Butterfly Zyre 03

[NextLevel]

Easy enough to find review links on this thread or by search. Do you think the positive reviews are all driven by the hypnotic power of the Butterfly marketing team?

Some of them yes. I pointed out at least one case where a reviewer didn't like the rubber but downplayed his reservations.

 

[NDH]

Easy enough to find review links on this thread or by search. Do you think the positive reviews are all driven by the hypnotic power of the Butterfly marketing team?

Apologies, I don’t know your level so I’m not sure of the context here.

I’ve been quite open about my level, and it’s there for all to see (the good thing with the UK is that the local league results are recorded very well!)

I would comment that YES, a lot will be marketing hype and conscious bias.

You spend £100 or more on a rubber, and you will absolutely convince yourself it’s amazing if you are looking for it to be amazing.

Very few will give it a really fair review.

The Pro’s are different. Everything about their game is different to most people, and they are absolutely part of the 0.01 % of people who may very well get the most out of it.

I believe what Dima said, I don’t think he’s saying it for marketing sake…. But I also don’t think anyone on this forum will get the same benefits from the rubber that he will.

This is a very broad comment here….. but it feels like the reviews I’ve seen of the people who have BOUGHT it (with their own money) are generally full of praise for it (with some exceptions of course).

Those who haven’t, or those who have played against it/had a little knock…. Seem much more underwhelmed.

Either way, as has already been said, I think we see a few months away from getting really good opinions.

 

[Grumms]

Even if NL were twice worse than he is, and you were twice as good as you are ;-) it would still be very inappropriate to give such feedback. He didn't even ask for it. And you have zero idea about why he plays the way he plays. It's not constructive.

Still I wish we meet in Germany ;-)

It does not change the fact that Zyre03 is very unlikely to fit such a technique, whatever the reasons of this technique is.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

I was whatsapp on what is happening in this thread, just had to come and have a look myself.

When people say they can’t use H3, everybody talks about the right or wrong technique.

This is true to any rubber, your technique gives you limitations on how best the rubber can work for you. Why is this rubber any different?

And having been involved with a player changing from D09C to V15 sticky on BH recently, yes - technique adjustments is required too.

But then again- with all due respect to many here, TTD is not semi pro or pro space, so you bound to have lower level players and with that, completely different experiences and views on equipment.

The part of para players - well, I know a few that would use what feels good for them, but then the ones I know are medalist at the Paralympics and train close to full time and have coaches specializing in they disability and have different techniques to make things work. Some of the para players are as good as semi pro to pro players.

And to be honest, the rubber is only out for how long, and there is just so much voice here. Some take at least a week of adjustments or about 30-40 hours of play to know if rubber is working. And working is not by practice, but by matches too.
Some pros, takes longer to conclude if it works or not (hence you see them with different gears and change after a while by public views view wtt matches).

This is also why I don’t take too much from review videos.
People love to hear good things and not so much on the bad and that is what a lot of youtubers will focus on. Im a bit more direct and will call the bad when I see it.

I feel it is still too early to conclude this rubber, and different players are going to have different opinions and some have styles that are not suited- I heard the reasoning on why one won’t change and it makes sense and how he choose to remain d05 + d09c due to how he wishes the ball to travel and arc in.

 

[NextLevel]

Its a miracle. I put the rubber on a Hadraw VK and i can now play with it. It's a miracle! As in play a tournament game with it if pressed. I can see why the defenders love it so much - it makes their slower blades offensive lol.

EDIT: this was my post to one of my clubs WhatsApp groups.

"Got a breakthrough with Zyre today. Put it on a classic 5 ply and it behaved well. Not like a $110 rubber but well enough that I can see what it does in the hands of a player who can get the rubber to play softer. It has this massive pillow effect where you literally see the ball take an eternity in table tennis rally time to get released. When it happens the spin is massive. Anyone with a slower blade will see a massive improvement in spin and speed using if they have the touch. Not sure i have the patience and stamina to play with it on the current blade but I will probably try it again on aomething slightly faster in the near future. The topsheet still looks like I never used it lol."

 

[NextLevel]

It does not change the fact that Zyre03 is very unlikely to fit such a technique, whatever the reasons of this technique is.

I hope we meet in Germany too. I will be able to learn a lot about technique from experts like yourself. What is your ranking in France?

