UpSideDownCarl Looping In NYC's Chinatown

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I am sure it will go away with time if I keep working on it and constantly analyzing and sensing what my body is doing, but I do understand that I'm not the only one with quite large faults.

Exactly. And while you are young enough to believe in your infinite potential, those of us who are older know that it may never go away with time and work. So writing with humility once in a while is the simplest way to avoid backlash, even feigned humility. Or if you don't want to, then accept that people are just going to be skeptical of what you write until some method of corroboration shows up later.
 
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I see in the first display frame of Carl's last two vids of shadow practice, it appears his stance right before imagined impact is OPEN. I am sure Carl knows about the stance and its benefits.

I suspect than Carl, when faced with a ball going to his wide FH will footwork in a way that would give him an open hitting stance and close to the table, either stationary or needing only a small step, Carl plays close to parallel.
 
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Der_, I think I will have to see if I can get some footage of in and out drills and serve and receive drills so I can see what I actually do in a circumstance where I have to move around more like in match play.


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By the way, I did the shadow drills yesterday with a just over the eyebrows followthrough. My shoulder does not like it. Before I went to the circus in a ramp skate competition, I dislocated my right shoulder. It never bothers me when I play. But doing shadow drills with the higher followthrough, it didn't like that. And before Edmund helped me fix my forehand, my shoulder used to always bother me as a result of the old mechanics.


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By the way, I did the shadow drills yesterday with a just over the eyebrows followthrough. My shoulder does not like it. Before I went to the circus in a ramp skate competition, I dislocated my right shoulder. It never bothers me when I play. But doing shadow drills with the higher followthrough, it didn't like that. And before Edmund helped me fix my forehand, my shoulder used to always bother me as a result of the old mechanics.


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You are supposed to do what you do when you are looping in the video you put up at the beginning of the thread. It's not supposed to be something different - it's just not supposed to come across your neck. I suppose you have some of the issues I do though for different reasons, and that you should keep your elbow out to avoid engaging the upper arm/shoulder excessively. But the eyebrow advice is more about the height - it is okay to come forward at that height as well rather than finish across the eyebrow - coming across the head is not necessary and some do it, some don't.
 
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I was taught that coming accross the body on ANY forehand stroke is a bad thing. But then the way I was taught wouldn't work for Carl if he has shoulder problems. My coach starts her students off without adding in the forearm until their stroke is ready for it. The way she explains the stroke, is to just "run". move your arms like you're running. This involves the shoulder quite a bit, but it also makes it almost impossible to cross your body.

Now when looping the stroke is EXACTLY the same, never losing sight of the paddle, which I know most of you are going to go crazy about. We turn our body and transfer weight on every stroke but for a forehand loop we turn our body a bit more, go down on that right knee a LOT more, push off that right leg hard and transfer our body weight.

Also with stance this is going to drive some people crazy, regardless of height she likes to teach players that their Forehand foot's front toe should be halfway down the other foots shoe and then spread the legs. This is contradicting to many people's teaching of the forehand because they all say your stance should be MUCH more open than this. I tend to open up my stance a lot and she doesn't mention it so I think this is just the basics for starting or maybe she just doesn't like how I lose a lot of my body weight transfer when I get back to the way she likes.


Finally: She doesn't like backing off the table, says if you can play close, backing up later will be easy. Looping underspin close to the table is easy, I'm sure most of you agree, but when the next ball comes back fast most players like to back up to do another loop against that topspin. She advocates something called "quickloop" and doesn't like to back off for another loop. This close to the table play could just be because she was a professional woman player in china.
 
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@Shuki

We must remember a few things.

The "absolutely never" pointers she is talking about apply to beginners. Every top level professional is breaking all of her rules, but they don't apply to them.

Secondly, she WAS a professional woman player in China.

The men's and women's game is immensely different in a practical sense, and while I am not doubting her at all, she might not realize this and teaches men as she would teach herself to play.

Her telling you to not back up is probably NOT due to that, though. She is probably qualified and competent, and wants you to first be able to play a quick loop near the table if you decide, and then once you have mastered that and backing up is a choice and not a must because of your inability to play close to the table, she will teach you more appropriate and advanced powerlooping play far from the table.

At least, I hope so.
 
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@Shuki

We must remember a few things.

The "absolutely never" pointers she is talking about apply to beginners. Every top level professional is breaking all of her rules, but they don't apply to them.


At least, I hope so.

