BREAKING: Ma Long & Fan Zhendong boycott CHINA OPEN!

[Sakumi]

Interesting observation that I am not sure I think the same way... I personally do not like Sakumi's writing. He only needs to say a few words without evidence/data then Baal disclosed everything.

I'm the one saying things without evidence? Apparently personal experience does not account for any evidence. I think your views are very biased. Where is your evidence to agree with Baal's comments? You have no opinions supported by facts to make your own opinion without piggy backing off others. Baal has genuine experience with the matter so his opinions are valid but I don't agree with his offhand way of expressing it but maybe he expects people to understand both sides of the discussion. This is a perfect example of why I got irritated in the first place because people such as Tropical only scratch the surface to get information (i.e. just listening to what others have to say) without an interest to search for deeper for information and use it as an excuse to make them seem knowledgeable. If you want to have a valid opinion you need to have supporting evidence, not just ride off others.

 

[Baal]

Well, I didn't reveal much in the way of facts not already in evidence.

1. We know that the players Webo accounts were shut down with an official announcement that it was "in accord with regulations".

2. We know China controls their internet as much as they can (try to log into Wikipedia on the mainland) and their media is state run. But the internet is something that is awfully hard to actually control, as almost every government on earth has learned. The disputes between Google and China have been very well documented.

3. We can read the ridiculous "apologies" from the players, but we also know they are superstars. They are not going to the gulag. I don't know for sure, but the easiest way to punish them is to dock their pay and reduce their endorsement visibility (and that might cost them big time).

4. We can learn from our Chinese speaking friends how this is being accepted by anonymous bloggers, commenters and such (in other words, people are not taking it well and are critical of GSA, which is really interesting, and I am grateful to our Chinese speaking forum members for reporting this).

5. Saying that China is like North Korea like someone did is ridiculous. In Saudi Arabia they behead protesters and women are like chattel. China is nothing like that. (But it is not like France or Sweden either). I like this video. It kind of encapsulates a lot of my experiences and views (although I am a lot older than these two guys). These two guys like living in China.

It also reveals by far the most efficient way to travel in Chinese cities (scooters)! It also gives a really clear view of what Chinese cities look and feel like. It will not be everybody's cup of tea, but I like it for several weeks on end (and then need to get back to a place with a bit more personal space).

5. As for my experience in China, I have mentioned it before. I don't consider myself any sort of expert, but I have maybe more knowledge than the average American about life there. I don't feel constrained when I am there. People are friendly. I am not real worried about anyone getting to upset about my pointing out things that western journalists living in China mention frequently.

 

[tropical]

Yeap.. you are the one that I do not trust to disclose anything. You need to show how credible you are first before accusing us biased. I have not seen anything that proves you are credible like you want to hint.

 

[Sakumi]

Yeap.. you are the one that I do not trust to disclose anything. You need to show how credible you are first before accusing us biased. I have not seen anything that proves you are credible like you want to hint.

I haven't stated a single piece of evidence so I'm not sure how you came to the conclusion of me not being credible. I have simply just been giving my opinion on how other people express their opinion/ information to make the discussion not biased and giving misinformed people (such as yourself clearly) the wrong picture. Discussions need both sides of the argument to come to a suitable solution so by only stating one side and not the other is wrong and I was trying to correct that. You're asking me for information to prove my credibility yet I haven't said anything that requires credibility. I think you need to look at what you are saying in this thread and assess the validity of what you are saying because at the moment you are spurting out very biased opinions without a single shred of evidence and like I said before, you are piggy backing off other people's opinions so you have no right to point out other people. The only time I gave some information was when I also said "take it with a pinch of salt" because I do not like to mislead people with information that is not 100% true, it was meant to be something helpful in this discussion.

 

[NextLevel]

I haven't stated a single piece of evidence so I'm not sure how you came to the conclusion of me not being credible. I have simply just been giving my opinion on how other people express their opinion/ information to make the discussion not biased and giving misinformed people (such as yourself clearly) the wrong picture. Discussions need both sides of the argument to come to a suitable solution so by only stating one side and not the other is wrong and I was trying to correct that. You're asking me for information to prove my credibility yet I haven't said anything that requires credibility. I think you need to look at what you are saying in this thread and assess the validity of what you are saying because at the moment you are spurting out very biased opinions without a single shred of evidence and like I said before, you are piggy backing off other people's opinions so you have no right to point out other people. The only time I gave some information was when I also said "take it with a pinch of salt" because I do not like to mislead people with information that is not 100% true, it was meant to be something helpful in this discussion.

You are repeating ttmonster's and Tropical's point. You are simply asking people to prove themselves when there is no good reason to listen to you.

 

[rainneverever]

Photos were taken on the flight from Chengdu to Beijing. In yellow is ML.
They used the VIP entrance of Chengdu airport thus no media photos and interviews so far.

 

[Sakumi]

You are repeating ttmonster's and Tropical's point. You are simply asking people to prove themselves when there is no good reason to listen to you.

Nope. If you read what I was saying carefully you would realise that I wasn't asking anyone to prove themselves so stop assuming. If you don't want to listen to what I have to say then that's fine but you are just ignoring the most important part of a basic discussion. I'm not going to repeat my point because I think I have made it fairly obvious, if you aren't willing to take the time to read what I have to say I'm just going to rule this comment out as being meaningless.

 

[ttmonster]

when you want to people to read and understand what your opinion :

1. You need to establish your credibility . Which you don't have in this forum , I haven't seen you posting anything that helps to improve that.
2. You need to write in clear english ... sometimes your english is very good and sometimes its not. Either you are taking help from someone or you are someone pretending to be someone else ... I don't know which is which ... again this diminishes your credibility in an online english forum ...
3. You have said a lot of things without quoting any sources or evidence ... someone like Baal, raineverever or pingfun post their experiences , information and then their opinion .. you are just repeating yourself without any logic , or evidence ...

