 top secret national version ??

Let's hear about it !!

 

[ViperTableTennis]

Nobody inquired the result of league played with LP in dash of car made slippery by sun exposure...

Is that as bad as tuning the dogcrap outta difficult for ordinary Jope to obtain H3 top secret national version ??

Let's hear about it !!

Yes this is equally as bad, and both are equally illegal under rule 2.4.7:

2.4.7 The racket covering shall be used without any chemical, physical or other treatment

Tuning/boosting is illegal on the basis of it being a chemical treatment. Making LP's more slippery than they were designed to be by exposure to the sun would be an example of subjecting those LP's to "physical or other treatment".

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Yes this is equally as bad, and both are equally illegal under rule 2.4.7:

2.4.7 The racket covering shall be used without any chemical, physical or other treatment

Tuning/boosting is illegal on the basis of it being a chemical treatment. Making LP's more slippery than they were designed to be by exposure to the sun would be an example of subjecting those LP's to "physical or other treatment".

With such wordings, rubber cleaner, h2o, sweat etc are all illegal too

 

[ViperTableTennis]

With such wordings, rubber cleaner, h2o, sweat etc are all illegal too

Yes, based purely on the rule wording they might be...but in practice any rule enforcement process by a governing body will always go beyond the wording and introduce additional context etc. I would like to think most table tennis players can understand that there is a clear and qualitative difference between (a) using a rubber cleaner to restore the rubbers original playing characteristics, and (b) using some form of treatment to change the rubbers original/intended playing characteristics. And I'm pretty confident that ITTF would rule that (a) is acceptable but that (b) is not.

 

[longrange]

I would like to think most table tennis players can understand that there is a clear and qualitative difference between (a) using a rubber cleaner to restore the rubbers original playing characteristics

Ah, sure, so when a factory-boosted ESN sponge dies I can safely boost it? Thanks for clarification.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Ah, sure, so when a factory-boosted ESN sponge dies I can safely boost it? Thanks for clarification.

best post award hahaha

 

[ViperTableTennis]

Ah, sure, so when a factory-boosted ESN sponge dies I can safely boost it? Thanks for clarification.

I never said that. What I said was "I would like to think most table tennis players can understand that there is a clear and qualitative difference between (a) using a rubber cleaner to restore the rubbers original playing characteristics, and (b) using some form of treatment to change the rubbers original/intended playing characteristics".

Since when is booster considered to be a rubber cleaner?