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  1. UpSideDownCarl is offline
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    #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Hamasaki_Fanz
    The thing with hinoki blade (and especially with carbon) is that it has this kicking/catapult/bouncy (whatever you call it) properties, so it doesn't fit with the characteristic of Chinese rubber which require plenty amount of brushing.

    My suggestion, if you really want to have true experience with Chinese rubber, is to pair it with a solid limba blade with innerlayer ALC blade like Harimoto ALC, W968, HL5, etc. (By solid I mean the wood has solid feeling, i.e. higher desnity, and thus weighs more. Look for 93+ gram blade)
    Have you ever used a Hinoki blade with H3? I know a few guys who use that and are pretty happy with that.

    Also, Hinoki is soft and springy. But its main characteristic is that, it lets you grab the ball really well and hold the ball on the rubber a little longer, which goes perfectly with what H3 does well. Also, Hinoki is much faster when you are brushing than when you are hitting directly.

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    Setup 1: Blade by Nate: Vortex Spin Machine, FH Evolution MX-K, BH Evolution FX-P
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    #22
    Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl
    Have you ever used a Hinoki blade with H3? I know a few guys who use that and are pretty happy with that.

    Also, Hinoki is soft and springy. But its main characteristic is that, it lets you grab the ball really well and hold the ball on the rubber a little longer, which goes perfectly with what H3 does well. Also, Hinoki is much faster when you are brushing than when you are hitting directly.
    Ofc I've tried H3 in a hinoki blade. It just doesnt feel right. Sure it's playable, but you wont have the same quality when you loop underspin ball.
    Last edited by Hamasaki_Fanz; 01-14-2020 at 07:27 AM.

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    #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Amit Mehta
    Hi,

    Please find the short video in the YouTube link below. Apologies for poor quality and the angle. I hope it still gives some rough idea about my playing style.

    https://youtu.be/iR6OAF2Uh_I
    Technique looks good and clean, although I noticed something; at some balls you are standing on your heels. This is not so good of a habit, it makes your balance, and weight transfer, worse. Perhaps try leaning a bit forward on your toes! This should help you in the long term

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  4. UpSideDownCarl is offline
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    #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Hamasaki_Fanz
    Ofc I've tried H3 in a hinoki blade. It just doesnt feel right. Sure it's playable, but you wont have the same quality when you loop underspin ball.
    What you are talking about is personal preference. Not something that is cut and dry. Just because you don't like H3 on Hinoki does not mean they pair badly. And H3 gos pretty well on a Primorac Carbon which is a blade with a Hinoki top ply. It also goes quite with with Darker Speed 90.

    The Following 2 Users Like UpSideDownCarl's Post:

    NextLevel and thomas.pong

    Setup 1: Blade by Nate: Vortex Spin Machine, FH Evolution MX-K, BH Evolution FX-P
    Setup 2: OSP Virtuoso Plus, FH Rasanter R 48, BH Rasanter R 48
    Spin is Everything

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    #25
    Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl
    What you are talking about is personal preference. Not something that is cut and dry. Just because you don't like H3 on Hinoki does not mean they pair badly. And H3 gos pretty well on a Primorac Carbon which is a blade with a Hinoki top ply. It also goes quite with with Darker Speed 90.
    I think many people don't realize that a lot of feel is personal preference and of course that personal preference can change.

    I tried using a slower setup this week and I felt like I was going to damage my shoulder. As someone who has used slower setups for most of 8 years and used a faster one for half a year, it says a lot.

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    Cobra Kai TT Exponent - No mercy in this dojo, no matter your rating or the score. All spin, no power or footwork.

    "We don't rise to the level of our expectations, we fall to the level of our training" - Archilochus

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    #26
    Quote Originally Posted by NextLevel
    I think many people don't realize that a lot of feel is personal preference and of course that personal preference can change.

    I tried using a slower setup this week and I felt like I was going to damage my shoulder. As someone who has used slower setups for most of 8 years and used a faster one for half a year, it says a lot.
    It says adaptation happens very fast. If you used the slow setup for two weeks and then went back to your fast one you would spray balls everywhere, for a little while. I get the express veraion of this effect every time someone asks me to twiddle and bh block for them with inverted.

  7. Hamasaki_Fanz is offline
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    #27
    Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl
    What you are talking about is personal preference. Not something that is cut and dry. Just because you don't like H3 on Hinoki does not mean they pair badly. And H3 gos pretty well on a Primorac Carbon which is a blade with a Hinoki top ply. It also goes quite with with Darker Speed 90.
    If H3 goes well with Hinoki blade, then we will find majority of people using H3 rubber use Hinoki blade. However that's not the case Many people using Hinoki blade that I find always use medium/medium soft rubber.