 

[merlin el mago]

Its a miracle. I put the rubber on a Hadraw VK and i can now play with it. It's a miracle! As in play a tournament game with it if pressed. I can see why the defenders love it so much - it makes their slower blades offensive lol.

EDIT: this was my post to one of my clubs WhatsApp groups.

"Got a breakthrough with Zyre today. Put it on a classic 5 ply and it behaved well. Not like a $110 rubber but well enough that I can see what it does in the hands of a player who can get the rubber to play softer. It has this massive pillow effect where you literally see the ball take an eternity in table tennis rally time to get released. When it happens the spin is massive. Anyone with a slower blade will see a massive improvement in spin and speed using if they have the touch. Not sure i have the patience and stamina to play with it on the current blade but I will probably try it again on aomething slightly faster in the near future. The topsheet still looks like I never used it lol."

 

[merlin el mago]

I'm glad you followed my advice. I'm using with Stiga Infinity VPS and works very good.

 

[NextLevel]

I'm glad you followed my advice. I'm using with Stiga Infinity VPS and works very good.

You're welcome. For the record, @IB66 gave a similar recommendation and I usually try rubbers with blades of different stiffness to find what makes sense to me. It's clear to me though that for many players, they will struggle quite a bit to use this on anything faster than a Viscaria and some will need to go slower ro get the best effect or maybe try 2.5. But If they are already at Innerforce then good for them. I also wonder wherher the glassy feeling stays or it goes away with use and adjustment. I just feel now that I am playing with a pillow.

 

[Gozo Zyreruna]

Spoiler: Gozo has been playing with Zyre for sometime now.

Well, actually Gozo has been playing on his FH, a shorter pips and ultramax sponger for sometime now. Andro Rasanter EC to be exact, R48. So, you guys are actually johnny come lately...

 

[merlin el mago]

You're welcome. For the record, @IB66 gave a similar recommendation and I usually try rubbers with blades of different stiffness to find what makes sense to me. It's clear to me though that for many players, they will struggle quite a bit to use this on anything faster than a Viscaria and some will need to go slower ro get the best effect or maybe try 2.5. But If they are already at Innerforce then good for them. I also wonder wherher the glassy feeling stays or it goes away with use and adjustment. I just feel now that I am playing with a pillow.

I guess 2.5 will have less speed, more control & more or less the same spin, probably by the end of the month I will buy the 2.5 to test how it goes.

 

[TampaBayTableTennis]

any new feedback?

 

[Dr Evil]

Good results in my first couple of practice matches with Z03. I'm getting used to the feel, though it still doesn't inspire the confidence of 09C. It seems to be extremely stable, and I'd even describe it as safe, despite the speed and long trajectory. Any decent shot just seems to hit the table. When I missed, it was sometimes by a lot, but I didn't feel like my unforced error rate was any worse than usual with the exception of short pushes into the net, just like Kanak against Hugo. Unlike Kanak, I have the excuse of having played only a few hours with Z03, so a period of adjustment on touch shots is to be expected. Biggest advantage was on third and fifth balls, where the Z03 depth and speed made it easy to end points efficiently. More difficult to get sharp angles to land, however. Biggest disadvantage was on out of position shots, where the hard sponge provided little assistance, as you would expect. Will I stick with it for now? Yes. Will I buy another sheet? Not unless it outlasts D05 (so far it does look indestructible, but I worry that even a slight loss of grip might make it too hard to control). I think it's an excellent rubber, but for me the performance alone does not justify the price.

 

[blahness]

Good results in my first couple of practice matches with Z03. I'm getting used to the feel, though it still doesn't inspire the confidence of 09C. It seems to be extremely stable, and I'd even describe it as safe, despite the speed and long trajectory. Any decent shot just seems to hit the table. When I missed, it was sometimes by a lot, but I didn't feel like my unforced error rate was any worse than usual with the exception of short pushes into the net, just like Kanak against Hugo. Unlike Kanak, I have the excuse of having played only a few hours with Z03, so a period of adjustment on touch shots is to be expected. Biggest advantage was on third and fifth balls, where the Z03 depth and speed made it easy to end points efficiently. More difficult to get sharp angles to land, however. Biggest disadvantage was on out of position shots, where the hard sponge provided little assistance, as you would expect. Will I stick with it for now? Yes. Will I buy another sheet? Not unless it outlasts D05 (so far it does look indestructible, but I worry that even a slight loss of grip might make it too hard to control). I think it's an excellent rubber, but for me the performance alone does not justify the price.

