How much does physical training help in TT?

[TensorBackhand]

How much does physical training of fitness actually make a difference in TT ability? Like if you run a mile in 15 minutes vs 7 minutes, how much would that impact your USATT rating?

Given that most TT points seem to average less than 3 touches total, I'm pretty sure the benefit might be only 20-40 USATT points. TT is such a touch sensitive sport, I don't see physical ability as being a major factor at the non-pro level.

What do you think?

 

[Lazer]

It is definitely having an impact. Specially in the long weekend tournaments…

Cheers
L-zr

 

[TackyForehand]

It matters a lot. Name one disadvantage being physically fit gives you.

 

[Der_Echte]

If I got paid even 3 USD for every time i see a fit TT player attempt to play like a Ma long video game ( and utterly fail), but never make it past 1600 USATT, I would easily be independently wealthy.

I can accept the argument that if ur fitness majorly sucks, at a huge, multi-day tourney you will fade and lose rating. I get that.

For a single tourney where a player enters 2 events, they are not playing enough matches to have that fading affect them much.

Now at higher levels, 2000 cali, 2200, 2400 and every increasing level, play gets downright physically demanding.

Even so, remember the vid of a real fat looking Chinese elite amateur player getting spotted a handicap and troubling Dmitri Ovtcharov?

 

[TensorBackhand]

It matters a lot. Name one disadvantage being physically fit gives you.

Wang Hao is pretty fat with his shirt off for a 3 time Olympic medalist.

 

[TensorBackhand]

If I got paid even 3 USD for every time i see a fit TT player attempt to play like a Ma long video game ( and utterly fail), but never make it past 1600 USATT, I would easily be independently wealthy.

I can accept the argument that if ur fitness majorly sucks, at a huge, multi-day tourney you will fade and lose rating. I get that.

For a single tourney where a player enters 2 events, they are not playing enough matches to have that fading affect them much.

Now at higher levels, 2000 cali, 2200, 2400 and every increasing level, play gets downright physically demanding.

Even so, remember the vid of a real fat looking Chinese elite amateur player getting spotted a handicap and troubling Dmitri Ovtcharov?

So would you say being very physically fit is worth less than 50 USATT points?

 

[brokenball]

I would say being very fit is worth more than 100 USATT points.
Basically what one needs is endurance so one doesn't get tired. I find when I get tired my mind isn't as sharp.
Also, being able to bend the knees and get low get harder as you get older.

 

[TackyForehand]

So would you say being very physically fit is worth less than 50 USATT points?

Being physically fit is more important the higher your rating, but worth less points. Ratings are often underinflated below 2000 and does not reflect true ability. As you climb the point system you will face more and more physically fit opponents with ratings reflective of their actual level, and upon winning you will receive less points because of the closer ratings difference. According this post, if your opponent's rating is 50 points above yours, you are expected to lose ~70% of the time.

https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/forum/topics/ustta-rating-v-s-expected-win-rate.30690/

So how many points is from fitness and how many from other factors? Skill? Equipment? Tactics? At higher levels, we can see all these convege and players become nearly homogeneous, but perhaps we can see this from another angle. The most fundamental thing your opponents need to do to win against you is to keep up with you and return your ball. Therefore from this perspective, their physical ability during the match would not be less than yours.

The initial question is flawed. It's not that physical ability is worth X amount of points, it's a requirement to gain points in the first place.

tldr: If you face an opponent with similar ratings who jogs everyday and you don't... expect to lose.

 

[turbozed]

There are different kinds of physical fitness. Absolute limit strength seems to be unimportant since the smallest and most noodly of players can still hit just as hard as the strongest.

Agility and stamina seem to be pretty big factors though. I've never been winded playing TT matches since the pace is so intermittent. However, it's obvious that after several hours of play, mental focus is depleted and errors come at a higher rate. I'm pretty sure that this process can be slower down with some sort of training, though I'm not sure what part of should be mental versus physical (e.g. cardiovascular or muscle endurance). Some players like Hugo try to combine the two doing random rubiks cube solves in between physical drills.

Agility is important for obvious reasons and becomes even more important at higher levels. You can somewhat get away with poor footwork and a stationary style at a lower level so long as you have great serves, good anticipation, and have consistent strokes. But look at the pro level and these people are so rare as to be a fun novelty.

Since more agility use is required and more athletic movements are performed at the higher level, this makes having good stamina even more important.

 

[blahness]

It does but not the parts you think, all those good TT players have quite good lower body agility and strength even if they look "fat". Upper body is not that important imo. Wang Hao even at his fattest had immense lower body strength, those legs would easily do 100-200kg leg presses for eg

 

[silas6012]

For most amateur players, the shortboard is the technique rather than physical energy. A well-trained kid can play more powerful shots than a sturdy adult player as we can see in local clubs. It is only until the technique is no longer a restraint that one needs to consider the influence of body fitness.

 

[SFF_lib]

Yes and no.

If you are young and attack a lot, offence moves require a lot of physical strength. In this case physical training is really important.

In contrast, I got beaten by some really old guys who just stand in the same place. They play really smart and have amazing touch. Some have a big belly.

 

[NextLevel]

How much does physical training of fitness actually make a difference in TT ability? Like if you run a mile in 15 minutes vs 7 minutes, how much would that impact your USATT rating?

Given that most TT points seem to average less than 3 touches total, I'm pretty sure the benefit might be only 20-40 USATT points. TT is such a touch sensitive sport, I don't see physical ability as being a major factor at the non-pro level.

What do you think?

It depends on what you are training. But individual fitness and endurance at a general level are far less important than table tennis specific practice for determining the level you bring to a single match.

What changes is when you have to play many matches and train a lot of volume over significant periods like the pros do. The ability to use endurance and agility to reduce injury is key in those situations. And in some cases, developing higher levels of strength can hit critical levels that affect movement and ball quality. But all in all, game reading skills and ball control are more important that general fitness in determining individual level, but there are critical levels of individual fitness that make this moot, whee being severely overweight can drop someone's level substantially or getting incredibly fit can also raise it substantially.