    Let's just say that my 'personal preference' turns out to be the same with the majority's preference

  8. langel is offline
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    #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Hamasaki_Fanz
    If H3 goes well with Hinoki blade, then we will find majority of people using H3 rubber use Hinoki blade. However that's not the case Many people using Hinoki blade that I find always use medium/medium soft rubber.

    Let's just say that my 'personal preference' turns out to be the same with the majority's preference

    I do respect everyones personal feeling, if yours is wkat you say - let it be.

    But I, as well as many others, do have very different opinion.
    Today I wrote in another thread that Primorac Carbon and Xiom Vega Tour are the ones with the best synergy with great variety of rubbers and I do confirm that I know players happy enough with Primorac+H3N. In this statement "best" is my personal opinion.

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    #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Hamasaki_Fanz
    If H3 goes well with Hinoki blade, then we will find majority of people using H3 rubber use Hinoki blade. However that's not the case Many people using Hinoki blade that I find always use medium/medium soft rubber.

    Let's just say that my 'personal preference' turns out to be the same with the majority's preference
    There are people who will tell you that Hinoki blade is completely outdated and not for modern looping. So the people still using it are not the majority either. I struggle to think of a top player using Hinoki.
    Cobra Kai TT Exponent - No mercy in this dojo, no matter your rating or the score. All spin, no power or footwork.

    "We don't rise to the level of our expectations, we fall to the level of our training" - Archilochus

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    #30
    Quote Originally Posted by NextLevel
    There are people who will tell you that Hinoki blade is completely outdated and not for modern looping. So the people still using it are not the majority either. I struggle to think of a top player using Hinoki.
    I strugle to see in modern looping the quality of the ancient one.

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    #31
    Quote Originally Posted by langel
    I strugle to see in modern looping the quality of the ancient one.
    Depends on how you define quality and of course the ball changes and technical advances have affected everything.
    Cobra Kai TT Exponent - No mercy in this dojo, no matter your rating or the score. All spin, no power or footwork.

    "We don't rise to the level of our expectations, we fall to the level of our training" - Archilochus

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    #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Hamasaki_Fanz
    If H3 goes well with Hinoki blade, then we will find majority of people using H3 rubber use Hinoki blade.
    That is not actually how logic works. If there are many choices then a majority will not use any one blade material. H3 may go well with hinoki and also go well with koto and limba and ayous and spruce and walnut. Percentage of blades marketed with hinoki is small. A majority of soft rubber users don't have hinoki either. It is only one wood out of many top ply choices.

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  13. Amit Mehta is offline
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    #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Archyan
    Technique looks good and clean, although I noticed something; at some balls you are standing on your heels. This is not so good of a habit, it makes your balance, and weight transfer, worse. Perhaps try leaning a bit forward on your toes! This should help you in the long term
    Thank you!!! I will keep that in my mind now.

  14. merlin el mago is offline
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    #34
    Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl
    What you are talking about is personal preference. Not something that is cut and dry. Just because you don't like H3 on Hinoki does not mean they pair badly. And H3 gos pretty well on a Primorac Carbon which is a blade with a Hinoki top ply. It also goes quite with with Darker Speed 90.
    Primorac Carbon is a rocket.

  15. UpSideDownCarl is offline
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    #35
    Quote Originally Posted by merlin el mago
    Primorac Carbon is a rocket.
    Indeed. And I know a lot of older Chinese guys who love that blade with H3.
    Setup 1: Blade by Nate: Vortex Spin Machine, FH Evolution MX-K, BH Evolution FX-P
    Setup 2: OSP Virtuoso Plus, FH Rasanter R 48, BH Rasanter R 48
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    #36
    When young I used one with speed glue what was very fast and changed to Stiga Super Carbon a little less speed and more feeling.

