Is there any difference between Butterfly Timo Boll ALC and Viscaria

[THL]

Hi,

I'm playing the BTY Timo Boll ALC and now I will know if there are any difference between Timo Boll ALC and Viscaria?

Have any one of you some experience?

 

[SilentRain]

Big yes. I own a TB ALC and my friend has a viscaria (new model). We tested both with H3 neo boosted and T64. General findings are that:
-TB ALC is insignificantly faster and more powerful and more controlable but has significantly less feel (very numbing and dead) compared to viscaria
-We also have the opinion that Viscaria has a wider range of rubber synergy whereas TB ALC seems to work very well with harder rubbers like T05. Has quite a dead feel with softer rubbers and Chinese Rubbers. Viscaria works very nicely with Chinese rubbers (compared to TB ALC)
-Viscaria was found to be more stable and powerful in mid-long distance whearas TB lost power once away

In short I if i could, I would had gotten a Viscaria or IF ALC over TB. But do note that this comparison is not absolute. The difference could be due to individual differences in that blade and not the model range. The only real way to test this is to test 10 TB ALC and Viscaria but unfortunately non of us have the capital to do so.

 

[anchorschmidt]

I've tried three TB ALCs with different weights and all of them felt different from each other. The ALC and the Viscaria also have exactly the same plies when compared to each other. I really think that you need to be particular about the weight of the blade. The lighter versions seem to play softer while the heavier ones are more powerful and direct.

This is just a theory but I think that the different handles might be the reason behind why the ALC feels more numb to you.

 

[THL]

What do you think about the ZJK ALC?

 

[anchorschmidt]

I've played the ZJK ALC for 4 months. It's a good blade but better for players who have a stable technique (which I did not have at the time). It felt similar to the TB ALC. My version was slightly harder.

The handle the the finishing of the blade was superior IMO to the ALC. The handle felt much more comfortable in my hands (Flaired).

 

[THL]

Do you also know the difference between ALC and ZLC?
Are they completely different or similar to each other?
Wong Chun Tin is playing a ZJK blade with T05 on both sides.
I don't know how good these blades are or if they are the newer version of TB's blades.

 

[SilentRain]

I've tried three TB ALCs with different weights and all of them felt different from each other. The ALC and the Viscaria also have exactly the same plies when compared to each other. I really think that you need to be particular about the weight of the blade. The lighter versions seem to play softer while the heavier ones are more powerful and direct.

This is just a theory but I think that the different handles might be the reason behind why the ALC feels more numb to you.

They might have the same plies but its more than just the type of wood. Thickness of plies, the glue job and even different trees of the same wood will give different outcomes. Thats why it is recommended to test a blade in person before making a purchase. I dont think handles make much difference in feel as I tested my TB ST with another TB FL and the numbness is still there and very similar. The difference was still night and day compared to Vis. I still choose Viscaria over both TBs. Both the Viscaria and TB had the same weight (measured individually before gluing at 88grams). And just to clarify, when i say feel, I mean the feel of hitting the ball and not holding the blade.

 

[SilentRain]

Do you also know the difference between ALC and ZLC?
Are they completely different or similar to each other?
Wong Chun Tin is playing a ZJK blade with T05 on both sides.
I don't know how good these blades are or if they are the newer version of TB's blades.

ALC is slower, more dead ball feel but has more dwell and control. It is soft but rigid. A jack of all trades but master of none. Needs some effort away from the table.

ZLC is faster, great feel but less dwell. It is hard but flexible which is nice for loops. Hard to control in short game unless you have decent touch. Great at all distance but must excercise some caution when playing close to table unless you overshoot the table (not a problem if you have good technique).

SZLC similar to ZLC but overprice. Tried it with JZK SZLC and found it much harder to control unless you are far away from the table and enjoy topspin. Don't get it if you like touch play and being very close to the table. You expend more effort keeping the ball in than attacking the ball. I mean even JM himself choose to go back to regular ZLC.

So to answer your question, ALC and ZLC are very different

 

[SilentRain]

What do you think about the ZJK ALC?

Its good but compared to TB, Vis and IF, i find it kinda meh and slightly inferior. I know 2 ZJK users who constantly complain and wished they got something else instead. They regretted buying into the ZJK name and brand. One wished he got the Vis because we found it to be better for Chinese rubbers which he uses and another wanted the new IFL ALC for the feel of wood but similar carbon characteristics.

 

[THL]

Thank you for your awesome answer.
But I think i stay by my BTF TB ALC with this great touch and feeling.


