Rasanter R53 for FH or BH?

[TensorBackhand]

I just came back from a session testing out a sheet of Rasanter R53 2.3mm. Previously I had tested it out as a FH rubber and it was pretty fun. It was definitely really fast, spin was good, but I felt the fault tolerance wasn't too high. I'm using to having tacky fh, so I think I felt that was really missing with R53 on the FH. There were times when I felt my FH loop was a bit wild without the tackiness, and in crucial moments I didn't always feel confident to do a FH loop.

So I tried it out as a BH rubber today. It also didn't feel right to me. A lot of times on both bh loops and bh drives, I felt like the ball was falling down into the net. Unless I got a really clean bite on the ball, there was a tendency to fall into the net. It's almost as if the sponge was too thick or too hard or something, and the rubber wasn't biting the ball to lift it enough. Like the ball was just hitting the topsheet and dropping. But I have used a ton of hard bh rubbers before, such as Rhyzen ZGR/ZGX, Dragon Grip, Big Dipper, and they work really well for me. I love them.

So why would R53 seemingly work poorly for me? Is there something specific to 2.3mm sponges that makes it harder to engage on the bh?

 

[Amayzde]

I felt like the ball was falling down into the net. Unless I got a really clean bite on the ball, there was a tendency to fall into the net.

Sounds to mye like you shouldnt play with a rubber that is this hard. Unless you are a pro player that does 10.000 BH topspins a day, you probably wont have the technique required to play with these kind of rubbers.

If you really want to play with a Rasanter rubber on your BH I would suggest R48 at most, maybe even R45.

As for your forehand, if you are used to a tacky rubber, switching to R53 is quite a transition. Maybe try the the C53 version.

 

[SFF_lib]

I just came back from a session testing out a sheet of Rasanter R53 2.3mm. Previously I had tested it out as a FH rubber and it was pretty fun. It was definitely really fast, spin was good, but I felt the fault tolerance wasn't too high. I'm using to having tacky fh, so I think I felt that was really missing with R53 on the FH. There were times when I felt my FH loop was a bit wild without the tackiness, and in crucial moments I didn't always feel confident to do a FH loop.

So I tried it out as a BH rubber today. It also didn't feel right to me. A lot of times on both bh loops and bh drives, I felt like the ball was falling down into the net. Unless I got a really clean bite on the ball, there was a tendency to fall into the net. It's almost as if the sponge was too thick or too hard or something, and the rubber wasn't biting the ball to lift it enough. Like the ball was just hitting the topsheet and dropping. But I have used a ton of hard bh rubbers before, such as Rhyzen ZGR/ZGX, Dragon Grip, Big Dipper, and they work really well for me. I love them.

So why would R53 seemingly work poorly for me? Is there something specific to 2.3mm sponges that makes it harder to engage on the bh?

How old is your R53?

 

[TensorBackhand]

Sounds to mye like you shouldnt play with a rubber that is this hard. Unless you are a pro player that does 10.000 BH topspins a day, you probably wont have the technique required to play with these kind of rubbers.

If you really want to play with a Rasanter rubber on your BH I would suggest R48 at most, maybe even R45.

As for your forehand, if you are used to a tacky rubber, switching to R53 is quite a transition. Maybe try the the C53 version.

Yes i have the C53, and I feel like it has more control on the fh.

And like I mentioned, I actually have played a lot with harder rubbers than R53, and i usually like it a lot.

So Im still trying to understand why the R53 doesnt seem to work on my bh. Even if I accept that R53 is not good for my bh, at least i want to know the technical reason why

 

[TensorBackhand]

How old is your R53?

Its pretty much new. Just some light hitting a few times.

 

[Amayzde]

And like I mentioned, I actually have played a lot with harder rubbers than R53, and i usually like it a lot.

So Im still trying to understand why the R53 doesnt seem to work on my bh. Even if I accept that R53 is not good for my bh, at least i want to know the technical reason why

Im apologise in advance here for my bluntness, but you dont seem to listen to advice otherwise.

I dont care you played with all these rubbers and that you may have liked them before. You know what the difference is between those rubbers and the R53? The R53 is not a hybrid rubber, and the lack of tackiness that you are used to really shows the flaw you have in your technique.

 

[Choosikick]

Yes i have the C53, and I feel like it has more control on the fh.

And like I mentioned, I actually have played a lot with harder rubbers than R53, and i usually like it a lot.

So Im still trying to understand why the R53 doesnt seem to work on my bh. Even if I accept that R53 is not good for my bh, at least i want to know the technical reason why

I think the problem is the thickness of the sponge. I have a P53 with a thickness of 1.8. It plays great on the backhand with a fast blade with a soft top veneer. Perhaps a 2mm sponge would be better, but 2.3 would be too fast for me.

 

[TensorBackhand]

Im apologise in advance here for my bluntness, but you dont seem to listen to advice otherwise.

I dont care you played with all these rubbers and that you may have liked them before. You know what the difference is between those rubbers and the R53? The R53 is not a hybrid rubber, and the lack of tackiness that you are used to really shows the flaw you have in your technique.

Well I'm not at all surprised that a sub 2000 level player might have flaws in bh technique.

That still hasn't answered my question. What is the technical reason that my flawed technique works well with hybrid hard rubbers but not R53.

 

[Amayzde]

Well I'm not at all surprised that a sub 2000 level player might have flaws in bh technique.

That still hasn't answered my question. What is the technical reason that my flawed technique works well with hybrid hard rubbers but not R53.

