Anders Lind discussing illegal serves

[Robin0910]

From my experience at the low level most people get offended when you call them out on serves. I once asked a woman to toss the ball (with a please) because she didn't toss at all and she told me I could have asked nicer. People like that go down as disrespectful in my memory. Old players have to be worst here. Every single one responds by saying they have been playing for x amount of years and no one has ever complained.

I’d say something like “you’re fortunate enough to witness this complaint you old hag”

 

[Gtsnake]

Yes! Finally someone that speaks out. I've noticed the same thing too and it's getting worse. People are always trying to push the boundaries until they are told not to. It's just like little kids. They test the boundaries of how far they can push the parents until they're told not to.

It's up to the umpires and ITTF to tell them and enforce the rules. Until that happens it will get worse.

 

[d3nium]

@turbozed Did you ask him on IG?

 

[turbozed]

@turbozed Did you ask him on IG?

No I didn't ask him. My question was posed as a joke anyway but it doesn't seem like people are picking up on it. See the first letter of each line of the question.

 

[pongfugrasshopper]

Much of this can be resolved with more well placed cameras and some AI to adjust for receiver's point of view. Now with fewer tables being used at WTT events I think this is feasible.

 

[d3nium]

No I didn't ask him. My question was posed as a joke anyway but it doesn't seem like people are picking up on it. See the first letter of each line of the question.

Haha i'll be honest, it went over my head, but very clever!

 

[igorponger]

It is NO problem for umpire to deal with those "bad" services. Umpire must have guts foremost. A lot of guts.

 

[Lazer]

Much of this can be resolved with more well placed cameras and some AI to adjust for receiver's point of view. Now with fewer tables being used at WTT events I think this is feasible.

What about on amateur's level, You cant have cameras in all training halls ...
No, It have to enforceable WITHOUT a lot of technology.

Cheers
L-zr

 

[NextLevel]

Much of this can be resolved with more well placed cameras and some AI to adjust for receiver's point of view. Now with fewer tables being used at WTT events I think this is feasible.

I would just prefer that the rules be simplified to include the changes that Larry Hodges has continually spoken about (and which are implied in Anders Lind's discussion of the issues) and enforced. I don't think a serve should be dependent of the receiver's point of view, it should be exposed to both net posts and that infinite line that continues from there. The problem is that some people think that the offense of the banana flick is too strong but to me the obvious solution to that is to raise the net height even if slightly.

Truls largely does the kinds of serves that would be in vogue if the rules were enforced.

 

[Arkady]

It's not a matter of cameras, VAR system or simplification of service rules. Ultimately it will be up to the umpires to call an illegal serve. Most umpires ARE and WILL BE hesitant to call on illegal serves (especially on superstar players), in order not to disrupt the flow of the games.
Only if ITFF and WTT addresses the issue by giving specific instructions to the umpires, to strictly enforce the rules with no exceptions, while backing up umpires' decisions, the problem will be solved. Otherwise, we'll just be discussing it and discussing it endlessly...

 

[latej]

I would just prefer that the rules be simplified to include the changes that Larry Hodges has continually spoken about (and which are implied in Anders Lind's discussion of the issues) and enforced. I don't think a serve should be dependent of the receiver's point of view, it should be exposed to both net posts and that infinite line that continues from there.

Yes, absolutely! That and the enforcing...

That older people are against, due to the momentum, is OK. It would be surprising if they didn't.

 

[piligrim]

Table Tennis is boring, hence why nobody watches it. The game is dominated by serves and 3rd ball attacks, we need more rallies.

50 mm ball will solve this problem ))

 

[pongfugrasshopper]

What about on amateur's level, You cant have cameras in all training halls ...
No, It have to enforceable WITHOUT a lot of technology.

Cheers
L-zr

Unfortunately, there's not much can be done at the amateur level. The will to enforce rules at the amateur level is near non-existent.

 

[kindof99]

Unfortunately, there's not much can be done at the amateur level. The will to enforce rules at the amateur level is near non-existent.

Most amateurs can't change to legal serves sometimes due to the loss coming after the change. But it can really stressful to play again these people. I think it is an individual thing. When I try a new serve, my first concern is always whether it is legal, but some people do not think so. Sometimes, if the illegal serves get to your nerve, just stop playing with these people. There are still many people serving legally.

 

[Gtsnake]

Most amateurs can't change to legal serves sometimes due to the loss coming after the change. But it can really stressful to play again these people. I think it is an individual thing. When I try a new serve, my first concern is always whether it is legal, but some people do not think so. Sometimes, if the illegal serves get to your nerve, just stop playing with these people. There are still many people serving legally.

But what about amateur tournaments? You can't just choose not to play. I've actually thrown a game against a guy who didn't serve correctly. But it just hurts yourself because nobody cares at the amateur level.

 

[piligrim]

But what about amateur tournaments? You can't just choose not to play. I've actually thrown a game against a guy who didn't serve correctly. But it just hurts yourself because nobody cares at the amateur level.

How people played before this new rules? What you was doing? Pretend there is still old rules and any serves allowed

 

[NextLevel]

Unfortunately, there's not much can be done at the amateur level. The will to enforce rules at the amateur level is near non-existent.

I don't find this to be undeniably true, especially when there is a certified umpire around. Many amateurs can and will adjust in the face of criticism and feedback, even to the detriment of their game, if there is a 3rd party to call the serves or if their violation is obvious to everyone watching and it is brought to their attention. Of course, some don't but that is true for anything.

 

[Arkady]

Most amateurs can't change to legal serves sometimes due to the loss coming after the change. But it can really stressful to play again these people. I think it is an individual thing. When I try a new serve, my first concern is always whether it is legal, but some people do not think so. Sometimes, if the illegal serves get to your nerve, just stop playing with these people. There are still many people serving legally.

I don't think that they can't make legal serves, it's that they don't want to.
Especially older players, rely on illegal serves to score easy point and know that most opponents out of respect of their age or in order to avoid being "hostile", will just not complain.

Take for example this guy with the red shirt who makes illegal shovel serve. It's obvious that he's hiding the contact point on purpose. In fact I've seen him practicing it and trying to turn his body as much as he can to make it less visible to the opponent...

 

[Lazer]

Unfortunately, there's not much can be done at the amateur level. The will to enforce rules at the amateur level is near non-existent.

But then you will have the problem of moving from amateur to pro with illegal served. It is much much better to simplify the rules so that no technology is necessary.

Cheers
L-zr

 

[pongfugrasshopper]

I don't agree with Anders demonstration of what he says is incredibly illegal due to verticality. It has to be within 30 degrees of vertical. In his demo he says it's probably like 60 degrees which it does not look like to me. Here's his video at the timestamp where he demos an "illegal" serve: