Speed glue / tensor = same thing?

says toooooo much choice!!
says toooooo much choice!!
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You mean boosted or not makes no difference to you ?


It is crazy that there are still so many question-marks re the boosting considering that so many
"words" have been spoken and written about this subject.
I shall endeavor to solve the mystery re. the expanding and shrinking after removal from the blade. I got an old globe 999 rubber and some old blades. I will boost the rubber and glue it on the blade. I shall leave it on the blade for a few weeks then we will see what happens.

Things we do when we haven't got anything better to do ;)
I could tell the difference between boosted and un boosted, although some results were, let’s say disappointing!!
 
says Looking for a bat that makes me faster
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No wonder to me I hardly notice the drop-off issue. I was ignorantly & blissfully using MXP close to a year before I noticed the sponge deteriorating visually and only then I know that it has reached its useful life. So, yeah, MXP drop in performance is not an issue for me at this point in time.

But then, I wonder if newer ESN formula like Donic's Bluestorm Z1 ( another ESN super trampolinish rubber ) would escape this drop-off issue. I am tempted to use it in lieu of MXP.
If you can use MXP for a year, I don't think there would be drop-off issue with Z1. Although I've heard that Donic topsheets are not very durable.
 

NDH

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No wonder to me I hardly notice the drop-off issue. I was ignorantly & blissfully using MXP close to a year before I noticed the sponge deteriorating visually and only then I know that it has reached its useful life. So, yeah, MXP drop in performance is not an issue for me at this point in time.

But then, I wonder if newer ESN formula like Donic's Bluestorm Z1 ( another ESN super trampolinish rubber ) would escape this drop-off issue. I am tempted to use it in lieu of MXP.
There is a lot to consider here, and in my opinion, not that much actually comes down to the rubber (for you personally).

It comes back to the discussions you've been having on the blade you use.

Do you want something that will give you the greatest chance at improving, yet perhaps not "talk" to you in quite the same way?

Or do you want something that makes you do a happy dance every time you pick it up, but also restricts your improvement due to the fact it's too fast?

It's no different when talking about the rubbers.

Right now, my recommendation to you based on your willingness to improve and your current level would be to use a very average speed rubber that is nice and tacky - It doesn't have to be CRAZY tacky, but a good amount of grip (more than you get with typical EUR/JAP Tensor rubbers).

Why?

Your blade is fast, we all know this.

You say you want to learn to loop with a lot of spin consistently.

To be able to do that (well), you need a fast arm speed as you accelerate through the ball - However, when you use your Hinoki blade with MX-P or any other fast, tensor like rubber, your margin of error is 0.0000001% (at a guess), at your current skill level.

Even at higher skill levels, that set up is very, very fast. Just as yourself why so many pros are now using D09C on their FH? If you did a bounce test between MX-P and D09C, the former would bounce to the moon whilst Dignics would be very subdued in comparison.

However.... what are the downsides?

Effort.

It takes much more effort to loop with a fast arm speed and an average speed rubber - MX-P or another similar rubber will allow you to play the "Hollywood" shots more often, and give you that warn fuzzy feeling that your Hinoki blade also gives you.

For clarity, I don't think either route is wrong. You will have people tell you that you *need* to use this or that because it's optimal for your progression, but at the end of the day, you have to use what makes you feel happy.

Some people are just driven on improving at the quickest rate they can, and they don't care about equipment at all.

Others (like me), will aim to use equipment that is *somewhere* close to what they need, but then choose things that just make them happy.

So, to try and break it down a little.....

If you main goal is to improve at any cost (whilst still keeping hold of that Hinoki blade of yours), I would ignore MX-P or Bluestorm, and get something a little harder and spinnier.

MX-S isn't a bad option, as is Dignics 09C, but you could also spend half as much (maybe the new Glazyer would be an option), as you currently would not be able to get the most out of the rubber anyway.

You would then have to accept that your big old flat power hits are a thing of the past, and focus on spinning everything with maximum effort.

But if your main goal is to enjoy the sport, and use equipment that makes you feel warm and fuzzy (whilst still improving through playing as much as you can, you can pretty much choose anything you want.

If MX-P makes you feel good, keep using it.

If you'll not be able to sleep until you've tried Bluestorm, grab a sheet and test it out.

