Ideas for makeshift return board/spin "measurement" device

[Archosaurus]

Those look like great deals. I'd really just have to convince my dad to let me buy overseas. As long as I'm not paying the rent, it's his rules, you see, and he does have a point so I'm not going to argue too much. I'll look through the sites and take your considerations into mind.

I don't think an OFF- would be too fast for me, and definitely not too slow to be unplayable. I play with an ALL blade, and I can vary it from as slow as I want to as fast as it will go, but I'd really like more sudden rebound speed. I feel like the harder I swing with my ALL blade, the more diminishing returns I get due to the rate of the blade being so low.

It's not that I need a ton of effort to play a fast ball with my setup. My strokes are a lot more efficient than they used to be, and lack of energy to get the ball over the net is never a problem.

I think I've pretty easily reached the reasonable max speed of this blade, so a faster, more sudden rebound off the rubber wouldn't hurt me. As it is now, my rubber doesn't catch onto the ball in the slightest and I can still graze it (Although with little spin produced unless a rare case) so I could probably learn to loop easily with an OFF- as long as the rubber is any good.

OFF and faster, especially with carbon, would probably be sub-optimal but not completely unplayable. The feel from a slightly slower wood blade is something I think I should really have for a few more years, though.

I'll play for 5 more years then look into a rocket launcher to see if it benefits me. Right now, I can't even afford one, so it's irrelevant.

 

[Suga D]

Just to give a slight idea how a Pull Ball can look performed by my good friend Dr. Damanik.

I wanted to post a little earlier in this thread, but just couldn't make it.
Hope this is useful.

A little addendum:

My friend was visiting for the weekend and we had the chance to take a new vid.
The ball's curve and bounce show a little the imparted spin.

Maybe this here can help a little.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Ideas for makeshift return board/spin "measurement" device

@Suga D: he is getting a real nice amount of spin on the ball. I bet he's like NextLevel and Der_Echte who like to say: "I like to put heavy topspin on the ball!"

@Archi:

I don't think an OFF- would be too fast for me...

A good All+ to Off- blade is what you want. Certainly not faster. All would be okay too. But somewhere in the All+ - Off- range is ideal.

....but I'd really like more sudden rebound speed.

You are indeed skilled at being your own worst enemy and clearly don't know much about equipment. So, here is some info for you. The speed of a blade and the dwell time--the racket's natural ability to let the ball stay on the blade face longer to generate more spin--are not entirely connected. They are mostly connected. But not entirely. So you can have a slow blade with low dwell time. And you can have a blade that is considerably faster but with noticeably more dwell time.

For you, you definitely don't want a racket with "more sudden rebound"!!!! You want the opposite regardless of the speed. You want a 5 ply, all wood blade with good flex, good feel and good DWELL TIME so you can learn to hold the ball on the blade face for longer which is how you learn to spin the ball better.

Nothing wrong with Off-, but you don't want a racket that has more sudden rebound.

And trust me, as you get better you will understand how much more power you will be able to impart onto the ball as your mechanics continue to improve.

 

[Der_Echte]

That dude's impact on his normal loops is a LOT more similar to Next Level than me. He is striking it mostly solid with a firm wrist. My impact and way of making topspin is a lot different on my normal opening loop, but that is just me and I shouldn't be copied for any study of how to do it right, in fact, I should be studied for the opposite, because like Carl, I am really upside-down in my view of the world.

 

[Shuki]

It's hard to just trust things about equipment without having the chance to test out a lot of equipment. It seems to me, the majority of better players always recommend using a blade with good feel, flexibility and dwell time and try so hard to push players away from the OFF area of the spectrum.

I myself, have tested quite a bit of equipment, and even though higher rated players would recommend slower all wood blades, I couldn't get myself to just stick with one of those. I've spent 3000$+ on trying different blades and learning so much about them. You get to the point where you use a blade and you'll just think "I can control this so well but if it was just a small bit faster it would be perfect". Then the next blade you try lacks somewhere else.

In the end I came down to a 5 ply all wood blade as my equipment choice, and have improved so much since I stuck with it. And now, when players come to me for blade advice and I tell them what to get, I can tell they want something different than what I'm saying.

