Daily Table Tennis Chit Chat

[suds79]

As promised, here's my full match vs Daniel (USATT 2071)

He took this match 3-1.

Some of my thoughts or impressions:
- A lot of sloppy serves on my part. When I watch overall how high they are, I have a lot of loose serves that get away from me either being a fault or too high & easy to attack.
- I also probably used my punch serve a little too much. Maybe should have used my pendulum serve more which is more spiny. Nonetheless, need to get the serves lower & change the pace. They're all about medium to fast speed. Not too many really short or slow ones or a really fast one (which I struggle to be able to execute)
- Service receive. I suppose credit to daniel here because there are some replays I watch here I see as baskspin but I push and it's a mile high. He must do a good job of selling backspin but giving me deadballs. I probably could simplify my service game to incorporate more simple backspin & dead mix ups trying to make them look the same.
- Think I need to table that RPB over the table loop for now. Was like 10% if that on it. Had just as many TPB attacks on serve with far fewer attempts. Perhaps I should stick to that. That's been a struggle of mine trying to figure out where to go with that because if I use my TPB too much and don't use my RPB (which has a lot more power) I feel i get to passive and players know to go there vs hitting to my FH. Maybe I should focus just on TPB on sesrvice receive. Not sure. IDK.

Curious to hear what you guys think.

But I think if I clean up serves. Get them lower. Develop some kind of better, lower push game on service receive, that'd probably help a lot.

Thoughts?

Thanks.

PS - also make sure your youtube settings are on 1080p which this was filmed in. For some reason when I use to keep it on auto, it'd put it at a lower resolution for me.

 

[ttmonster]

The lower resolution thing happens when the internet speed keeps bumping up and down ... it played in 1080 p for me .... I watched the whole thing, lost a bit of focus towards the end but yes in general I think you are serving too long .. and you should practice a whole lot of third ball attacks .. and may be a little more conscious about the grip pressure attachment ... and both of you were really playing a lot of long serves to know how good you guys are in the short game ...

 

[suds79]

The lower resolution thing happens when the internet speed keeps bumping up and down ... it played in 1080 p for me .... I watched the whole thing, lost a bit of focus towards the end but yes in general I think you are serving too long .. and you should practice a whole lot of third ball attacks .. and may be a little more conscious about the grip pressure attachment ... and both of you were really playing a lot of long serves to know how good you guys are in the short game ...

Yes for sure lack of focus. I spotted him 4-5 early points that last game, which ended up being somewhat close. If I don't let my guard down coming off a game win there, maybe I snag a 2nd win and really get him on tilt thinking "what's going on here?". Just that maturity and knowing when to capitalize type of thing.

And definitely yes that I'm serving too long too much. Really need to practice short serves and also short either pure side or occasional side/top serves to punish what I will imagine by most players reaction will be to push against a short serve.

lol. As I watch that match, I'm struck by how rushed & too fast my simple setup seems into the point. Maybe a pause before I go and actually make sure i'm getting the spin & height of serve i'm looking for. Just seemed to me. Bounce the ball on the table, lean over & serve all in a rush.

 

[OldschoolPenholder]

Thanks for sharing suds! I cannot watch now... will watch later.

As promised, here's my full match vs Daniel (USATT 2071)

He took this match 3-1.

Being able to take 1 game off of a 2000 player, i may ask you for service AND 10 points instead! LOl at me.

Some of my thoughts or impressions:
- I also probably used my punch serve a little too much.

Not familiar with 'punch serve' - will watch later to find out. I may call it something differently.

Maybe should have used my pendulum serve more which is more spiny. Nonetheless, need to get the serves lower & change the pace. They're all about medium to fast speed. Not too many really short or slow ones or a really fast one (which I struggle to be able to execute)

Generally serve placement is just as important as serve spin and/or speed.

- Service receive. I suppose credit to daniel here because there are some replays I watch here I see as baskspin but I push and it's a mile high. He must do a good job of selling backspin but giving me deadballs. I probably could simplify my service game to incorporate more simple backspin & dead mix ups trying to make them look the same.

One of my weaknesses. Played Der over a year ago, he served topspin on his 1st and then for his 2nd he served downspin. I wasn't smart enough to figure out that Der stuck to this pattern and I misread his serves quite a few times. When I played NL and Carl, I misread a lot also - they added in the nospin serves.

- Think I need to table that RPB over the table loop for now. Was like 10% if that on it.

May be offbase with a comment here given I didn't watch the match yet, however, not sure if your comment is based only on playing a 2000 player or not. Will take it on surface level and comment that you were playing a 2000, so perhaps keep at the RPB loop. You were only 10% on it vs a 2000 player. [EDIT: how are you with the RPB loop vs players of your caliber and players a little lower than you?]

... Maybe I should focus just on TPB on sesrvice receive. Not sure. IDK.

