What is the best ESN Hybrid rubber for FH?

[banbekas]

Instantly fell in love with Rakza Z when I tried it, having played with H3 for a while, but I am an amateur and I would like to have a rubber where I have to work in the right technique to use it. Rakza Z feels like it automates the action because it holds on to the ball and still sends back opponents spin. It turned my style into a blocker because I win most points by passively using my opponents spin and controlling the ball instead of developing sufficient technique to generate my own spin efficiently. Every rubber has its upsides and downsides ... it would also help if there was a slower version for my level. Do you guys think going from 2.0 mm to 1.8 mm would work?

Get a 5 ply all wood blade that is either All or Off-. Loki V5 is fine. Sanwei Echo or Parla is also superb. They are cheap but quality is good.

I have these rubber. Unfortunately, without a booster it is not so good. In addition, I have Loki N80, which works better than Jupiter, but it also requires a booster plus baby oil. I wish I had a rubber that worked just as well without a booster.

God, N80. I had two N80 and I hate it to the bone. The rubber behaved like nothing I have experienced before. It was godly in counter looping scenarios but when looping or pushing, it was like a box of chocolate. It might be stupidly spinny or no spin at all. Serving was incredible tho. I only spent a month with it then I went back to B2.

 

[z0uLess]

Get a 5 ply all wood blade that is either All or Off-. Loki V5 is fine. Sanwei Echo or Parla is also superb. They are cheap but quality is good.

As you can see in my profile, I use the Avalox P500 and I am hesitant to change the blade since I have become very accustomed to it and I like it very much. If I can remember correctly, I think the speed of this blade sits smack in the middle between off- and off, which is probably 10% faster than I would like, but this means I can work on developing into this blade and use it for years and years (I also bought two of them because I like to have a backup).

These details are quite small, even the amount of glue will change the speed just as much as the speed will change by changing the blade. One of the blades is a little faster than the other. I play with the slower one of the two.

 

[banbekas]

As you can see in my profile, I use the Avalox P500 and I am hesitant to change the blade since I have become very accustomed to it and I like it very much. If I can remember correctly, I think the speed of this blade sits smack in the middle between off- and off, which is probably 10% faster than I would like, but this means I can work on developing into this blade and use it for years and years (I also bought two of them because I like to have a backup).

These details are quite small, even the amount of glue will change the speed just as much as the speed will change by changing the blade. One of the blades is a little faster than the other. I play with the slower one of the two.

Honestly, I still think Off- blade is too fast, lol. I, myself, am using an Allround blade and it's more than fast enough for me. I'm even using unboosted B2 on my forehand. I think that getting a thinner rubber would make it even faster.

 

[NextLevel]

Get a 5 ply all wood blade that is either All or Off-. Loki V5 is fine. Sanwei Echo or Parla is also superb. They are cheap but quality is good.


God, N80. I had two N80 and I hate it to the bone. The rubber behaved like nothing I have experienced before. It was godly in counter looping scenarios but when looping or pushing, it was like a box of chocolate. It might be stupidly spinny or no spin at all. Serving was incredible tho. I only spent a month with it then I went back to B2.

I don't entirely agree with this, but everyone has different opinions. Advanced players like you can use anything. For a player who is not advanced, the most important thing is to get into the mode of topspinnng on both sides with ease and using something that is designed to facilitate that given the practice hours. For some players it might be slower equipment but for other players it might be faster equipment. In people who learn at older ages; there is a case to be made that arm overuse can be made less of a problem by using faster equipment so they can focus on spin. It isn't a straightforward argument and it requires some balance based on observing the player. But everything I have seen from old zouless videos (admittedly old) showed that he had major problems even using the arm correctly and that the slower equipment was making the problem worse.

 

[andzejgolot]

I'm not going to say it's definitely the lowest, but I do find the Codexx SuperSelect to be quite low. I've written elsewhere on the forum about the rubber so I won't write a lot here, but it's been my favorite rubber to use thus far out of ever next gen ESN rubber. Can't imagine using anything else right now, but I will probably give K3 and Bluestar A1 a try just to see what the hype is about.

I used it and It is really great, 55 version.

 

[andzejgolot]

I think PK50 is being discontinued. Nittaku are releasing some new rubbers soon.

