WTT Star Contender Ljubljana 2025 June 17-22

[NextLevel]

watch this game reveal major problem in Togami's mentality, he's just to burning and ended up burned out. 3rd game 7-1 to 17-15, even made 3 service error and one cost the 4th set. His technique has improved yes but he can't seem to calm himself down, excessive shouting won't help when the thing he should be worry about is the next point

For sure he is a bit of a head case. But so are many good players. Time will tell.

 

[zeio]

there's no rob, Harimoto done has 4 game points at the 3rd set and got overtake, he need an overhaul on his forehand and footwork before talking about any potential here

As I noted in my previous post, it is not even about the match itself. The problem is Togami doesn't even have the qualification to challenge Harimoto in the 3 majors this early in the draw.

Persson also said in a podcast that WCQ would've won if Moregard met him later in the draw at Paris 2024.

 

[PoppaChubby]

As I noted in my previous post, it is not even about the match itself. The problem is Togami doesn't even have the qualification to challenge Harimoto in the 3 majors this early in the draw.

Persson also said in a podcast that WCQ would've won if Moregard met him later in the draw at Paris 2024.

WCQ would have won Truls if he did not show this cry baby/diva behavior after the mixed doubles final for a broken racket...

 

[zeio]

WS QF
Nagasaki (16) 3-1 HZJ (12) (3, -6, 6, 7)
SXY (11) 1-3 Kihara (14) (-7, 7, -6, -7)
Indeed the 1st most unfortunate generation. What they have managed (especially the contribution to members of their own teams and other teams) under the shadow of the golden generation makes it hard to dislike them. In much the same way, what Miki House has done to JTTA makes it hard to like Odo and Yokoi.

OTOH, I never found out why SXY was put on the back burner after winning WJTTC 2016, the only gold medal (1 out of 7) for CNT, now I do. Like QTY, Tieba/Douban users who followed SXY's Weibo back then noted that her mind was not quite on table tennis...

WS QF
Harimoto 2-3 CY (8, -7, -7, 5, -8)
First win for CY and only against a run-down Harimoto.

 

[Shine]

there's no rob, Harimoto done has 4 game points at the 3rd set and got overtake, he need an overhaul on his forehand and footwork before talking about any potential here

Damn, that's a scathing takedown of Harimoto's game if I've ever seen one. Even NL that's exceedingly positive about Hari can't help but laugh. I understand what Zeio means though, if not for Hari being always out of his wits against Togami, that bronze was his for the taking.

 

[Shine]

WS QF
Nagasaki (16) 3-1 HZJ (12) (3, -6, 6, 7)
SXY (11) 1-3 Kihara (14) (-7, 7, -6, -7)
Indeed the 1st most unfortunate generation. What they have managed (especially the contribution to members of their own teams and other teams) under the shadow of the golden generation makes it hard to dislike them. In much the same way, what Miki House has done to JTTA makes it hard to like Odo and Yokoi.

OTOH, I never found out why SXY was put on the back burner after winning WJTTC 2016, the only gold medal (1 out of 7) for CNT, now I do. Like QTY, Tieba/Douban users who followed SXY's Weibo back then noted that her mind was not quite on table tennis...

WS QF
Harimoto 2-3 CY (8, -7, -7, 5, -8)
First win for CY and only against a run-down Harimoto.

I wouldn't really say she was put on the back burner. Surely after her heroics in 2016, she alerted the coaches to her potential, but Wang Manyu and Sun Yingsha also broke out after her and were faster in rising up the ranks. Such is the fate of many Chinese World Junior Champions. Yu Heyi, Xu Yingbin, Xue Fei come to mind.
Now, Xunyao is getting her chances, and she's not done too bad. I think Miyuu is having a very good tournament. And Xunyao has been playing a lot in the past 2-3 weeks across various disciplines. We can cut her some slack this time. She's having the "Miwa" syndrome I guess.

 

[joshmak10]

WCQ would have won Truls if he did not show this cry baby/diva behavior after the mixed doubles final for a broken racket...

And how would you feel if someone stepped on your racket and snapped it in half…

 

[TensorBackhand]

there's no rob, Harimoto done has 4 game points at the 3rd set and got overtake, he need an overhaul on his forehand and footwork before talking about any potential here

You're not allowed to offer constructive criticism of Harimoto on this forum. He is "best non-Chinese".

You observation is correct. His style is leftover from his junior days, and he hasn't developed a more mature professional style. He relies on getting hot and winning points from long rallies. I recommended years ago that he develop a more mature style, even change his FH rubber if he has to, anything to push him into a more adult style.

But years later, he is still using tension rubber on both sides, still stands square in the middle of the table. Everyone told me he is "best non-Chinese". Everybody said "he is still so young, he will still get better". Years later, the gap has closed between him and rest of world. Players like Hugo Calderano have surpassed him by taking more risk and playing a more adult style. Harimoto now often loses to his own teammates. You can't even really call him best player in his own team. He's more like the first among equals.