Curious to hear what you guys think.

I will comment that I am trying out RPB only because RPB adds a BH loop to my arsenal. One weakness of the TPB style generally is heavy service receive on BH side... i 'eat' a lot of misread topspin serves and popped them all up ... heavy backspin, i sometimes cannot float or push back. Having the RPB loop is an awesome counter to those serves for me.

Hope this helps somewhat. Looking forward to watching your match later when freer.

~osph

 

[OldschoolPenholder]

Went to the club last night. Usually i go weds nights, but schedule changed and will be going on tuesday nights. may add another night, either mon or thurs very soon.

Last night, didn't have 'it'. Hit with mostly players at my level or lower. Many members showed up last night. Was a little wiped out after 90 mins or so. An excuse is inexcusable at times, but the fact was there was a slight discomfort in my left hip -- hampened my mobility a little and my mobility wasn't the best to begin with.

Should've went home. Decided to hang out a bit and wait on a table that had players a bit better than me. I was somewhat cooled down when it was my turn. Played a JPen who has a BH smash! Didn't realize he had LP on his backside until one point he used it which came back super high and OSPH does what OSPH does ... he smashed it luckily for a winner. That shout down his LP ideas for the rest of the match lol

Despite knowing I rush myself, and despite me slowing down for this match, my left hip was distracting and i lost easily 3 straight. I should've made some FH loops, but didn't. I made some RPB loops, enough so to encourage me to continue RPB looping!

Both the JPen I played and his previous opponent before me commented that i had good serves. The previous opponent I've played before ages ago, since then haven't had a chance to play him, but he knows my game well enough. Says I have good service but I rush myself. Told me to slow down. Last night he added that he knows I can FH loop and yet I missed some and some I didn't even go for. I didn't mention i was beat as well as left hip. Upon reflection though, I may or may not be able to beat the JPen but I probably can have had closer games instead of losing at 5 or 6.

Despite not having 'it' overall last night, pleased that i knowingly slowed down my game, and got some RPB loops in.

 

[ttmonster]

Suds , I agree both of you rushed through your game ... one thing to remember always is that for some players its a strategy to rush you , for some thats they way they play ... you should always slow down and think about what you are going to do with your third ball , or serve receive ... e.g I atleast try to think of two possibilities to for my serve and what my reaction is going to be ... and in general , when I remember , I keep telling my self to keep the paddle up when receiving serves , or the 4th ball in doubles and keep the wrist loose ... I think you could also look at the grip pressure adjustments that we have talked so much in this forum ... a favorite topic of Meister Der_Echte ....

 

[42andbackpains]

Skipped a week of my regular Saturday coaching because i took a cortisone shot to my back and it was still feeling a little sore 3 days later. Finally played this last Saturday and felt i was in the zone when i was doing backhand loops from underspin mulitball. But that only lasted for a couple of minutes before i was tired out.

I have been making technical adjustments in my forehand loop for a eternity. My coach pointed out i always shift my weight from left to right with too much force and my loops lose a little power and arc because i end up lunging or stepping to the left. My body force or power in not directed forward. Because my force carries too much too the left, my arm swings also goes across my body too much. So my coach tell me to consciously take a small step forward when i loop forehand. I noticed right away my ball had more forward power and my ball was arcing/dipping more into the table. This little technical adjustment solved a issue that was bothering me for a very long time. Glad my coach help me figure it out.

 

[OldschoolPenholder]

I have been making technical adjustments in my forehand loop for a eternity. My coach pointed out i always shift my weight from left to right with too much force and my loops lose a little power and arc because i end up lunging or stepping to the left. My body force or power in not directed forward. Because my force carries too much too the left, my arm swings also goes across my body too much. So my coach tell me to consciously take a small step forward when i loop forehand. I noticed right away my ball had more forward power and my ball was arcing/dipping more into the table. This little technical adjustment solved a issue that was bothering me for a very long time. Glad my coach help me figure it out.

Excellent progress 42&bp! When we old men get together with the other old men from the TT crew, I'll ask you for 10 points, 2 games AND the serve!

Seriously though, glad to hear you got your cortisone shot and playing relatively pain-free again!

 

[Loopadoop]

suds79 regarding your match with Daniel losing 1-3

Simply stated - service returns weakness - clean it up ..

 

[NextLevel]

As promised, here's my full match vs Daniel (USATT 2071)

He took this match 3-1.