This rubber has high throw and very sensitive for down spin

 

[banbekas]

I don't entirely agree with this, but everyone has different opinions. Advanced players like you can use anything. For a player who is not advanced, the most important thing is to get into the mode of topspinnng on both sides with ease and using something that is designed to facilitate that given the practice hours. For some players it might be slower equipment but for other players it might be faster equipment. In people who learn at older ages; there is a case to be made that arm overuse can be made less of a problem by using faster equipment so they can focus on spin. It isn't a straightforward argument and it requires some balance based on observing the player. But everything I have seen from old zouless videos (admittedly old) showed that he had major problems even using the arm correctly and that the slower equipment was making the problem worse.

You know, this is a new and good way of looking at it. I suppose this is correct too. I've always thought that to get better at spinning, you need slower blade so that you'll learn how to spin the ball by hitting through the sponge.

 

[Peter93]

I used it and It is really great, 55 version.

The 53 SuperSelect pairs so amazingly well with the Aruna Hinoki Carbon. It's an absolute match made in heaven. I did buy a sheet of 09c for my viscaria which I do like a lot, but the throw angle is annoying when playing close to the table. I might give the other Codexx versions a try to see the differences in hardness and feel.

 

[Choosikick]

Get a 5 ply all wood blade that is either All or Off-. Loki V5 is fine. Sanwei Echo or Parla is also superb. They are cheap but quality is good.


God, N80. I had two N80 and I hate it to the bone. The rubber behaved like nothing I have experienced before. It was godly in counter looping scenarios but when looping or pushing, it was like a box of chocolate. It might be stupidly spinny or no spin at all. Serving was incredible tho. I only spent a month with it then I went back to B2.

In fact, N80 is a very strange rubber.
I absolutely could not play with the first sheet. I put this on different blades, but there was no result. Then I treated N80 with seamun and baby oil, put it in a bag and forgot for a long time. After a while, I accidentally came across this, glued it with quick rubber glue onto a blade with a soft top layer of sipo, and behold, it started playing. I ordered a second sheet...
Out of the package it worked well, although this sheet weighs 4 grams more when trimmed... Now time has passed and the game is getting worse. I now play Jupiter 3 even more.
I’m thinking of processing it again and forgetting it in the bag for half a year.
And buy normal rubber without surprises.

 

[banbekas]

In fact, N80 is a very strange rubber.
I absolutely could not play with the first sheet. I put this on different blades, but there was no result. Then I treated N80 with seamun and baby oil, put it in a bag and forgot for a long time. After a while, I accidentally came across this, glued it with quick rubber glue onto a blade with a soft top layer of sipo, and behold, it started playing. I ordered a second sheet...
Out of the package it worked well, although this sheet weighs 4 grams more when trimmed... Now time has passed and the game is getting worse. I now play Jupiter 3 even more.
I’m thinking of processing it again and forgetting it in the bag for half a year.
And buy normal rubber without surprises.

The experience I have had is exactly the same as yours.
Two days ago I tried to play N80 again after a few months of letting it rot. It is wonderful, lol. Counterlooping is still godly but now, the loop and push are loaded with massive spin. What a strange rubber, lol

 

[z0uLess]

Honestly, I still think Off- blade is too fast, lol. I, myself, am using an Allround blade and it's more than fast enough for me. I'm even using unboosted B2 on my forehand. I think that getting a thinner rubber would make it even faster.

Yea, I have been going back and fourth and playing with Mark V on my backhand for a year was the best decision I ever made for my game, allthough it did make my backhand a bit passive at times since it just does not have to "umphf" to kick into peoples faces, and I cant really topspin with my backhand far from the table. Mark V has certainly improved my backhand abilities during this year ... maybe just not using hybrid rubber on forehand at all is the best for me. I like the idea of a beginner friendly hybrid rubber just so I get to counter-grip the ball far from the table (long forehands is something I am working on improving now).

I dont want to fall into this traditional mainland european hard/stiff plank with bouncy soft rubbers. This style has limits to the amount of spin you can create on powerful balls, I think. Thats why I tried to learn forehand technique with hard tacky rubbers and thin flexible blade so I got into the deep habit of playing with the flex of the blade and not just the rubber (shallow slow spin).

The discussion about speed is always about speed vs. control, but there seems to be no clear definition of what control is. As an example, H3 can be quite slow, but, for me, it lacks control as well since you need to be so insanely focused on creating spin every time you touch the ball.

Thankfully, my main blade is light and thin enough so the speed really isnt all that great. It is quite a few grams below average for the P500.

At the end of the day, most things work on my level. If I were to pick up a Peter Korbel with Rozena on both sides and play with that for a year. My game would all round improve in the areas where this setup shines.