Daily Table Tennis Chit Chat

[Tony's Table Tennis]

First time in a decade I see a thread locked
I guess the flag post is too sensitive for TTD @Dan ?

https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/forum/topics/can-you-guys-see-taiwans-flag-on-your-phone.33948/

heated discussion removed, I can understand.
links to emoji-pedia removed? what violation was that?

 

[NextLevel]

First time in a decade I see a thread locked
I guess the flag post is too sensitive for TTD @Dan ?

https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/forum/topics/can-you-guys-see-taiwans-flag-on-your-phone.33948/

Just reach out to Carl - that said, this is a TT Forum, we stay safer as a TT forum when we stick to TT and avoid politics though that is hard when politics is a part of international life and TT is an international sport in the deepest way.

 

[TampaBayTableTennis]

there is a paywall to watch ITTF Americas qualification? seems odd.

 

[NextLevel]

there is a paywall to watch ITTF Americas qualification? seems odd.

where is the link?

 

[latej]

Aside from working on this, I also did some FHs with the H3 OS 37 degrees. I gotta say, I really don't like this rubber. Maybe it's not boosted enough, it just feels so dead. It feels like it just absorbs all the energy you're putting into the shot. The H3 OS 40, unboosted, at least feels like it's transmitting the energy to your blade, even if it's not really doing anything for you in terms of holding and catapulting the ball, but the 37 degrees just absorbs all the energy. I'm gonna boost it to hell and see if that works better lol.

That is strange. How can you feel that way. When the sponge is hard enough, I don't have the feeling of wasting energy on the FH side, because the hardness allows the tangential impact to be converted also to spin, and not bottom out - which would not convert to spin, but rather to speed and also lead to lower throw (speaking of FH strong impact). Sometimes also weak or strange top-sheet gives me this feeling (it was so in case of Victas TDE). But the hardness H37 absorbing all the energy - I don't understand it. Perhaps you are simply using different words than I do. H37 would, on harder tangential hits, be incapable of capturing the spin. It would bottom out. When I mentioned lower throw - that is also why they rotate to H37 on smashes, there is 1. more bottoming -> more speed and 2. less direction deviation (another expression of lower throw), those 2 points are intertwined. Anyway, my problem with H3 OS H37 on the BH was that it was slow in exchanges. Better players would not have this issue and would thus be able to appreciate the other benefits of H3 OS H37. I don't, now.

 

[NextLevel]

That is strange. How can you feel that way. When the sponge is hard enough, I don't have the feeling of wasting energy on the FH side, because the hardness allows the tangential impact to be converted also to spin, and not bottom out - which would not convert to spin, but rather to speed and also lead to lower throw (speaking of FH strong impact). Sometimes also weak or strange top-sheet gives me this feeling (it was so in case of Victas TDE). But the hardness H37 absorbing all the energy - I don't understand it. Perhaps you are simply using different words than I do. H37 would, on harder tangential hits, be incapable of capturing the spin. It would bottom out. When I mentioned lower throw - that is also why they rotate to H37 on smashes, there is 1. more bottoming -> more speed and 2. less direction deviation (another expression of lower throw), those 2 points are intertwined. Anyway, my problem with H3 OS H37 on the BH was that it was slow in exchanges. Better players would not have this issue and would thus be able to appreciate the other benefits of H3 OS H37. I don't, now.

If I used 37 degree sponge and I boosted it, I would probably hate the result. Just buy Rakza Z instead and call it a day if that is what you want to do.

 

[latej]

If I used 37 degree sponge and I boosted it, I would probably hate the result. Just buy Rakza Z instead and call it a day if that is what you want to do.

;-) hmm, I wish I reach the level where I can honestly say, H37 boosted is the optimal BH rubber for me... far far far away ;-)

But Rakza Z, no thanks. I tried that. I dislike it on both sides. On the BH, I very much prefer the Rakza X, directer, much better for exchanges, for blocking, enough grip on openings, really great BH rubber. On the FH, the RZ is too soft. But the RZ EH on the FH is pretty good, the hardness fits, it is a bit more elastic than rubbers like H3 H41, Rxton 9, etc. so there was this certain hope that after opening and getting to exchange I would gain a benefit. But I miss the "dead" sponge feeling of Rxton9, H3, B2 on the FH, I gotta say it really is addictive... You NL, are f..., you have it on both sides... how can you play with it on the BH is incomprehensible for me though ;-) For me H37 or 47-48 is max on the BH.