Especially when players come to me looking for stroke advice (newbies, that are often guided toward me since I'm known as "the welcomer" at our clubs). They'll be using some dead raquet and I'll tell them thats why their stroke is so upward, because they need to go upward with the stuff they're using. Then I'll let them try one of my loaner paddles while I teach them and let them use it throughout the night. My loaner paddles I sell for 35$ but its good enough equipment to learn the correct strokes on. I'll ask them if they want to buy it at the end of their playing sessions and they'll often reply to the question with "I'm not at a level where I'm ready for changing my strokes."

Lost my train of thought a few times in this post...

TLDR: Go for a blade with good feeling, good dwell, flexible. You'll improve quicker and in the right way. Just because it's an ALL or OFF- blade doesn't mean it has these characteristics.

 

[NextLevel]

My current set up is 5 ply all wood with limba outers classic blade. OFF-/OFF. Just saying. It can be a bit head heavy though which is why I love Hexer so much. IT's a relatively light rubber for what it does. But there are lots of similar blades either cheaper or more expensive which are not as head heavy. But playing TT without a job as an adult learner is a different and funny experience.

If Archo was a nicer person, I might actually have donated him a blade. But he is too mean to accept my charity.

 

[ttmonster]

Lmaof

if archo was a nicer person, i might actually have donated him a blade. But he is too mean to accept my charity.

 

[ttmonster]

You have to wait a few more days then, Carl is slowly turning him ..... soon he will change his handle to UpSideDownArcho

My current set up is 5 ply all wood with limba outers classic blade. OFF-/OFF. Just saying. It can be a bit head heavy though which is why I love Hexer so much. IT's a relatively light rubber for what it does. But there are lots of similar blades either cheaper or more expensive which are not as head heavy. But playing TT without a job as an adult learner is a different and funny experience.

If Archo was a nicer person, I might actually have donated him a blade. But he is too mean to accept my charity.

 

[Archosaurus]

NextLevel, I'm too much of a scrooge to accept free stuff, especially from people who've sacrificed their time to help me.


If I change my handle to UpSideDownArcho, will it also include the orange name?

 

[ttmonster]

For that you would have to be an equipment expert you can see why NextLevel's is white , because he is an EJ unlike an EE like Carl ... sorry guys could not help

NextLevel, I'm too much of a scrooge to accept free stuff, especially from people who've sacrificed their time to help me.


If I change my handle to UpSideDownArcho, will it also include the orange name?

 

[ttmonster]

And seriously Archo, I don't get the concerns around shipping from China, I know you don't want to fight your father, but sooner or later he has to wake up to the fact that the whole world is running by shipping from China or wherever the thing is getting made cheaper. Unless Sanders becomes the president and renegotiates all the International Trade Deals I don't think that reality is going to change anytime sooner

 

[pgpg]

And seriously Archo, I don't get the concerns around shipping from China, I know you don't want to fight your father, but sooner or later he has to wake up to the fact that the whole world is running by shipping from China or wherever the thing is getting made cheaper. Unless Sanders becomes the president and renegotiates all the International Trade Deals I don't think that reality is going to change anytime sooner

I thought it was Trump who was going to do that, and it might take a while to impact Finland . Also - is objection to buying from China or any foreign retailer? I guess it's your house and your rules, but you do limit yourself severely here, unless there is a great TT shop in Finland I'm not aware of.

Still, I gently suggest going the 'used' route: cost efficient and improvement over current situation.

P.S. Do all folks in Finland write in flawless English?

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Ideas for makeshift return board/spin "measurement" device

For that you would have to be an equipment expert you can see why NextLevel's is white , because he is an EJ unlike an EE like Carl ... sorry guys could not help

So, EE is short for Ex EJ??? Do I have that right now?

Truth is, I think I have that EE title because I have a big mouth and talk too much. I have a small area of expertise. And the rest is hot air.

But NextLevel really knows his stuff on today's equipment. And I think he deserves the Equipment Expert title. I've actually told that to Dan more than a few times.

You can learn a ton if you listen to NL on equipment advice. I just have a ton of patience from how often I have to convince uptight ladies how to do things more safely in my Yoga Classes. Hahaha.