Some of my thoughts or impressions:
- A lot of sloppy serves on my part. When I watch overall how high they are, I have a lot of loose serves that get away from me either being a fault or too high & easy to attack.
- I also probably used my punch serve a little too much. Maybe should have used my pendulum serve more which is more spiny. Nonetheless, need to get the serves lower & change the pace. They're all about medium to fast speed. Not too many really short or slow ones or a really fast one (which I struggle to be able to execute)
- Service receive. I suppose credit to daniel here because there are some replays I watch here I see as baskspin but I push and it's a mile high. He must do a good job of selling backspin but giving me deadballs. I probably could simplify my service game to incorporate more simple backspin & dead mix ups trying to make them look the same.
- Think I need to table that RPB over the table loop for now. Was like 10% if that on it. Had just as many TPB attacks on serve with far fewer attempts. Perhaps I should stick to that. That's been a struggle of mine trying to figure out where to go with that because if I use my TPB too much and don't use my RPB (which has a lot more power) I feel i get to passive and players know to go there vs hitting to my FH. Maybe I should focus just on TPB on sesrvice receive. Not sure. IDK.

Curious to hear what you guys think.

But I think if I clean up serves. Get them lower. Develop some kind of better, lower push game on service receive, that'd probably help a lot.

Thoughts?

Thanks.

PS - also make sure your youtube settings are on 1080p which this was filmed in. For some reason when I use to keep it on auto, it'd put it at a lower resolution for me.

Don't know your rating or how tuned in Dan was but given that he was celebrating, he is obviously scared of your game and you played pretty well.

A lot of inexperience in there - after you popped up the first push returning his serve or even the first two, you should have been on alert to look more closely at his motion. He preyed on the fact that most players who aren't used to receiving short serves tend to think that short sidespin, nospin or sidetop is backspin and then pop it up.That said, there is no guarantee that you would have won those points with proper returns. I suspect he likes topspin balls but you could have pushed those balls better or flicked them if you had taken time to read them.

Your forehand is very strong and you need practice setting it up if you are comfortable with your current forehand motion. That generates a lot of racket head speed and you should be able to get lots of points if you can get the right serve returns and anticipate them - that of course needs a lot of serve practice that puts your serve and your opponent in a box so that the returns are one of a few that you expect and you can put away.

I would add some more sidespin pushes and similarly off beat returns.

Your serve game was good - he wasn't killing most of the serves but with a few exceptions, when he attacked them, you were ready to counter the return and that is just as critical as the serve it self. With the exceptions, the serves needed to be placed in a box based on where he was standing and you didn't try to do that. Most lefties have the short wide pendulum to the the righty forehand, the long wide pendulum to the righty forehand, and the down the line to the righty backhand to hold the righty if he cheats over to cover the wide. I think developing and tightening all 3 so that they put the opponent in a box would be good. You can also serve top the middle of the table from the middle of the table to reduce the wide angles if an opponent is too comfortable hitting your wide forehand because you are too late getting there.

Just learn to segment your use of the wrist and elbow in your forehand strokes so that you can get to balls late and see them before looping them and make your game tighter.

 

[ttmonster]

NextLevel is already in Christmas spirits !

Don't know your rating or how tuned in Dan was but given that he was celebrating, he is obviously scared of your game and you played pretty well.

A lot of inexperience in there - after you popped up the first push returning his serve or even the first two, you should have been on alert to look more closely at his motion. He preyed on the fact that most players who aren't used to receiving short serves tend to think that short sidespin, nospin or sidetop is backspin and then pop it up.That said, there is no guarantee that you would have won those points with proper returns. I suspect he likes topspin balls but you could have pushed those balls better or flicked them if you had taken time to read them.

Your forehand is very strong and you need practice setting it up if you are comfortable with your current forehand motion. That generates a lot of racket head speed and you should be able to get lots of points if you can get the right serve returns and anticipate them - that of course needs a lot of serve practice that puts your serve and your opponent in a box so that the returns are one of a few that you expect and you can put away.

I would add some more sidespin pushes and similarly off beat returns.

Your serve game was good - he wasn't killing most of the serves but with a few exceptions, when he attacked them, you were ready to counter the return and that is just as critical as the serve it self. With the exceptions, the serves needed to be placed in a box based on where he was standing and you didn't try to do that. Most lefties have the short wide pendulum to the the righty forehand, the long wide pendulum to the righty forehand, and the down the line to the righty backhand to hold the righty if he cheats over to cover the wide. I think developing and tightening all 3 so that they put the opponent in a box would be good. You can also serve top the middle of the table from the middle of the table to reduce the wide angles if an opponent is too comfortable hitting your wide forehand because you are too late getting there.

Just learn to segment your use of the wrist and elbow in your forehand strokes so that you can get to balls late and see them before looping them and make your game tighter.

 

[OldschoolPenholder]

NextLevel is already in Christmas spirits !

IMO, you, NL, Carl, Der and a few others are always "Santa Claus"!!

 

[ttmonster]

Honestly speaking Carl, NL and Der_Echte are the real inspiration ... I know we sometimes they get busy fighting the goon squad and spreading the lore of their success ... we are just sant's elves ... luckily there is no DA lurking around here and that has made the place such a treat

IMO, you, NL, Carl, Der and a few others are always "Santa Claus"!!

