Advice against annoying style

[TensorBackhand]

Last night I played a really annoying style and totally screwed it up. The guy wasn't a high level player, maybe 1700 and I've seen him lose commonly to lower level players. But I have a problem of freezing up and becoming super hesitant when I'm uncomfortable.

First, the thing that troubles me the most is that he has a really unorthodox FH loop. It's not a loop that you think of normally, but he brushes under and side of the ball, and no exaggeration every FH loop of his is basically a snake shot like Adam Bobrow. To make it even worse, he is left-handed, so his loop goes into my BH. I would estimate his fh loop ball jumps about 30cm to my left after it bounces on the table. So I really feel stuck here. I can't really attack the ball because I don't know where the ball is going to be, and its hard because its on my bh side. What I usually do is wait to see where the ball goes before I block it back. But even then, I still missed a lot of these blocks, and it also just gave him an easy ball to smash. How can I deal with this snake shot into my bh?

The other big issue I had was with his serve. From his bh position, he just swipes at the ball and it has heavy sidespin. I didn't know how to receive this, so I kinda defaulted to a push shot. But then my push just goes crazy, sometimes into the net, sometimes pops up high. I think the ball sometimes has slight under or slight topspin, and so my push ends up getting killed to both balls.

 

[Draycott old man]

The first thing I would advise you to do is to relax as much as possible,be as positive as you can with your top spin!!! Top spin will counter any spin if your technic is right!!! Stop worrying if you miss !!! The more your worry the less chance of improving against this player !!! Don't expect to improve overnight it will take time but if you stay positive and learn from your attempts I'm sure you will improve!!!

 

[pingpongpaddy]

Last night I played a really annoying style and totally screwed it up. The guy wasn't a high level player, maybe 1700 and I've seen him lose commonly to lower level players. But I have a problem of freezing up and becoming super hesitant when I'm uncomfortable.

HI TENSOR

First, the thing that troubles me the most is that he has a really unorthodox FH loop. It's not a loop that you think of normally, but he brushes under and side of the ball, and no exaggeration every FH loop of his is basically a snake shot like Adam Bobrow. To make it even worse, he is left-handed, so his loop goes into my BH. I would estimate his fh loop ball jumps about 30cm to my left after it bounces on the table. So I really feel stuck here. I can't really attack the ball because I don't know where the ball is going to be, and it's hard because it's on my bh side. What I usually do is wait to see where the ball goes before I block it back. But even then, I still missed a lot of these blocks, and it also just gave him an easy ball to smash. How can I deal with this snake shot into my bh?

When you block do it early just at the bounce so that his fh won't drag you out of position. Try to put it down his bh. Once you are able to place your returns you will co better

The other big issue I had was with his serve. From his bh position, he just swipes at the ball and it has heavy sidespin. I didn't know how to receive this, so I kinda defaulted to a push shot. But then my push just goes crazy, sometimes into the net, sometimes pops up high. I think the ball sometimes has slight under or slight topspin, and so my push ends up getting killed to both balls.

You need to learn to read what happens when his bat contacts the ball in service.
One recommended way is this:
Treat all incoming backspin serves as needing to be pushed back with an open racket and slight backspin
Treat all other serves as having side/spin or side/topspin together as needing a guiding gentle but poise hit with slightly closed racket aiming for the middle of the table.
You should try and rely on just these methods at first, because this will enable you to judge the effect of the slight under spin or slight topspin and whether you are reading the serves correctly. Also your slower returns will give You time to be ready for the 4th ball.
His subtle variations to his service swipea argue that he is not so weak, but in any case he is higher than you.
And you should be glad of this. The strongest player in the hall has least opportunity to improve while the weakest has the chance to improve against everybody else. Welcome this 'annoying style ' and learn from it
good luck

 

[NextLevel]

The first thing I would advise you to do is to relax as much as possible,be as positive as you can with your top spin!!! Top spin will counter any spin if your technic is right!!! Stop worrying if you miss !!!

The unfortunate part is he isn't even losing in a tournament match (doesn't sound like it), yet he has framed the situation in such a way that it will be difficult for him to get max value out of the experience of playing such an awkward player. You keep trying your technique with different timing until it works.

 

[TensorBackhand]

The first thing I would advise you to do is to relax as much as possible,be as positive as you can with your top spin!!! Top spin will counter any spin if your technic is right!!! Stop worrying if you miss !!! The more your worry the less chance of improving against this player !!! Don't expect to improve overnight it will take time but if you stay positive and learn from your attempts I'm sure you will improve!!!

Yes, against this type of irritation, my natural tendency is to become hesitant and be defensive and it works against me.

 

[Draycott old man]

Yes, against this type of irritation, my natural tendency is to become hesitant and be defensive and it works against me.

I'm not a coach but try to stay positive as your opponent will recognise that you are struggling against his Style!!!! Try to not let him see you are struggling even if you are !!! You only need to work his game out and you will feel so good!!! Try to relax in your shots you choose and make sure you commit!!! Stay patient!!! It will come good!!! Make sure you praise yourself for any positive shots you make !!!

 

[Draycott old man]

Try and hit your shots at a maximum 70% loosen your grip as that will help you relax!!! Good luck 😁 😁 😁

 

[vvk1]

...
First, the thing that troubles me the most is that he has a really unorthodox FH loop. It's not a loop that you think of normally, but he brushes under and side of the ball, and no exaggeration every FH loop of his is basically a snake shot like Adam Bobrow. To make it even worse, he is left-handed, so his loop goes into my BH. I would estimate his fh loop ball jumps about 30cm to my left after it bounces on the table. So I really feel stuck here. I can't really attack the ball because I don't know where the ball is going to be, and its hard because its on my bh side. What I usually do is wait to see where the ball goes before I block it back. But even then, I still missed a lot of these blocks, and it also just gave him an easy ball to smash. How can I deal with this snake shot into my bh?

Brushing under and side of the ball as you describe requires a long and low ball, probably even below table level. Try keeping the ball as short as possible on the table and attacking strongly first.

The other big issue I had was with his serve. From his bh position, he just swipes at the ball and it has heavy sidespin. I didn't know how to receive this, so I kinda defaulted to a push shot. But then my push just goes crazy, sometimes into the net, sometimes pops up high. I think the ball sometimes has slight under or slight topspin, and so my push ends up getting killed to both balls.

Ok, so he's left-handed. If you were playing a right-hander who stood in the same spot and swiped at the ball in the same direction (but with the opposite side of this bat), how would you receive it?

 

[TensorBackhand]

Brushing under and side of the ball as you describe requires a long and low ball, probably even below table level. Try keeping the ball as short as possible on the table and attacking strongly first.



Ok, so he's left-handed. If you were playing a right-hander who stood in the same spot and swiped at the ball in the same direction (but with the opposite side of this bat), how would you receive it?

Well 50% of me would also be hesitant with that level of sidespin. But 50% of me would find it easier from a right-hander because the ball comes crosscourt to my backhand where it's easier to loop/flick.

I think I'm also just very hesitant because I can see there's sidespin, but I'm not sure if there is also some underspin or topspin.

 

[kindof99]

Yes, against this type of irritation, my natural tendency is to become hesitant and be defensive and it works against me.

I think it is important to avoid using a big stroke. Everyone has his way of dealing this ball. Receiving on the bounce is usually good for any side/top spin. But if he has trouble with that, then just receive it late and with a small top spin loop at the beginning. I think the key is not to rush and tense yourself. Learn the spin slowly first and you can deal it later.

 

[blahness]

Last night I played a really annoying style and totally screwed it up. The guy wasn't a high level player, maybe 1700 and I've seen him lose commonly to lower level players. But I have a problem of freezing up and becoming super hesitant when I'm uncomfortable.