 

[dingyibvs]

That is strange. How can you feel that way. When the sponge is hard enough, I don't have the feeling of wasting energy on the FH side, because the hardness allows the tangential impact to be converted also to spin, and not bottom out - which would not convert to spin, but rather to speed and also lead to lower throw (speaking of FH strong impact). Sometimes also weak or strange top-sheet gives me this feeling (it was so in case of Victas TDE). But the hardness H37 absorbing all the energy - I don't understand it. Perhaps you are simply using different words than I do. H37 would, on harder tangential hits, be incapable of capturing the spin. It would bottom out. When I mentioned lower throw - that is also why they rotate to H37 on smashes, there is 1. more bottoming -> more speed and 2. less direction deviation (another expression of lower throw), those 2 points are intertwined. Anyway, my problem with H3 OS H37 on the BH was that it was slow in exchanges. Better players would not have this issue and would thus be able to appreciate the other benefits of H3 OS H37. I don't, now.

You misunderstood me. I agree with your assessment and listed that as a positive for the unboosted H3 40 OS, that it transmits the power well on more direct drives. The H3 37 doesn't do that, yet it also has no catapult on more tangential hits. It's great if you just want to play a slow spin game, but not anything else. I'm guessing that pros using H3 37 and 38 aren't looking for that, so I'm thinking that they must boost it significantly more.

I've since slapped on 2 more layers of booster onto both the H3 37 OS and H3 40 BS, and I'll try them out maybe tomorrow.

 

[NextLevel]

;-) hmm, I wish I reach the level where I can honestly say, H37 boosted is the optimal BH rubber for me... far far far away ;-)

But Rakza Z, no thanks. I tried that. I dislike it on both sides. On the BH, I very much prefer the Rakza X, directer, much better for exchanges, for blocking, enough grip on openings, really great BH rubber. On the FH, the RZ is too soft. But the RZ EH on the FH is pretty good, the hardness fits, it is a bit more elastic than rubbers like H3 H41, Rxton 9, etc. so there was this certain hope that after opening and getting to exchange I would gain a benefit. But I miss the "dead" sponge feeling of Rxton9, H3, B2 on the FH, I gotta say it really is addictive... You NL, are f..., you have it on both sides... how can you play with it on the BH is incomprehensible for me though ;-) For me H37 or 47-48 is max on the BH.

I don't back off the table and I have become too addicted to stickiness to play without it unless I am forced to. Backhand topspin is also a level-relative strength, probably nothing special to a pro, but for a player at my level, most people are pushing when I am spinning.

 

[latej]

You misunderstood me. I agree with your assessment and listed that as a positive for the unboosted H3 40 OS, that it transmits the power well on more direct drives. The H3 37 doesn't do that, yet it also has no catapult on more tangential hits. It's great if you just want to play a slow spin game, but not anything else. I'm guessing that pros using H3 37 and 38 aren't looking for that, so I'm thinking that they must boost it significantly more.

OK, I see... I've heard people say that H3 H40 or so transmits power well on direct drives, you're not the first one... But that is not what I feel, for me H37 transmits power/speed on direct drives better the H40/H41... And relatedly, H40/H41 are better for me for FH blocking than H37, they absorb more... I understand that some would disagree... The H40 and more, they transmit spin on tangential hits more for me, I have this feeling of NOT wasting energy on hard topspin hits with those (with harder sponges)... I hate this feeling of wasting energy with soft sponges on the FH... I agree that H3 H37 doesn't have much catapult, on both direct and tangential impact... Sometimes words are not aligned... Sorry

Why pros are using H37/H38 on the BH I'm not able to comprehend ;-) I think they are capable of generating speed at will if they need, that they are able to generate spin, to change rhytm, to have extra control on receive and opening... in other words they simply don't need the extra speed given by the rubbers I like to use...

I've since slapped on 2 more layers of booster onto both the H3 37 OS and H3 40 BS, and I'll try them out maybe tomorrow.

The original images looked very sexy. With 2 more layers, wow, this will be hard to glue ;-) Isn't D09C too hard on the BH for you?

I don't back off the table and I have become too addicted to stickiness to play without it unless I am forced to. Backhand topspin is also a level-relative strength, probably nothing special to a pro, but for a player at my level, most people are pushing when I am spinning.

Exactly, but BH topspin opening against backspin with H3 H41, isn't it too hard? For me here both the sponge and top-sheet hardness matters. E.g. I tried BH openings against backspin with Hammond Z2, and the top-sheet is simply too hard. The sponge would be acceptable, but together, no, can't do it. H3 top-sheet is OK, but hardness H41 for BH openings? Wow...