I don’t know how much clearer you want your anwser to be. But I will try;

Hybrid rubbers have a tacky topsheet. Tacky topsheet = more grip & less bounce = more time on contact = more absorbtion of spin = less spin sensitive = having to think less about you bat angle = bigger margin for error = more forgiving = more control of the ball = less mistakes.

 

[gordonluvsu]

It might be that you are not "snapping" wrist and forearm well enough but instead your swinging too much.
Its hard to say without seeing you play, but this could be a reason why.

Big swings can lead to less control and bigger changes between rubbers, as it requires a lot more Practice to get it right the way you want it too.

Snapping and breaking wrist and forearm during/after the hitting point, like Fan Zhendong does it most of the time or even Ma Longs Block/Counter, will give you overall more control and will be easier to adjust and work on.

And once you get it down correctly, it doesnt lack in Power or speed compared to a full swing.

Obviously just a speculation, idk about your technique, but this could be A reason why.

 

[Gozo Aruna]

why use such hard sponge on BH? BH stroke is shorter and less powerful compared to FH. You cannot properly engage the hard sponge wholly due to the BH bio-mechanical limitation.

There is a danger of overly use of the wrist leading to repetitive stress injury.

 

[Brs]

Rasanter R53 for FH or BH?​

No.

 

[Der_Echte]

@TensorBackhand ,

It is your personal IMPACT.

Simply, you have trained your impact to make use of sticky rubber with medium firmness.

It requires a totally different kind of ball strike to use a Euro/Japanese rubber and of course that is over generalized... but those rubbers are way different than sticky rubbers you have used and the impact required to make good use of it is way different.

Conversely, I am not good enough... or my impact is not effective enough to make use of H3... nor is it good enough to make good use of any Diginiski rubber...

Yet, give me firm sponged 50 degree Aurus on FH and I could ground pound many a fool into submission on the mat... or even worse, let me BH pound it with SOFT version of Aurus and that sucker flying faster than all the dudes' FH smash.

I developed my own impact to make good use of those rubbers and I do not want to spend time to re-learn and re-adjust.

Likewise, you ask yourself the same question and answer it for yourself.

 

[TensorBackhand]

@TensorBackhand ,

It is your personal IMPACT.

Simply, you have trained your impact to make use of sticky rubber with medium firmness.

It requires a totally different kind of ball strike to use a Euro/Japanese rubber and of course that is over generalized... but those rubbers are way different than sticky rubbers you have used and the impact required to make good use of it is way different.

Conversely, I am not good enough... or my impact is not effective enough to make use of H3... nor is it good enough to make good use of any Diginiski rubber...

Yet, give me firm sponged 50 degree Aurus on FH and I could ground pound many a fool into submission on the mat... or even worse, let me BH pound it with SOFT version of Aurus and that sucker flying faster than all the dudes' FH smash.

I developed my own impact to make good use of those rubbers and I do not want to spend time to re-learn and re-adjust.

Likewise, you ask yourself the same question and answer it for yourself.

Right now I have some 47d and 50d esn nontacky tensor rubbers on bh setup, but theres no problem there. Only the R53 gives me some problems.

Is 3d really so much that it all comes off the rails?

 

[Tiz]

Right now I have some 47d and 50d esn nontacky tensor rubbers on bh setup, but theres no problem there. Only the R53 gives me some problems.

The Rasanter series has a thin top sheet, that could be the explanation.
Anyways the review on TT11's blog was rather negative
"However, on a couple of occasions the topsheet failed to properly grip the ball, resulting in spectacular misses, leading me to speculate that the topsheet is moisture- and dirt-sensitive."

Review: DNA Pro H vs. Rasanter R53

General Intro The introduction of the 40+ plastic ball has resulted in an increased demand for fast, hard rubbers that can compensate for the decreased speed and spin of the 40+ plastic ball. To meet this demand, Stiga and Andro recently introduced the DNA Pro H and Rasanter R53 rubbers,...

blog.tabletennis11.com

And I also think that Simon Gauzy wasn't playing very well with it, he plays much better since he switched to C53 IMHO.

 

[TensorBackhand]

The Rasanter series has a thin top sheet, that could be the explanation.
Anyways the review on TT11's blog was rather negative
"However, on a couple of occasions the topsheet failed to properly grip the ball, resulting in spectacular misses, leading me to speculate that the topsheet is moisture- and dirt-sensitive."

Review: DNA Pro H vs. Rasanter R53

General Intro The introduction of the 40+ plastic ball has resulted in an increased demand for fast, hard rubbers that can compensate for the decreased speed and spin of the 40+ plastic ball. To meet this demand, Stiga and Andro recently introduced the DNA Pro H and Rasanter R53 rubbers,...

blog.tabletennis11.com

And I also think that Simon Gauzy wasn't playing very well with it, he plays much better since he switched to C53 IMHO.

"Failed to properly grip the ball" sounds exactly like what I experience.

 

[SFF_lib]

Its pretty much new. Just some light hitting a few times.

Ok that’s strange? R53 has a pretty good safe margin and the arc is high. Unless your blade has low flex?

 

[TensorBackhand]

Ok that’s strange? R53 has a pretty good safe margin and the arc is high. Unless your blade has low flex?

maybe seamoon will help?

 

[NextLevel]

Im apologise in advance here for my bluntness, but you dont seem to listen to advice otherwise.

I dont care you played with all these rubbers and that you may have liked them before. You know what the difference is between those rubbers and the R53? The R53 is not a hybrid rubber, and the lack of tackiness that you are used to really shows the flaw you have in your technique.

You have to understand the MO of the people who you are responding to. When you notice the patterns, then you can realize that your response is really for you, not for him.

 

[SFF_lib]

maybe seamoon will help?

My R53 did react well to my seamoon