If I'm thinking of the point you're referring to of mine correctly as the "never losing sight of the blade point, even on loops". She also showed quite a few clips of ma long looping where he wouldn't put the paddle backwards either. I think it's a chinese thing for optimal play, if you don't lose sight of the paddle you hold onto consistency and won't miss the ball.
 
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If I'm thinking of the point you're referring to of mine correctly as the "never losing sight of the blade point, even on loops". She also showed quite a few clips of ma long looping where he wouldn't put the paddle backwards either. I think it's a chinese thing for optimal play, if you don't lose sight of the paddle you hold onto consistency and won't miss the ball.


That is one I am learning to copy and thanks for sharing, Shuki. It also facilitates core rotation rather than trying to just backswing with your arm. The ball is always moving so it is easy to whiff when you don't look closely.
 
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Btw this isn't EXACTLY my loop, I couldn't take a picture while going down on my leg comfortably. Second photo I didn't go down at all because I couldn't get my body in the mirror while having my paddle behind me not hitting the bed sorry.

ANYWAY, my loop doesn't have a lot of forearm snap but you can make your forearm straighter while still keeping it in your sight. The first one is what mine is. Second is when the paddle goes behind, It's not in my eyesight.

Lasly, if anyones confused, I'm not looking at the paddle, it's in my perifial (excuse my spelling, not even autocorrect could help) vision.


loop1.jpgloop2.jpg
 
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By the way, one of the things that interest me in this stuff is, when the ball is there it doesn't bother my shoulder and when the ball is not there it does. And it is pretty close to the same stroke what I was doing in my shadow strokes last night.

I would like to say it is like boxing or swinging a baseball bat. If you connect, it doesn't hurt. But sometimes when you swing and miss, it hurts. But I am not sure that is what is going on.


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By the way, one of the things that interest me in this stuff is, when the ball is there it doesn't bother my shoulder and when the ball is not there it does. And it is pretty close to the same stroke what I was doing in my shadow strokes last night.

I would like to say it is like boxing or swinging a baseball bat. If you connect, it doesn't hurt. But sometimes when you swing and miss, it hurts. But I am not sure that is what is going on.


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Do you start lower in the mirror strokes by chance? more movement could cause it.
 
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Do you start lower in the mirror strokes by chance? more movement could cause it.

Actually, in the real thing I am dropping my racket but not bringing it back. In my shadow stokes last night, my backswing was back, not down. Basically the same backswing as in the shadow videos already posted.


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Actually, in the real thing I am dropping my racket but not bringing it back. In my shadow stokes last night, my backswing was back, not down. Basically the same backswing as in the shadow videos already posted.


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In the previous video's posted it looks like your shadow stroke is down and back not just back. Maybe I'm wrong, don't feel like watching it again =P. as a controlling player is your stroke genuinely pretty slow? maybe the shadow strokes are quicker? If this isn't why then I have no idea why it would be hurting.

P.S.
A yoga instructor would be the last person I'd expect to have pain from a movement. how long have you had this pain?
 
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In the previous video's posted it looks like your shadow stroke is down and back not just back. Maybe I'm wrong, don't feel like watching it again =P. as a controlling player is your stroke genuinely pretty slow? maybe the shadow strokes are quicker? If this isn't why then I have no idea why it would be hurting.

P.S.
A yoga instructor would be the last person I'd expect to have pain from a movement. how long have you had this pain?

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When I was in the circus 20 years ago I did the stuff shown above and more. You can get pretty banged up doing that stuff. I broke my right hand in 7 places. I tore a tendon in my left hand that needed to be sewn back together (surgery). I partially dislocated my left hip. My right hip has some nice arthritis goin' on and my right shoulder was dislocated a few times and I am pretty sure it has some decent arthritis up in there as well.

And even without that, at 51 years old, even without that kind of background, your joints don't always work as well as they used to.

But I doubt you'll find too many yoga teachers who can help people with back problems to the extent I can. [emoji2]

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But I can do a few things with my body because I have used how I do this stuff to help me make those dings and bangs get better.


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A yoga instructor would be the last person I'd expect to have pain from a movement. how long have you had this pain?

Oh, to actually answer your question, my shoulder never really bothers me. But that movement did.


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Oh, to actually answer your question, my shoulder never really bothers me. But that movement did.


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lol both answers were good, I think I mostly just like responses to my replies because I like to see people talking to me :p
 
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