 

[NextLevel]

OK, I see... I've heard people say that H3 H40 or so transmits power well on direct drives, you're not the first one... But that is not what I feel, for me H37 transmits power/speed on direct drives better the H40/H41... And relatedly, H40/H41 are better for me for FH blocking than H37, they absorb more... I understand that some would disagree... The H40 and more, they transmit spin on tangential hits more for me, I have this feeling of NOT wasting energy on hard topspin hits with those (with harder sponges)... I hate this feeling of wasting energy with soft sponges on the FH... I agree that H3 H37 doesn't have much catapult, on both direct and tangential impact... Sometimes words are not aligned... Sorry

Why pros are using H37/H38 on the BH I'm not able to comprehend ;-) I think they are capable of generating speed at will if they need, that they are able to generate spin, to change rhytm, to have extra control on receive and opening... in other words they simply don't need the extra speed given by the rubbers I like to use...



The original images looked very sexy. With 2 more layers, wow, this will be hard to glue ;-) Isn't D09C too hard on the BH for you?



Exactly, but BH topspin opening against backspin with H3 H41, isn't it too hard? For me here both the sponge and top-sheet hardness matters. E.g. I tried BH openings against backspin with Hammond Z2, and the top-sheet is simply too hard. The sponge would be acceptable, but together, no, can't do it. H3 top-sheet is OK, but hardness H41 for BH openings? Wow...

I really do not understand what you are talking about ... like I said, it might not be best for me, but I do what I like to do lol. I did buy a 38 degree OS and a 41 degree BS for a test one day but I haven't decided when to finalize and put on a blade.

 

[TampaBayTableTennis]

where is the link?

it is viewable through the ITTF Americas app, $15 for the 4-day coverage

 

[dingyibvs]

OK, I see... I've heard people say that H3 H40 or so transmits power well on direct drives, you're not the first one... But that is not what I feel, for me H37 transmits power/speed on direct drives better the H40/H41... And relatedly, H40/H41 are better for me for FH blocking than H37, they absorb more... I understand that some would disagree... The H40 and more, they transmit spin on tangential hits more for me, I have this feeling of NOT wasting energy on hard topspin hits with those (with harder sponges)... I hate this feeling of wasting energy with soft sponges on the FH... I agree that H3 H37 doesn't have much catapult, on both direct and tangential impact... Sometimes words are not aligned... Sorry

Why pros are using H37/H38 on the BH I'm not able to comprehend ;-) I think they are capable of generating speed at will if they need, that they are able to generate spin, to change rhytm, to have extra control on receive and opening... in other words they simply don't need the extra speed given by the rubbers I like to use...



The original images looked very sexy. With 2 more layers, wow, this will be hard to glue ;-) Isn't D09C too hard on the BH for you?



Exactly, but BH topspin opening against backspin with H3 H41, isn't it too hard? For me here both the sponge and top-sheet hardness matters. E.g. I tried BH openings against backspin with Hammond Z2, and the top-sheet is simply too hard. The sponge would be acceptable, but together, no, can't do it. H3 top-sheet is OK, but hardness H41 for BH openings? Wow...

They've basically flattened out already, so 2 more layers will just get them back to how curved they were, and hopefully flatten it out a bit more. I'll probably glue them on today, then play with them tomorrow.

The D09c isn't too hard, though 2 layers of FTL softens them up and make it a good bit more explosive, with the sponge easier to access. It already felt the best of the various Dignics, Tenergies, and Hurricanes I've tried on the BH side, now it really feels amazing, like the grip of Dignics combined with the accessible sponge of the Tenergies. It's still very controllable in the short game, but long pushes where the sponge starts to be activated is a lot faster now so I need to be careful with that.

 

[latej]

I really do not understand what you are talking about ... like I said, it might not be best for me, but I do what I like to do lol. I did buy a 38 degree OS and a 41 degree BS for a test one day but I haven't decided when to finalize and put on a blade.

Sorry NL, I didn't want to sound controversial... I just thought you'd explain why so hard on the BH... It fits you, that is all that matters.

 

[latej]

They've basically flattened out already, so 2 more layers will just get them back to how curved they were, and hopefully flatten it out a bit more. I'll probably glue them on today, then play with them tomorrow.

The D09c isn't too hard, though 2 layers of FTL softens them up and make it a good bit more explosive, with the sponge easier to access. It already felt the best of the various Dignics, Tenergies, and Hurricanes I've tried on the BH side, now it really feels amazing, like the grip of Dignics combined with the accessible sponge of the Tenergies. It's still very controllable in the short game, but long pushes where the sponge starts to be activated is a lot faster now so I need to be careful with that.

Fantastic. Good to hear. Most higher level players here use D05 on the BH, I thought D09C would be a bit too hard... Again, you like it, all that matters...

 

[NextLevel]

Sorry NL, I didn't want to sound controversial... I just thought you'd explain why so hard on the BH... It fits you, that is all that matters.