 

[FIXPOINT]

WTT Star Contender Ljubljana 2025 WS QF

 

[FIXPOINT]

WTT Star Contender Ljubljana 2025 MS QF

 

[pongfugrasshopper]

You're not allowed to offer constructive criticism of Harimoto on this forum. He is "best non-Chinese".

You observation is correct. His style is leftover from his junior days, and he hasn't developed a more mature professional style. He relies on getting hot and winning points from long rallies. I recommended years ago that he develop a more mature style, even change his FH rubber if he has to, anything to push him into a more adult style.

But years later, he is still using tension rubber on both sides, still stands square in the middle of the table. Everyone told me he is "best non-Chinese". Everybody said "he is still so young, he will still get better". Years later, the gap has closed between him and rest of world. Players like Hugo Calderano have surpassed him by taking more risk and playing a more adult style. Harimoto now often loses to his own teammates. You can't even really call him best player in his own team. He's more like the first among equals.

I think it's great that Togami/Shinozuka/Matsushima are making progress. It will only make the Japanese Men's Team stronger. But many titles does Tomo have? And how many do the rest of the Japanese men have? You can use this link to check: https://results.ittf.link/index.php/wtt/wtt-results .. And who was it that beat WCQ and FZD at the 2022 ITTF World Team Championships Semi FInals? Here, let me refresh your memory:

 

[piligrim]

You're not allowed to offer constructive criticism of Harimoto on this forum. He is "best non-Chinese".

You observation is correct. His style is leftover from his junior days, and he hasn't developed a more mature professional style. He relies on getting hot and winning points from long rallies. I recommended years ago that he develop a more mature style, even change his FH rubber if he has to, anything to push him into a more adult style.

But years later, he is still using tension rubber on both sides, still stands square in the middle of the table. Everyone told me he is "best non-Chinese". Everybody said "he is still so young, he will still get better". Years later, the gap has closed between him and rest of world. Players like Hugo Calderano have surpassed him by taking more risk and playing a more adult style. Harimoto now often loses to his own teammates. You can't even really call him best player in his own team. He's more like the first among equals.

He still WR#4 and others way behind

 

[NextLevel]

Damn, that's a scathing takedown of Harimoto's game if I've ever seen one. Even NL that's exceedingly positive about Hari can't help but laugh. I understand what Zeio means though, if not for Hari being always out of his wits against Togami, that bronze was his for the taking.

I am exceedingly positive on youth. But Harimoto knows the assignment and has worked hard at it, but the gaps are still real and no one knows whether they can be plugged. But he is young enough that one can only hope. But none of that addresses his current and past gaps and that is what was correctly described in look at his loss to Togami. Come on, if Jorgic can get Togami to play tight matches every time, Harimoto can do better than repeatedly fall into mental.blocks every time he plays Togami. While Jorgic has a more natural forehand and counter, it is not like he is that much better than Harimoto. The one thing that also confuses me is Harimoto's current serve technique. He really should scrap it and go to more traditional high level technique.

 

[NextLevel]

You're not allowed to offer constructive criticism of Harimoto on this forum. He is "best non-Chinese".

You observation is correct. His style is leftover from his junior days, and he hasn't developed a more mature professional style. He relies on getting hot and winning points from long rallies. I recommended years ago that he develop a more mature style, even change his FH rubber if he has to, anything to push him into a more adult style.

But years later, he is still using tension rubber on both sides, still stands square in the middle of the table. Everyone told me he is "best non-Chinese". Everybody said "he is still so young, he will still get better". Years later, the gap has closed between him and rest of world. Players like Hugo Calderano have surpassed him by taking more risk and playing a more adult style. Harimoto now often loses to his own teammates. You can't even really call him best player in his own team. He's more like the first among equals.

Of course you are allowed to criticize Harimoto, stop exaggerating like Shine, the issue is that your criticism comes from a place where your lack of exposure to top level.players and coaches shows in how you make recommendations that many other top players have tried and failed to implement. Does Truls use Chinese rubbers on either side? Does Truls have a good backhand? Togami who is beating Harimoto, does he have sticky rubber on either side? LYJ who is often pushed as the guy with good technique compared to Harimoto's, does LYJ use sticky rubber on either side? When Dima switched to Hurricane what happened and why did he switch back?

The main points about Harimoto are that over the years before the recent explosion of Hugo, and to a lesser degree Truls and Felix, is that he is still the best performing player outside of China even with all his issues. This is always the objective starting point before going into your pet criticisms and a reminder that improving from a very high level is usually extremely difficult and full of experiments and dead ends for those wontry (others are okay with where they are and dont even try seriously). Maybe after you spend some time trying to get better and see how much it shows up on your playing results, you might become a bit more humble about pontificating that if your preferred approach to improvement is not taken that the player is not taking improvement seriously.

Finally Harimoto is 21. Hugo is 29. Where were your essays when Hugo lost a lead up 10-4 to Truls and then lost 0-4 to Felix in the bronze medal match in Paris? Did you write anything about his depression? The radical changes he is making now are not the kinds of things one will make without realizing that your other attempts failed. It is easy to forget that Ma Long won his first world cup partly because ZJK and Wang Hao were not sent, and because CCY had the strength of character not to eliminate him by tanking a match. And his first world champs was at the age of 27 after 3 different losses in prior WTTCs to Wang Hao.