 

[ttmonster]

You are cracking me up Carl . Anybody who can convince ladies , let alone uptight ladies have done a post doctorate in patience ... not being sexist just that they are a completely different animal compared to what we are ... like one of my friends says its almost unfair that we are expected to understand and convince them

I know NextLevel really knows his stuff , but I was just trying to make a joke because he is not an "Equipment Expert" and you are , according to TableTennisDaily

Dan did even message me once to write a couple of reviews, then again I am nowhere around the level you guys are so I politely declined ...

So, EE short for Ex EJ??? Do I have that right now?

Truth is, I think I have that EE title because I have a big mouth and talk too much. I have a small area of expertise. And the rest is hot air.

But NextLevel really knows his stuff on today's equipment. And I think he deserves the Equipment Expert title. I've actually told that to Dan more than a few times.

You can learn a ton if you listen to NL on equipment advice. I just have a ton of patience from how often I have to convince uptight ladies how to do things more safely in my Yoga Classes. Hahaha.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Dan did even message me once to write a couple of reviews, then again I am nowhere around the level you guys are so I politely declined ...

Ah-man, you can write reviews. You know your stuff.

 

[ttmonster]

Not really Carl, not on the equipment front , I have mostly played with two three paddles at most in my life and a few rubbers ... I will hold on a few more years till I get a fat paycheck that will pay enough to buy paddles and rubbers on a whim

Ah-man, you can write reviews. You know your stuff.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Not really Carl, not on the equipment front , I have mostly played with two three paddles at most in my life and a few rubbers ... I will hold on a few more years till I get a fat paycheck that will pay enough to buy paddles and rubbers on a whim

You still can describe what you feel with the equipment you have used. You don't have to say your an expert. Heck, I feel weird about that title. I already said I have that more for my big mouth and knowing how to explain things to fussy ladies, ummm, wait, I mean tough TT playing forum members....

There is one other reason: from about 6 years ago till about 4 years ago I played at a club that had a lot of members. 100s. It was in NYC's Chinatown.

One of the guys who worked at the club was a big time EJ and a guy I knew from years before. He would get every single person in the club to let him try their gear. He would do that while helping me get better. And he would make me try all those blades too. At first he would tell me what he felt because I really didn't know much. Back then I was a beginner. But he knew.

At a certain point I started being able to feel stuff.

Now the truth is, in what I teach and what I practice (the yoga thing is what I'm talking about) a huge part of that practice is really about feeling what you are doing with/to your body from an internal perspective. So here I was, learning to play and having this guy say, "feel how this one is softer; feel how this one is crisper; feel how this wood helps you grab the ball; feel the way this sponge makes it hard to feel the ball; feel how the carbon makes it harder to feel the ball; feel how grippy the topsheet is....." etc. So, I already love trying to feel subtle differences in things, and I am being asked to do that over and over again by this guy who is doing tests with putting different chemicals on rubbers. Hahaha. Back then I tried so many different setups.

But at a certain point I realized, back then my technique wasn't good enough to allow me to feel certain things about rubbers and blades that I can now.

All that being said, in the last year, I haven't really tried almost anything; and in the last two years I've tried only a few more things than I tried this last year. I am really no longer interested. I have several rackets that all would be good enough for me. But I like the one I am using because I like the big wood feel of Limba that my OSP V+ has.

And in terms of equipment, the main thing I am good for is this: when someone thinks they are a more advanced player but really are just beginning to learn real table tennis technique, I'm good at helping that person understand equipment that would help him/her improve. If someone is actually a level where more advanced equipment is actually going to be good for the person, I am good at sorting that out. So it is really more about reading people than knowing much about equipment. That is why I ask so many questions when someone says something like:

"Hey guys, I am an advanced national level player and I am looking for the fastest blade and rubbers there is, because I want the best equipment."

I can figure out if that is Sebas trying to provide some fun for the forum and trying to get a laugh on who will think he really wants to sit in a chair and loop with his wrist. But I will also be able to figure out if that is Archi just misunderstanding his actual level and his real equipment needs. Sometimes I'll even be able to get a delusional character to figure out who they really are as long as their name isn't The Nutty Professor!