Damn, sounds like maybe I should stick with D05 on my BH....

 

[NextLevel]

Good results in my first couple of practice matches with Z03. I'm getting used to the feel, though it still doesn't inspire the confidence of 09C. It seems to be extremely stable, and I'd even describe it as safe, despite the speed and long trajectory. Any decent shot just seems to hit the table. When I missed, it was sometimes by a lot, but I didn't feel like my unforced error rate was any worse than usual with the exception of short pushes into the net, just like Kanak against Hugo. Unlike Kanak, I have the excuse of having played only a few hours with Z03, so a period of adjustment on touch shots is to be expected. Biggest advantage was on third and fifth balls, where the Z03 depth and speed made it easy to end points efficiently. More difficult to get sharp angles to land, however. Biggest disadvantage was on out of position shots, where the hard sponge provided little assistance, as you would expect. Will I stick with it for now? Yes. Will I buy another sheet? Not unless it outlasts D05 (so far it does look indestructible, but I worry that even a slight loss of grip might make it too hard to control). I think it's an excellent rubber, but for me the performance alone does not justify the price.

This is almost certainly going to outlast anything, my sheet looks pristine. My next test is going to be on what I think is the slowest carbon butterfly blade I currently have (Garaydia ALC).

 

[merlin el mago]

Doesn't works in my old BTY Gionis Carbon All+

 

[sebi]

How come

 

[RefereeNumber2]

Good results in my first couple of practice matches with Z03. I'm getting used to the feel, though it still doesn't inspire the confidence of 09C. It seems to be extremely stable, and I'd even describe it as safe, despite the speed and long trajectory. Any decent shot just seems to hit the table. When I missed, it was sometimes by a lot, but I didn't feel like my unforced error rate was any worse than usual with the exception of short pushes into the net, just like Kanak against Hugo. Unlike Kanak, I have the excuse of having played only a few hours with Z03, so a period of adjustment on touch shots is to be expected. Biggest advantage was on third and fifth balls, where the Z03 depth and speed made it easy to end points efficiently. More difficult to get sharp angles to land, however. Biggest disadvantage was on out of position shots, where the hard sponge provided little assistance, as you would expect. Will I stick with it for now? Yes. Will I buy another sheet? Not unless it outlasts D05 (so far it does look indestructible, but I worry that even a slight loss of grip might make it too hard to control). I think it's an excellent rubber, but for me the performance alone does not justify the price.

I'll be interested to hear how you think it holds up over time. I've been skeptical about Butterfly's durability claims, not because I don't believe them but because they're only talking about the topsheet. Even if the topsheet lasted forever, the sponge still has a limited lifespan. Some say this is because of factory "boosting" , while I tend to think it's due to oxidation, but whatever the reason the spring sponge X noticeably degrades within a few months even if it's just sitting on the shelf (this is from my observations with 09c, not extensively/scientifically tested).

This isn't a Butterfly-specific problem (Butterfly rubbers are quite a bit better than ESN in this regard) but Zyre uses the same sponge so I don't see how it could be an improvement. OTOH, the sponge gets softer and slower (albeit less spinny) as it ages, so perhaps for many on here that would actually be an improvement.

 

[Catenaccio]

This is a link to an interview with two Butterfly employees who were involved in the development of Zyre 03

You need a subscription to Table Tennis Kingdom to read the full article. Apparently, Butterfly has been working on Zyre 03 since 2020. By using some type of simulation technology, they were able to speed up the development without having to (initially) make prototypes. One of the biggest challenges is to encourage players to actually use the prototype, which is necessary for feedback.

 

[po-stit]

This is a link to an interview with two Butterfly employees who were involved in the development of Zyre 03

You need a subscription to Table Tennis Kingdom to read the full article. Apparently, Butterfly has been working on Zyre 03 since 2020. By using some type of simulation technology, they were able to speed up the development without having to (initially) make prototypes. One of the biggest challenges is to encourage players to actually use the prototype, which is necessary for feedback.

Like Finite Element Analysis? I would expect it for them to be using that for a while. Do they specify what kind of simulation are they using?