So yeah no one gives a crap about your objective criticism of Harimoto because it is anything but. When did it become in vogue to treat 21 year olds as if they were mature adults? Maybe it is a different culture and I dont get it. For the most part when explaining Harimoto it is hard to fault his effort. Most of the things you are pointing out have alot to do with coaching and you have not presented any evidence he has resisted proposed changes.

 

[ThePongCommenter]

The main points about Harimoto are that over the years before the recent explosion of Hugo, and to a lesser degree Truls and Felix, is that he is still the best performing player outside of China even with all his issues. This is always the objective starting point before going into your pet criticisms and a reminder that improving from a very high level is usually extremely difficult and full of experiments and dead ends for those wontry (others are okay with where they are and dont even try seriously). Maybe after you spend some time trying to get better and see how much it shows up on your playing results, you might become a bit more humble about pontificating that if your preferred approach to improvement is not taken that the player is not taking improvement seriously.

Finally Harimoto is 21. Hugo is 29. Where were your essays when Hugo lost a lead up 10-4 to Truls and then lost 0-4 to Felix in the bronze medal match in Paris? Did you write anything about his depression? The radical changes he is making now are not the kinds of things one will make without realizing that your other attempts failed. It is easy to forget that Ma Long won his first world cup partly because ZJK and Wang Hao were not sent, and because CCY had the strength of character not to eliminate him by tanking a match. And his first world champs was at the age of 27 after 3 different losses in prior WTTCs to Wang Hao.

So yeah no one gives a crap about your objective criticism of Harimoto because it is anything but. When did it become in vogue to treat 21 year olds as if they were mature adults? Maybe it is a different culture and I dont get it. For the most part when explaining Harimoto it is hard to fault his effort. Most of the things you are pointing out have alot to do with coaching and you have not presented any evidence he has resisted proposed changes.

Saved me a few keystrokes. "Just switch your rubber and change your stance and you'll break even further past top 5 World level" is such a perfect encapsulation of the average forum commenter.

 

[TensorBackhand]

Saved me a few keystrokes. "Just switch your rubber and change your stance and you'll break even further past top 5 World level" is such a perfect encapsulation of the average forum commenter.

"Hey Hari, just keep doing exactly what you have been doing the past 3 years. Play exactly the same way you played when you were 14, use the same rubber, same stance, everything the same. You're own teammates are beating you now, but you are still best non-Chinese. Yes yes, I know Hugo is winning big tournaments now, but he is 29 so you have plenty of time to keep using the same strategy. Yes, 2 of the greatest Chinese players of all time ML and FZD are out of the picture now, but you aren't in a hurry to take advantage of this moment. You'll be better at age 29 if you just keep doing the same technique"

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Saved me a few keystrokes. "Just switch your rubber and change your stance and you'll break even further past top 5 World level" is such a perfect encapsulation of the average forum commenter.

I think Im spending way too much time laughing.

If one day, coaches do run out of solutions, I will tell them to visit TTD

 

[ThePongCommenter]

"Hey Hari, just keep doing exactly what you have been doing the past 3 years. Play exactly the same way you played when you were 14, use the same rubber, same stance, everything the same. You're own teammates are beating you now, but you are still best non-Chinese. Yes yes, I know Hugo is winning big tournaments now, but he is 29 so you have plenty of time to keep using the same strategy. Yes, 2 of the greatest Chinese players of all time ML and FZD are out of the picture now, but you aren't in a hurry to take advantage of this moment. You'll be better at age 29 if you just keep doing the same technique"

Thank you for doubling down on the ignorance but I didn't doubt you were serious the first time you posted this. Maybe you can elaborate more on how switching rubbers and changing his stance will definitively improve his game or make it more "mature" since you keep on mentioning those two points. By the way, the modern game has forced most towards more neutral stances so that point in particular is very funny to me, the other one I will just chalk up to you being equipment obsessed and thinking that solutions are necessarily that simple for top players in the world

What you don't seem to grasp is that
1) he has made changes and improvements, some we can see and surely many more that we didn't see because they weren't working for him
2) you have NO CLUE what changes it takes to get from being roughly the 5th best player in the world to a top 2 player, even the best coaches in the world don't always have the answers immediately, but you don't watch or understand the game well enough to see that your assumption that he has been doing the same thing for 3 years is not accurate
3) you yourself are struggling to get from 1800 to 2000 and have openly stated that you distance yourself from all forms of professional coaching, which likely explains why you seem to assume improvement is just as simple as making any change whatsoever
4) people like you would have been saying the exact same things about Calderano until he wasn't the old Calderano anymore

 

[Atas Newton]

Don't know if I've ever seen anyone lose a game by hitting a ball into their own pendant on serve. And it's not for the lack of people wearing pendants either lol

 

[Atas Newton]

Btw this thread doesn't show up on the main page of the forums, are all tournaments now gonna be in their own branch?