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  17. Amit Mehta is offline
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    #37
    Update:


    I did an small experiment with my existing setup. I replaced my current blade (Andro Treiber FI Off) with my older bat (Stiga allround classic WRB) and kept the same rubbers on my forehand (DHS Hurricane 3, 39 hardness 2.1 thickness) and backhand (Rasanter R47 max thickness) and my feeling for the ball increased a lot. I've played with this setup for about 7-8 hours now and I must say that I like this setup more than the Treiber blade based setup. This setup is giving me more control and enough speed on my forehand. I think, I had more quality in my loop. Another good thing was that my backhand returned to good old times when I started with Stiga allround classic WRB + Yasaka Rakza 7 setup. I'm now able to flick and open with my backhand lot more , which was quite difficult for me with the heavier blade (Trieber FI off). I'm now planning to stick with this setup for at least this season (4-5 months) and will purchase Viscaria or any other blade (Now i'm bit more inclined towards an all wood based, Stiga clipper wood WRB, because I think, at my level this would be a natural progression than the big jump to Viscaria) only after my basic movements on the court become more fluid and
    if there is an actual *need*.

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    #38
    At the beginning I learned a lot of table tennis technique using Stiga All Round blades with Tackiness Drive, was my prefered setup to learn the strokes & this is my advice for all people starting our sport.

  19. UpSideDownCarl is offline
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    #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Amit Mehta
    Update:


    I did an small experiment with my existing setup. I replaced my current blade (Andro Treiber FI Off) with my older bat (Stiga allround classic WRB) and kept the same rubbers on my forehand (DHS Hurricane 3, 39 hardness 2.1 thickness) and backhand (Rasanter R47 max thickness) and my feeling for the ball increased a lot. I've played with this setup for about 7-8 hours now and I must say that I like this setup more than the Treiber blade based setup. This setup is giving me more control and enough speed on my forehand. I think, I had more quality in my loop. Another good thing was that my backhand returned to good old times when I started with Stiga allround classic WRB + Yasaka Rakza 7 setup. I'm now able to flick and open with my backhand lot more , which was quite difficult for me with the heavier blade (Trieber FI off). I'm now planning to stick with this setup for at least this season (4-5 months) and will purchase Viscaria or any other blade (Now i'm bit more inclined towards an all wood based, Stiga clipper wood WRB, because I think, at my level this would be a natural progression than the big jump to Viscaria) only after my basic movements on the court become more fluid and
    if there is an actual *need*.
    A natural progression from Allround Classic would be:

    1) Stiga Allround Evolution
    2) Stiga Offensive Classic
    3) Nexy Spear
    4) Xiom Offensive S
    5) Primorac Off-
    6) Korbel
    7) Tibhar Stratus Power Wood
    8) Nittaku Acoustic
    9) OSP Virtuoso Off-
    10) OSP Virtuoso Plus

    Those are in no particular order. They are simply a moderate jump (two levels) up from Allround Classic. Whereas, Clipper is a giant jump (4 speed classes) and Viscaria would be an even bigger jump with a blade with a hard top ply (different than Allround Classic or any of the blades above) and add the hard Koto top ply to the reduced feeling and dampening qualities of the ALC layer, and it would be like going from rollerskates to a rocket ship in terms of jump in equipment.

    All the blades listed above are all wood. And they all have the same top ply as the Stiga Allround Classic (Limba) so you will have a feeling from the blade that is related to what you have in the Allround Classic, on a blade that is moderately faster: a useful amount faster.

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    Last edited by UpSideDownCarl; 01-21-2020 at 03:16 PM.
    Setup 1: Blade by Nate: Vortex Spin Machine, FH Evolution MX-K, BH Evolution FX-P
    Setup 2: OSP Virtuoso Plus, FH Rasanter R 48, BH Rasanter R 48
    Spin is Everything

  20. Amit Mehta is offline
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    #40
    Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl
    A natural progression from Allround Classic would be:

    1) Stiga Allround Evolution
    2) Stiga Offensive Classic
    3) Nexy Spear
    4) Xiom Offensive S
    5) Primorac Off-
    6) Korbel
    7) Tibhar Stratus Power Wood
    8) Nittaku Acoustic
    9) OSP Virtuoso Off-
    10) OSP Virtuoso Plus

    Those are in no particular order. They are simply a moderate jump (two levels) up from Allround Classic. Whereas, Clipper is a giant jump (4 speed classes) and Viscaria would be an even bigger jump with a blade with a hard top ply (different than Allround Classic or any of the blades above) and add the hard Koto top ply to the reduced feeling and dampening qualities of the ALC layer, and it would be like going from rollerskates to a rocket ship in terms of jump in equipment.

    All the blades listed above are all wood. And they all have the same top ply as the Stiga Allround Classic (Limba) so you will have a feeling from the blade that is related to what you have in the Allround Classic, on a blade that is moderately faster: a useful amount faster.
    Many thanks for the list.

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