Gesendet von iPhone mit Tapatalk

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Viscaria, TB ALC, ZJK ALC etc.

The person you need to have answer this is Baal. He can give top quality info because he has used many many versions of all these blades and for many years.


Sent from Deep Space by Abacus

 

[Baal]

I think that there is something different about the way the different Butterfly ALC blades are glued together and also whether they do some treatment on the top ply of the blade, so I am not sure it is just ply composition that matters. I also think that it depends a great deal on what year the blade was made, since thicknesses of individual plys seem to vary from year to year. It also depends in a very big way on handle preferences you may have. This discussion seems to go on forever.

I have a bunch of Viscarias and they are most definitely NOT all the same. A lot is weight, but not all. Like anything else made of wood, I suppose. Some violins and guitars are better than others also.

But the one thing for sure is that I prefer the FL versions of any of my Viscaria blades better than either TBS or TB-ALC mainly due to the handle. That matters a lot. Of course, only the Boll blades are available with ST handles in any practical way or price. So if that matters, than the choice is made for you. TB-ALC has a harder surface because they treat it with something. Maybe UV light. So Boll-ALC is harder and crisper, often faster.

I find the two ZJK-ALC ST handle blades I have to be very much slower (too much), and I have a pair of ZJK-ALC FL blades that are much closer to the speed I like. And definitely A LOT faster than the ST ones!

My favorite Viscarias tend to be older and slower, and around 90 g. I don't like the superlight ones, even when they are kind of fast. The best ones I have are series I and series H. Those are black tag ones, around 8-9 years old. These blades improve with age, not sure why, even when they just sit in a drawer. Maybe it is the wood drying, or getting wetter, or the glue changing or something.

The bottom line answer to the OP's question of "how will I know if....." is to to say you probably won't know until you actually try one for yourself. But if you borrow someone else's blade, you will at least get a feel for the handle and general weight distribution, which I think is a pretty big part of it.

If you buy one without trying one, you run the risk of not liking it, and there is nothing that a bunch of guys on the internet jabbering away can say that reduces the risk. You may not like what I like.

 

[laistrogian]

The easiest options are to either buy one or to try it. Viscaria is an extremely popular blade, you shouldn't have a problem finding someone who owns one and then try it.

As someone who tried both M.Maze and TBS, even though they are different blades, the difference is pretty small. I wouldn't say there won't be any difference between viscaria and TBS but most probably it will be just like how baal said all his viscarias feel different from one another.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

I think that there is something different about the way the different Butterfly ALC blades are glued together and also whether they do some treatment on the top ply of the blade, so I am not sure it is just ply composition that matters. I also think that it depends a great deal on what year the blade was made, since thicknesses of individual plys seem to vary from year to year. It also depends in a very big way on handle preferences you may have. This discussion seems to go on forever.

I have a bunch of Viscarias and they are most definitely NOT all the same. A lot is weight, but not all. Like anything else made of wood, I suppose. Some violins and guitars are better than others also.

But the one thing for sure is that I prefer the FL versions of any of my Viscaria blades better than either TBS or TB-ALC mainly due to the handle. That matters a lot. Of course, only the Boll blades are available with ST handles in any practical way or price. So if that matters, than the choice is made for you. TB-ALC has a harder surface because they treat it with something. Maybe UV light. So Boll-ALC is harder and crisper, often faster.

I find the two ZJK-ALC ST handle blades I have to be very much slower (too much), and I have a pair of ZJK-ALC FL blades that are much closer to the speed I like. And definitely A LOT faster than the ST ones!

My favorite Viscarias tend to be older and slower, and around 90 g. I don't like the superlight ones, even when they are kind of fast. The best ones I have are series I and series H. Those are black tag ones, around 8-9 years old. These blades improve with age, not sure why, even when they just sit in a drawer. Maybe it is the wood drying, or getting wetter, or the glue changing or something.

The bottom line answer to the OP's question of "how will I know if....." is to to say you probably won't know until you actually try one for yourself. But if you borrow someone else's blade, you will at least get a feel for the handle and general weight distribution, which I think is a pretty big part of it.

If you buy one without trying one, you run the risk of not liking it, and there is nothing that a bunch of guys on the internet jabbering away can say that reduces the risk. You may not like what I like.

That is a great post. Direct and honest and very complete. Don't know that there is anything else that needs to be said.

Guys, you should be hitting the like button. That is the best info you'll get.

Thanks Baal.