First, the thing that troubles me the most is that he has a really unorthodox FH loop. It's not a loop that you think of normally, but he brushes under and side of the ball, and no exaggeration every FH loop of his is basically a snake shot like Adam Bobrow. To make it even worse, he is left-handed, so his loop goes into my BH. I would estimate his fh loop ball jumps about 30cm to my left after it bounces on the table. So I really feel stuck here. I can't really attack the ball because I don't know where the ball is going to be, and its hard because its on my bh side. What I usually do is wait to see where the ball goes before I block it back. But even then, I still missed a lot of these blocks, and it also just gave him an easy ball to smash. How can I deal with this snake shot into my bh?

The other big issue I had was with his serve. From his bh position, he just swipes at the ball and it has heavy sidespin. I didn't know how to receive this, so I kinda defaulted to a push shot. But then my push just goes crazy, sometimes into the net, sometimes pops up high. I think the ball sometimes has slight under or slight topspin, and so my push ends up getting killed to both balls.

Against the FH hooked "loop" if you block it passively obviously it will go into the net. This is basically an opportunity ball for you as it is just a slow sidespin ball (depending on how he hooked it it will either have sideunder or sidetop), just treat it as a pendulum serve from a righty and loop it with your BH and he will be the one picking up the ball.

Also he wont be able to do this easily if you jam him with long fast serves, or short true double bounce serves.

Is his serve pendulum or reverse pendulum? A very good way to deal with these ambiguous balls is to sideswipe it yourself to some disgusting location and then loop the next ball hard. If it's long then just loop it hard on the 2nd ball anyway, with ample consideration of the sidespin (basically you should always approach the ball in the same direction as the ball sidespin direction to avoid missing, ie if the ball is moving from left to right, you also need to approach the ball from left to right, and vice versa)

 

[TensorBackhand]

Maybe i should take some time off from TT.

I went to play today, not against the annoying guy, but i carried over from yesterday a lot of negative energy and frustration with me today. I played terrible and it wasnt fun at all.

Every little thing frustrated me: ball takes a weird bounce, next table talking too loud, partner passes the ball to me poorly.

I made a lot of serve errors and errors all around.

 

[banbekas]

Last night I played a really annoying style and totally screwed it up. The guy wasn't a high level player, maybe 1700 and I've seen him lose commonly to lower level players. But I have a problem of freezing up and becoming super hesitant when I'm uncomfortable.

First, the thing that troubles me the most is that he has a really unorthodox FH loop. It's not a loop that you think of normally, but he brushes under and side of the ball, and no exaggeration every FH loop of his is basically a snake shot like Adam Bobrow. To make it even worse, he is left-handed, so his loop goes into my BH. I would estimate his fh loop ball jumps about 30cm to my left after it bounces on the table. So I really feel stuck here. I can't really attack the ball because I don't know where the ball is going to be, and its hard because its on my bh side. What I usually do is wait to see where the ball goes before I block it back. But even then, I still missed a lot of these blocks, and it also just gave him an easy ball to smash. How can I deal with this snake shot into my bh?

The other big issue I had was with his serve. From his bh position, he just swipes at the ball and it has heavy sidespin. I didn't know how to receive this, so I kinda defaulted to a push shot. But then my push just goes crazy, sometimes into the net, sometimes pops up high. I think the ball sometimes has slight under or slight topspin, and so my push ends up getting killed to both balls.

Unorthodox players are hard to deal with, I agree.

Whenever I'm up against this kind of player, I always make sure I play it safe first, force the game into a rally and then attack from the back. Unorthodox players tend to be weaker in rallies and bombing them with topspin from the back works wonder for me.

 

[kase]

Maybe i should take some time off from TT.

I went to play today, not against the annoying guy, but i carried over from yesterday a lot of negative energy and frustration with me today. I played terrible and it wasnt fun at all.

Every little thing frustrated me: ball takes a weird bounce, next table talking too loud, partner passes the ball to me poorly.

I made a lot of serve errors and errors all around.