Your behavior is typical of what we call "frog in a well" ... you would rather live in the well and consider it as ocean and even if you come out to the ocean you treat it as well and try to find frogs from the same well , instead of expressing an unbiased opinion of your experiences in China you just keep saying to everybody they are wrong , what is right ? can you please explain logically with your experience ? can you quote news sources ? do you know somebody who knows somebody ... else please don't repeat the "everything is great in China" brainwashed propaganda we are so used to hearing from most people who are born and brought up in that culture , or follow that strange code similar to omerta where you cannot say anything against the family even if its true ...

Nope. If you read what I was saying carefully you would realise that I wasn't asking anyone to prove themselves so stop assuming. If you don't want to listen to what I have to say then that's fine but you are just ignoring the most important part of a basic discussion. I'm not going to repeat my point because I think I have made it fairly obvious, if you aren't willing to take the time to read what I have to say I'm just going to rule this comment out as being meaningless.

 

[Trismegistus]

Let's try to stay on topic. Resolve your disagreements privately, if possible.

 

[ttmonster]

We were on topic Trismegistus till somebody came and tried to disprove discount all opinions which don't support their own ... point is this is forum and and people can agree to disagree but you cannot discount somebody without any evidence ... its similar to what is happening with the CNT players, the philosophy is same ... don't express opinions which I don't agree with ... so we had to call the person out .. I hope you understand ..

Let's try to stay on topic. Resolve your disagreements privately, if possible.

 

[Sakumi]

when you want to people to read and understand what your opinion :

1. You need to establish your credibility . Which you don't have in this forum , I haven't seen you posting anything that helps to improve that.
2. You need to write in clear english ... sometimes your english is very good and sometimes its not. Either you are taking help from someone or you are someone pretending to be someone else ... I don't know which is which ... again this diminishes your credibility in an online english forum ...
3. You have said a lot of things without quoting any sources or evidence ... someone like Baal, raineverever or pingfun post their experiences , information and then their opinion .. you are just repeating yourself without any logic , or evidence ...

Your behavior is typical of what we call "frog in a well" ... you would rather live in the well and consider it as ocean and even if you come out to the ocean you treat it as well and try to find frogs from the same well , instead of expressing an unbiased opinion of your experiences in China you just keep saying to everybody they are wrong , what is right ? can you please explain logically with your experience ? can you quote news sources ? do you know somebody who knows somebody ... else please don't repeat the "everything is great in China" brainwashed propaganda we are so used to hearing from most people who are born and brought up in that culture , or follow that strange code similar to omerta where you cannot say anything against the family even if its true ...

I have heard of the "frog in a well" analogy but I don't think that is my behaviour, in fact I think it is the complete opposite. I'm not trying to dispprove any opinions and like I've said already I haven't had to say anything that requires evidence. I'm not sure where the no logic part comes in though.

To put it simply, when I read through this thread the majority of comments were very biased and one sided. I accept that as your opinion but I felt as though the thread had comments that were quite negative and only told part of the story. I did not disagree with any of the opinions (they are all true) I have read on this thread but I feel that it is necessary to include information and facts that don't make China seem like a horrible place. It just makes it a fair discussion and also can help people that aren't aware of what is happening form an educated opinion instead of having a biased one due to the largely negative comments. That is all I wanted, and that was my only purpose in commenting on this forum. I find this topic very interesting and I am eager to learn what will happen. I didn't come on this thread to accuse people of their credibility and the validity of their information because I do not know any of you in person and cannot make a good judgement of you as a person - apparently the opposite applies for me because I have not been here as long etc.

If you read above you will understand that I didn't need to provide evidence because there is nothing to provide evidence for and that I was not discounting any opinions but only asked for the truth to be shown so that people could make their own opinion with all the information available. In my view the internet is wrongly used by the media to propogate information that is very biased and does not tell the whole truth and that is what I felt this forum was starting to become.

 

[xuxinpower]

They seem to be smiling sometimes so maybe not too worried... Also, is that coach Wu Jingping on the second picture on the left ? I did not hear he was supporting this boycott ?

Photos were taken on the flight from Chengdu to Beijing. In yellow is ML.
They used the VIP entrance of Chengdu airport thus no media photos and interviews so far.

 

[Baal]

Flying economy it looks like.

 

[rainneverever]

Yes, Coach Wu.
He once liked Liu Guodong's Weibo post in support of his brother LGL. However, Liu Guodong's post was deleted.

They seem to be smiling sometimes so maybe not too worried... Also, is that coach Wu Jingping on the second picture on the left ? I did not hear he was supporting this boycott ?

 

[rainneverever]

Yes, most were in main cabin while ZJK in biz.

Flying economy it looks like.

 

[Baal]

Yes, most were in main cabin while ZJK in biz.

Amazing you know all these details. Next we will learn that you are actually Xu Xin.

 

[rainneverever]

You may miss another thread in which I was said to be LGL

Amazing you know all these details. Next we will learn that you are actually Xu Xin.

 

[MasterMyself]

You may miss another thread in which I was said to be LGL

I think you are the secretary of the CNT

 

[tropical]

Just talked to my Chinese acupuncturist today. She is well aware of what was going on with the China Open even she doesn't play table tennis or know who the players are. Her point of view is basically same like majority of us in the forum. She said the government won't let the players get away easily because they want to make sure similar boycott will never happen again. How severe the punishment is we can only guess.

 

[sgroustra]

What kind of punishment though, is it just financial or are there going to be training/tournament consequences?