If you didn't notice any difference over a year of using MX-P, I would be very surprised if you would get much benefit from changing to another fast rubber - You certainly won't get more longevity than a year (if you are playing twice a week all year round).

The only time I think you'll feel a difference is if you drop down in speed, and then you'll realize each shot needs a bit more effort from you, and then you'll start to feel it.

A very long answer to say "use what you want", I guess 😂
 
says toooooo much choice!!
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Since the original question of this thread was about Speed Glue vs Tensor, this is just a comment on that subject.

I remember in 2012, after the speed glue ban was in effect for about 4 years, I had the opportunity to play with Joola Mambo that was freshly speed glued and to compare it to Tenergy that was fairly fresh and, I have to say, that Mambo rubber felt amazing. :) Tenergy is darn good and at the time there was nothing legal that compared to it. But the speed glued Mambo just felt amazing. :)
Hi Carl,

Have you ever tried boosted Tenergy?
 
says toooooo much choice!!
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True, it was messy and gamble on quality.
now, player still glue very often to get everything out of the rubber, but once a week (or 2 times) versus 3 or 5 times a day, most pro players are happy about today.

I think the dislike is not on speed glue vs modern, but rather 40 vs 40+ balls. There is a lot more moaning with 40+, even today.
Hi Tony,

regarding glueing very often, does this help with the feel of a rubber?
 
says Buttefly Forever!!!
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There is a lot to consider here, and in my opinion, not that much actually comes down to the rubber (for you personally).

It comes back to the discussions you've been having on the blade you use.

Do you want something that will give you the greatest chance at improving, yet perhaps not "talk" to you in quite the same way?

Or do you want something that makes you do a happy dance every time you pick it up, but also restricts your improvement due to the fact it's too fast?

It's no different when talking about the rubbers.

Right now, my recommendation to you based on your willingness to improve and your current level would be to use a very average speed rubber that is nice and tacky - It doesn't have to be CRAZY tacky, but a good amount of grip (more than you get with typical EUR/JAP Tensor rubbers).

Why?

Your blade is fast, we all know this.

You say you want to learn to loop with a lot of spin consistently.

To be able to do that (well), you need a fast arm speed as you accelerate through the ball - However, when you use your Hinoki blade with MX-P or any other fast, tensor like rubber, your margin of error is 0.0000001% (at a guess), at your current skill level.

Even at higher skill levels, that set up is very, very fast. Just as yourself why so many pros are now using D09C on their FH? If you did a bounce test between MX-P and D09C, the former would bounce to the moon whilst Dignics would be very subdued in comparison.

However.... what are the downsides?

Effort.

It takes much more effort to loop with a fast arm speed and an average speed rubber - MX-P or another similar rubber will allow you to play the "Hollywood" shots more often, and give you that warn fuzzy feeling that your Hinoki blade also gives you.

For clarity, I don't think either route is wrong. You will have people tell you that you *need* to use this or that because it's optimal for your progression, but at the end of the day, you have to use what makes you feel happy.

Some people are just driven on improving at the quickest rate they can, and they don't care about equipment at all.

Others (like me), will aim to use equipment that is *somewhere* close to what they need, but then choose things that just make them happy.

So, to try and break it down a little.....

If you main goal is to improve at any cost (whilst still keeping hold of that Hinoki blade of yours), I would ignore MX-P or Bluestorm, and get something a little harder and spinnier.

MX-S isn't a bad option, as is Dignics 09C, but you could also spend half as much (maybe the new Glazyer would be an option), as you currently would not be able to get the most out of the rubber anyway.

You would then have to accept that your big old flat power hits are a thing of the past, and focus on spinning everything with maximum effort.

But if your main goal is to enjoy the sport, and use equipment that makes you feel warm and fuzzy (whilst still improving through playing as much as you can, you can pretty much choose anything you want.

If MX-P makes you feel good, keep using it.

If you'll not be able to sleep until you've tried Bluestorm, grab a sheet and test it out.

If you didn't notice any difference over a year of using MX-P, I would be very surprised if you would get much benefit from changing to another fast rubber - You certainly won't get more longevity than a year (if you are playing twice a week all year round).

The only time I think you'll feel a difference is if you drop down in speed, and then you'll realize each shot needs a bit more effort from you, and then you'll start to feel it.

A very long answer to say "use what you want", I guess 😂
Choosing rubber is like the above. You make the choice and enjoy it.

Ha ha ha, you already know what I want, what I really really want. I wanna I wanna I really really really wanna is .....
NOT THIS!!!! Blargh!
F5B7E403-FFCD-451D-82A8-CE6B598A6767.jpeg


Give me this for breakfast anytime babe!
B16F896F-3A6D-46A6-BA2B-4F170B9868FC.jpeg
 
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says Table tennis clown
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Choosing rubber is like the above. You make the choice and enjoy it.

Ha ha ha, you already know what I want, what I really really want. I wanna I wanna I really really really wanna is .....
NOT THIS!!!! Blargh!
View attachment 24769

Give me this for breakfast anytime babe!
View attachment 24770
Ahh, finally all is revealed Gozo you pervert ........................................you can't eat this for breakfast 😇
 
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Hi Tony,

regarding glueing very often, does this help with the feel of a rubber?
Hi IB66
Yes, freshly glued ones are better than glue that has settled/aged.
I think elastically is the English word that comes to my mind to define such feeling.

It is not uncommon to see players glue or rather, reglue at least once a week (talking about 30 hour+ workload guys).
For example. H3, they will change a new rubber maybe 2 to 4 weeks. They would reglue at the 7 day mark. Might reboost at the 2 week mark.
You don't see them using the original glue all the way to the 4 week mark.
If it was a bad glue job, the rubbers will be off again after the session or two, for regluing.

However, different glues could be different.
Gluing (with or without boosting) is really tailored to each player needs and likes.
 
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says Buttefly Forever!!!
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Hi IB66
Yes, freshly glued ones are better than glue that has settled/aged.
I think elastically is the English word that comes to my mind to define such feeling.

It is not uncommon to see players glue or rather, reglue at least once a week (talking about 30 hour+ workload guys).
For example. H3, they will change a new rubber maybe 2 to 4 weeks. They would reglue at the 7 day mark. Might reboost at the 2 week mark.

You don't see them using the original glue all the way to the 4 week mark.
If it was a bad glue job, the rubbers will be off again after the session or two, for regluing.

However, different glues could be different.
Gluing (with or without boosting) is really tailored to each player needs and likes.
I cannot fathom the hassle one willing to go through all these hassle if one is not making a living from TT.

Tony, does you player under your charge boost ESN / Spring Sponge rubber?
 
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I cannot fathom the hassle one willing to go through all these hassle if one is not making a living from TT.

Tony, does you player under your charge boost ESN / Spring Sponge rubber?
Hi Gozo,
Not my players, I currently just "help" out. The places I help out at, those coaches are way over my level.
But to answer your question (for those players), the answer is yes.

I am basically in TT heaven. Access to 6 schools ( I can rock up and check out they "closed training". These are basically schools where about 2/3 of Taiwan top players come from. Lin himself from one of them)
 
says toooooo much choice!!
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Hi IB66
Yes, freshly glued ones are better than glue that has settled/aged.
I think elastically is the English word that comes to my mind to define such feeling.

It is not uncommon to see players glue or rather, reglue at least once a week (talking about 30 hour+ workload guys).
For example. H3, they will change a new rubber maybe 2 to 4 weeks. They would reglue at the 7 day mark. Might reboost at the 2 week mark.
You don't see them using the original glue all the way to the 4 week mark.
If it was a bad glue job, the rubbers will be off again after the session or two, for regluing.

However, different glues could be different.
Gluing (with or without boosting) is really tailored to each player needs and likes.
Glue such as DHS no15? which is strong but very elastic, almost seems like it doesn't dry properly!!! Thick layers? or players preference?
 
says Buttefly Forever!!!
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Hi Gozo,
Not my players, I currently just "help" out. The places I help out at, those coaches are way over my level.
But to answer your question (for those players), the answer is yes.

I am basically in TT heaven. Access to 6 schools ( I can rock up and check out they "closed training". These are basically schools where about 2/3 of Taiwan top players come from. Lin himself from one of them)
By the way, do you know of a C-Taipei player by the name Yeh Chih-Wei? I just watched the match between him and my Malaysian Men Top Single ( Leong Chee Feng ) and Leong is shooting rockets at him and the ball just kept coming back at Leong. Needless to say, Leong lost 0-3 to Yeh. The event is WTT Feeder @ Antalya, Turkey happening these few days. Kudos to Mr Yeh.
 