 

[NextLevel]

Update on my EJing to get a faster blade - I really don't know how to play with a faster blade. I have tried again and I know that because of my limited mobility, I definitely need one, likely with a spinny rubber like Evolution MX-S, in order to compete with better players. Or maybe just something different but you get the idea.

But I used the Nexy Calix 2 as part of a test and blade review by Nexy and I played better. I even tested an Aruna, which might be the slowest blade used by a pro player out in the market today, and I played better again. Now, playing better, compared to my recent results mess, is merely playing around 2000 level, and there might be other factors in play here like improving health and mobility, lighter and better rubber etc. But the bottom line is I am going to postpone my attempts to use a faster rubber and blade until after the NA Teams. I don't want to piss away points in frustration because I can't control my pushes and blocks when I could just humble myself and use a slower blade until further notice.

 

[OldschoolPenholder]

Interesting NL! Good luck and have fun!

I'm not sure if it's me not being fast enough with reflexes or if the American Hinoki is a faster blade

Lately I'm noticing I cannot adjust to net balls or edge balls... i move my hand/racket to return the ball, it hits net/edge and i cannot compensate/adjust my motion in time. Prior to AH blade, I used to be able to get to, i don't know, 25-50% of the balls? Now it's 0%. Am I older and not as mentally fluid? Or physically lost some speed? or using a fast blade in the American Hinoki? A mixture of the 3 factors?

Rhetorical question really. Just a curiosity i've noticed since using the AH exclusively

 

[Ilia Minkin]

lol. As I watch that match, I'm struck by how rushed & too fast my simple setup seems into the point. Maybe a pause before I go and actually make sure i'm getting the spin & height of serve i'm looking for. Just seemed to me. Bounce the ball on the table, lean over & serve all in a rush.

I think that staring at the ball for a few seconds before the toss helps to focus on the serve. I often find that when I rush too much, it kills the service quality. During those seconds I try to make sure I am relaxed.

 

[ttmonster]

OSP , don't worry about this , I think its a function of being tight and having a little less confidence in your shots... when I was practicing regularly with coaches, I could see that I would miss these balls when coming back from a long layover and as I started playing more and more and got my confidence back on my shots , it used to come back magically

Interesting NL! Good luck and have fun!

I'm not sure if it's me not being fast enough with reflexes or if the American Hinoki is a faster blade

Lately I'm noticing I cannot adjust to net balls or edge balls... i move my hand/racket to return the ball, it hits net/edge and i cannot compensate/adjust my motion in time. Prior to AH blade, I used to be able to get to, i don't know, 25-50% of the balls? Now it's 0%. Am I older and not as mentally fluid? Or physically lost some speed? or using a fast blade in the American Hinoki? A mixture of the 3 factors?

Rhetorical question really. Just a curiosity i've noticed since using the AH exclusively

 

[suds79]

But I used the Nexy Calix 2 as part of a test and blade review by Nexy and I played better. I even tested an Aruna, which might be the slowest blade used by a pro player out in the market today, and I played better again.

Different experiences for players at different levels.

Given my intermediate level, I really high on my more controlled, more spiny (flexy) Gambler Fire Dragon Touch coming form my more stiff and faster Stiga Clipper. I couldn't be happier with the results.

I've told myself over & over that if I was playing at or constantly facing players say 2100 and above, yeah maybe the more powerful person would win of which blade speed & rubber speed matters. But for me? Generally the person who makes the fewest mistakes and is the most consistent wins.

Might be different for you but you did just acknowledge you play better with slower stuff.

But again different things for different players. I generally play pretty close to the table and rarely play well off the table. if I did, perhaps I'd want more speed.

 

[ajtatosmano2]

The child of my coach practiced on the next table with his mother (both parents are TT players). He is 7 years old. They counted the forehand drives during warmup. These were normal FH drives, not pro player fast but they had a decent speed and they weren't high. 10....20.....30......50.....110.......340.....this was the last what I've heard because I had a tough match during that, but they continued it for a while after 340...insane.

 

[confiscate]

Different experiences for players at different levels.

Given my intermediate level, I really high on my more controlled, more spiny (flexy) Gambler Fire Dragon Touch coming form my more stiff and faster Stiga Clipper. I couldn't be happier with the results.

I've told myself over & over that if I was playing at or constantly facing players say 2100 and above, yeah maybe the more powerful person would win of which blade speed & rubber speed matters. But for me? Generally the person who makes the fewest mistakes and is the most consistent wins.

Might be different for you but you did just acknowledge you play better with slower stuff.

But again different things for different players. I generally play pretty close to the table and rarely play well off the table. if I did, perhaps I'd want more speed.

Nice to see another lefty penholder like me Don't see that too often these days, if at all