No apologies, I just don't think to hard about equipment, I like wasting money on it and having an opinion on it, but I know that most of the playing level I want to get to is based on skills so equipment is usually an experiment in curiosity. I just have never really enjoyed playing with different rubbers on both sides, though I have considered doing it and twiddling. Most of my technique is an attempt to make my forehand play like my backhand. I first used tacky rubber seriously on my backhand with Big Dipper in 2014/2015 or so and it was the first time I could play with the plastic ball. I later went back regular grippy rubbers (with T05H and Fastarc C1 and D09c as the one tacky rubber I tried) when the balls became more reliable but then I took a long pause from the game because of lots of things (marriage, kids, injuries etc.) then I came back and I realized that everything I used was too slow to beat certain players. But when I tried faster stuff, I realized I needed something sticky again and then I tried Golden Tango and tried to use the softer version on the backhand, but I preferred the harder version on both sides (even my practice partner said that my ball was higher quality with the harder version). So since then, I have just stuck with the sticky stuff even though I had brief stint with Dignics 05. But for the level I currently play, I can make sticky stuff work for sure. This was me with Golden Tango. It is pretty much how my game looks with Hurricane.

 

[blahness]

Well, it shouldn't if your next shot is gonna be a BH shot. Throughout the practice today, I actually found it rather difficult to land with my right foot forward, even when I really tried. I think the issue is that my robot needs to be set to the center, so the wide-FH shot is really wide. When I have to leap that far with my left foot I'm not able to rotate my body enough to have my right foot land forward.

Aside from working on this, I also did some FHs with the H3 OS 37 degrees. I gotta say, I really don't like this rubber. Maybe it's not boosted enough, it just feels so dead. It feels like it just absorbs all the energy you're putting into the shot. The H3 OS 40, unboosted, at least feels like it's transmitting the energy to your blade, even if it's not really doing anything for you in terms of holding and catapulting the ball, but the 37 degrees just absorbs all the energy. I'm gonna boost it to hell and see if that works better lol. Either way, I think I'm sticking with some form of D09c on my BH side. I boosted one more sheet with just 1 layer of FTL, plan to try it out on my FH side since I can already hit into the sponge relatively well with my FH and I wouldn't want it to be too bouncy. The 2 layer boosted for the BH side feels very good already and is on the edge of bounciness that I'd like.

Regardless of what shot you choose, i believe the correct way is to land on the left foot, and then push off the right foot to recover back to the table in a balanced position - from that position you can do BH or FH. Pechpong had an excellent video on it See 2:32 here

 

[dingyibvs]

Regardless of what shot you choose, i believe the correct way is to land on the left foot, and then push off the right foot to recover back to the table in a balanced position - from that position you can do BH or FH. Pechpong had an excellent video on it See 2:32 here

Hah, looks like not an issue for me then, my right foot is always behind, so just need to fix the landing with right foot first thing.

 

[NextLevel]

Hah, looks like not an issue for me then, my right foot is always behind, so just need to fix the landing with right foot first thing.

Yes, fix it. You hit the ball in the air sometimes if not all the time, but must land on the left foot. Sometimes the left foot crosses the right foot (cross footwork), sometimes it doesn't (semi-cross).

 

[dingyibvs]

Had a brief hit with the H3 BS 40 against the robot. After another 2 layers the sponge feels significantly softer. I remember trying out my clubmates' boosted H3 BS's, both 41 and 39 degrees, and both felt significantly softer than mine. Now it feels similar. Looped a few topspins and backspins against the robot, seems good, so we'll see how it plays tomorrow in training. After re-watching Yin Hang's video on how to boost, I think my booster layers weren't that thick. He emphasized to really brush hard onto the rubber, while I was brushing lightly, so a good bit of the booster oil stayed on the brush. My 4 layers is maybe more like 3 layers for the pros, and most of them play with 3-4 layers so that's probably the degree of softening up that I would need to be able to hit through the sponge (of a softer rubber, that is).

I think I found that after gluing a boosted rubber, you can't reglue very quickly, at least not remove the glue. I think the glue somewhat gets dissolved a little bit and get super stuck to the rubber, and the effect can take a while to disappear. I've never had so much trouble removing glue from my boosted H3's, though it didn't happen if I leave the glue on for a few days. I know freshly glued rubbers are harder to de-glue, but not this hard! Good thing the H3's sponge is indestructible, unlike Tenergies or even Dignics.

Also, I think I'm gonna stick to the current rubbers I have. Dignics or H3, just various levels of boost, no other rubbers. I was showing my wife how I glued on the H3 crooked and wanted to reglue it. She was like "Why? Don't you change your rubbers all the time anyway?" That's when I realized I have a problem Quite a relapse into EJ'ing I've had the past week, gotta put an end to it!