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By the way, do you know of a C-Taipei player by the name Yeh Chih-Wei? I just watched the match between him and my Malaysian Men Top Single ( Leong Chee Feng ) and Leong is shooting rockets at him and the ball just kept coming back at Leong. Needless to say, Leong lost 0-3 to Yeh. The event is WTT Feeder @ Antalya, Turkey happening these few days. Kudos to Mr Yeh.

I know of him, I don't know him.
He is a First Bank player (Kaohsiung). I know First Bank players from Taipei more.
Basically Taiwan has 3 professional teams. First Bank (Mens only), Cathay Life (Womens only) and Taiwan Co-Op bank (Mens and Women).
I have connections in the later 2 and 1/3 of the first.

Yeh is 33 years old. He is still "keeping it" at his old age. His prime was around 10 years ago, and then he dropped off the radar (not making national colors) and made it back around the past 2 or 3 years.
In Taiwan, you need to make the national team (by trials) to be able to play international.

2023 trials, Yeh had a very famous upset by beating a Taiwan Co-Op bank player, and Taiwan's no 3 - Feng (who didn't make the national team for 2023, so he is out for basically the rest of the year). At the time of the trials, Feng was WR 60 something. Feng had good wins against WR20 players in both WTT and German league. I fed mutiball to Feng few years ago and he was going to become Taiwan's number 2, behind Lin, due to my feeding lol.

So yeah, Yeh knows how to play a little bit of table tennis. His world ranking is poor, but just like a lot of (top) Asians (countries), if they can play international, they are very good.

322179418_1245591803038128_9187342600651836861_n.jpg
 
says Looking for a bat that makes me faster
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I know of him, I don't know him.
He is a First Bank player (Kaohsiung). I know First Bank players from Taipei more.
Basically Taiwan has 3 professional teams. First Bank (Mens only), Cathay Life (Womens only) and Taiwan Co-Op bank (Mens and Women).
I have connections in the later 2 and 1/3 of the first.

Yeh is 33 years old. He is still "keeping it" at his old age. His prime was around 10 years ago, and then he dropped off the radar (not making national colors) and made it back around the past 2 or 3 years.
In Taiwan, you need to make the national team (by trials) to be able to play international.

2023 trials, Yeh had a very famous upset by beating a Taiwan Co-Op bank player, and Taiwan's no 3 - Feng (who didn't make the national team for 2023, so he is out for basically the rest of the year). At the time of the trials, Feng was WR 60 something. Feng had good wins against WR20 players in both WTT and German league. I fed mutiball to Feng few years ago and he was going to become Taiwan's number 2, behind Lin, due to my feeding lol.

So yeah, Yeh knows how to play a little bit of table tennis. His world ranking is poor, but just like a lot of (top) Asians (countries), if they can play international, they are very good.

322179418_1245591803038128_9187342600651836861_n.jpg
Why are they only allowed to play internationally if they are in the national team? Can they not play internationally even if they pay for their own expense?
 
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Why are they only allowed to play internationally if they are in the national team? Can they not play internationally even if they pay for their own expense?

It has been the case like forever.
The national body needs to enter (or rather, WTT/ITTF only accept entries from national bodies).
Each tournament, there is a cap on number of entries per country. (However,China is the only one that has been able to send way more than the limit - they have so much ways to get wild card and cool cards, LGL card, CTTA cards and all other I'm the boss cards)

Basically, you can't have anyone just entering international tournaments. ITTF doesn't allow random entries and if national bodies don't enter you, you won't be playing.

In a way, this is the same almost everywhere. If you not in the Chinese national team, or Japanese national team, you won't be flying around playing WTT events right? Even though, I'm sure there are those that are not in the national team that could for example, win a Feeder event in a not so popular destination.
 
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Wrong. Anyone can play in the US Open
Even one color rackets are fully approved in ANY events even in ALL USATT sanctioned tournaments including 5 star tournaments like US Open. .
Why do you keep bringing up the point about one color rackets. This has NOTHING to do with the conversation ongoing here.
 
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