Good idea. Focus on fitness and strength at the gym for a while until the frustration wears off. Also refer to the mental strength thread where I post a link to the best book I have read for the psychological aspect. I assume you spend a lot of time training physical skills, but you also need to train the mental side too. Most people ignore it because it's 'boring', but it's a must if you want to perform at your best and also continue to enjoy the game and avoid burnout.

I would approach this type of loop by taking it very early off the bounce (before the side-spin can deviate the ball too much) and go with the spin. You need to brush it a bit, hold the ball for as long as you can before it leaves your bat, otherwise the spin will control you. If that doesn't work, I would take a small step back and chop it deep and heavy and low.

As for returning the serve, this will be difficult with a 'push'. I know because this is a main serve of mine too. Do you know where the term 'push' comes from? Tennis. 'Pushers' just put the ball back without risk and wait for the opponent to make a mistake. EG: Brad Gilbert. Instead of a 'push' you can be more active and aggressive with a proper chop. Unfortunately you will need a coach to teach you, who knows how to chop over the table properly. The skill has mostly been lost and most coaches teach their speed-glue era 'pushes'. That's why you see even premier and pro players pop balls a foot high sometimes and dump into the net a lot. They make up for their poor table game with their footwork / rally ability. Perhaps searching for a coach who used to be a chopper would be beneficial.

You can also try a flick, just go with with the spin instead of against it, and don't try to do too much with it. Just place it deep and low.

 

[turbozed]

Yes, against this type of irritation, my natural tendency is to become hesitant and be defensive and it works against me.

Maybe reframe it to see it as an opportunity instead of an irritation.

I recently started playing an unorthodox player that relies on lobs and fishing shots with lots of side spin. In the beginning I missed a lot of 'easy' high balls due to misreading the spin, being too early, or poor smash mechanics.

In those hours playing against this, my patience and timing on weird spin shots has gotten better dramatically since I've only trained against more conventional styles. At first it made me play more defensive and weakly tap back balls I should've been smashing. But after while, you begin to recognize which balls are weird enough to be careful against, and which balls are suitable for attacking. I'm confident that's a skill that carry over to playing more 'normal' style players.

 

[Draycott old man]

Maybe i should take some time off from TT.

I went to play today, not against the annoying guy, but i carried over from yesterday a lot of negative energy and frustration with me today. I played terrible and it wasnt fun at all.

Every little thing frustrated me: ball takes a weird bounce, next table talking too loud, partner passes the ball to me poorly.

I made a lot of serve errors and errors all around

Maybe i should take some time off from TT.

I went to play today, not against the annoying guy, but i carried over from yesterday a lot of negative energy and frustration with me today. I played terrible and it wasnt fun at all.

Every little thing frustrated me: ball takes a weird bounce, next table talking too loud, partner passes the ball to me poorly.

I made a lot of serve errors and errors all around.

Please don't give up !!!! This is your mind that's telling you that you can't do it and pointing out every problem around you!!! If you stop playing it will be really hard to go back as all you will remember is bad thoughts!!! Remember you are not a professional and it doesn't matter if you don't play well today!!! But if you stay mentally strong I promise you you will play well some time in the future!!! Try to relax and remember you are there to have fun and enjoy yourself!!!!

 

[Gozo Aruna]

whenever I feel burn out from TT, I'll buy new rubbers. It usually unburn-out for me.

 

[PoorPingPong&PianoPlayer]

whenever I feel burn out from TT, I'll buy new rubbers. It usually unburn-out for me.

But Flextra is not new. Flextra is very old.

 

[Gozo Aruna]

But Flextra is not new. Flextra is very old.

Retro is the new sexy! Yeah baby yeah!!!

 

[PoorPingPong&PianoPlayer]

Retro is the new sexy! Yeah baby yeah!!!
View attachment 29588

My coach told me that Flextra goes pretty well with this nice one ply cutting board. Maybe I will change my mind and will try it.