Anyway, if you did write a review, all you would have to do is write what you feel and how you feel about something you really have used. Don't misunderestimate yourself!! Yes, I think I just made up a new word.

 

[Der_Echte]

I have next to no writing skillz and cannot spell worth a lick, but I wrote a couple... so ANYONE can.

 

[Archosaurus]

"Don't misunderestimate yourself!"

I understand the problems with shipping overseas and also the benefits and what the actual risk is when receiving goods overseas, but let's just say my father is naive. Maybe I will convince him, maybe not.

@pgpg

I wish it was true, but no, they don't. The majority of Finnish people are rubbish at English, but the younger generation, which I am part of, are starting to learn a bit.

I'm not entirely Finnish and I've spoken and written English for nearly my entire life, so I don't think I'm the best example. I started off speaking Greek but I've long since forgotten the language, and my parents started speaking English at home, probably to give me this language ability later in life. Along with knowing Finnish, too.

I'm learning a few languages right now, with entirely different writing systems than latin, and let me tell you, it's like playing a game on easy mode when you can learn multiple languages at a young age. It's not so easy anymore!

 

[ttmonster]

Confession, I have read this post almost thrice from yesterday. Thank you Carl, its very written. Seriously, you should write your memoirs with the colorful life you have had .. and I am not kidding . Now that you have made a new addition to OED , I will have to write a review in foreseeable future

You still can describe what you feel with the equipment you have used. You don't have to say your an expert. Heck, I feel weird about that title. I already said I have that more for my big mouth and knowing how to explain things to fussy ladies, ummm, wait, I mean tough TT playing forum members....

There is one other reason: from about 6 years ago till about 4 years ago I played at a club that had a lot of members. 100s. It was in NYC's Chinatown.

One of the guys who worked at the club was a big time EJ and a guy I knew from years before. He would get every single person in the club to let him try their gear. He would do that while helping me get better. And he would make me try all those blades too. At first he would tell me what he felt because I really didn't know much. Back then I was a beginner. But he knew.

At a certain point I started being able to feel stuff.

Now the truth is, in what I teach and what I practice (the yoga thing is what I'm talking about) a huge part of that practice is really about feeling what you are doing with/to your body from an internal perspective. So here I was, learning to play and having this guy say, "feel how this one is softer; feel how this one is crisper; feel how this wood helps you grab the ball; feel the way this sponge makes it hard to feel the ball; feel how the carbon makes it harder to feel the ball; feel how grippy the topsheet is....." etc. So, I already love trying to feel subtle differences in things, and I am being asked to do that over and over again by this guy who is doing tests with putting different chemicals on rubbers. Hahaha. Back then I tried so many different setups.

But at a certain point I realized, back then my technique wasn't good enough to allow me to feel certain things about rubbers and blades that I can now.

All that being said, in the last year, I haven't really tried almost anything; and in the last two years I've tried only a few more things than I tried this last year. I am really no longer interested. I have several rackets that all would be good enough for me. But I like the one I am using because I like the big wood feel of Limba that my OSP V+ has.

And in terms of equipment, the main thing I am good for is this: when someone thinks they are a more advanced player but really are just beginning to learn real table tennis technique, I'm good at helping that person understand equipment that would help him/her improve. If someone is actually a level where more advanced equipment is actually going to be good for the person, I am good at sorting that out. So it is really more about reading people than knowing much about equipment. That is why I ask so many questions when someone says something like:

"Hey guys, I am an advanced national level player and I am looking for the fastest blade and rubbers there is, because I want the best equipment."

I can figure out if that is Sebas trying to provide some fun for the forum and trying to get a laugh on who will think he really wants to sit in a chair and loop with his wrist. But I will also be able to figure out if that is Archi just misunderstanding his actual level and his real equipment needs. Sometimes I'll even be able to get a delusional character to figure out who they really are as long as their name isn't The Nutty Professor!

Anyway, if you did write a review, all you would have to do is write what you feel and how you feel about something you really have used. Don't misunderestimate yourself!! Yes, I think I just made up a new word.