Usage of Finger by a memebr on MyTT Forum

[ttmonster]

Thank you ! okay , kind of like what Timo is doing .. flipping everything well needs a lot of footwork to get there and then get back , without regular training with coach on multiball sets like that its difficult to sustain ...

By the way, the coach that SmashFan worked with definitely presented that receiving serve with the FH you want your index finger to move up and more centered. He also wanted you to turn to an extreme BH grip with the thumb on the rubber for receiving with BH. And he wanted you to flip everything.

 

[ttmonster]

Yes, you think I haven't seen the trend ... I guess its reverse trolling .. or something ..

Aha, Monster, so you also see how he brings up this topic he knows so much about, wanting us to start talking and won't give us the goods.

Somewhere after the ball has gotten rolling he will make one of those long and rambling stories where, in 3-6 successive posts he will have presented so much information and most people won't even be able to figure it out because the message is coded into the stories in between sentences about the goon squad falling through the trap door on the Brooklyn Bridge yet again.

 

[Der_Echte]

Aha, I am deeply honored to be credited with knowing so much about the topic I started... when all I am really doing is tossing out a bone to get people to chew on so I can watch and learn myself.

Reverse trolling? Is that like letting the Goon Squad chase you while you drive in reverse and engage the trap door at just the right moment?

Nah, it is much less risky to hire a girl in a mini-skirt and stockings for a an hours work to bend over and pretend to pickup Pro versions of National rubber from the floor to funnel the Goonies to the kill zone.

 

[Der_Echte]

ROK... many coaches seem to scold players for doing exactly what leaves such a 45 degree zone of finger wipe as represented in your picture, but I truly believe it is just fine.

Damn, ttmonster is on to how I built up my post count over the years... but Damn. If I tossed all those ideas, comments, cheerleading and whatever into only one post each time, China would have zero need for the Great Wall.

 

[rokphish]

ROK... many coaches seem to scold players for doing exactly what leaves such a 45 degree zone of finger wipe as represented in your picture, but I truly believe it is just fine.

That's why you're better than many coaches! [emoji41] [emoji123]

 

[Der_Echte]

ROK, I'm not better than most coaches, just a heck of a lot different attitude and perspective different. I agree with many of "Mainstream" coaching fundamentals and their associated reasoning, but seriously differ on many contentious point. That alone doesn't make one better, just different.

Personally, I would gage the effectiveness of adult coaching by the degree the player grows in skill and results in matches and how/what areas the player grew. Is the player buying into an endstate or does the player have a plan to get there and a possible path? Is the player learning the root causes of problems, why they happen, how factors affect each other and how to deal with them? Does the player have a progressive path or a solution that needs only one remedy?

These are a few measures I would employ to discern the effectiveness of one who coaches adult learners.

It is true many who coach adults use the same methods they use for children to adults. I firmly believe that doesn't work well with adults in all areas. That is where I begin to differ and it grows from there.

I do not have any players who have been committed to work with me (like NL has) so I have zero track record to measure myself against the standards I discussed. However, many players have a good bullshyt filter and can tell if something effective or not. Maybe that is the basis I would receive any credit for taking in ideas I have heard and seen and taking 5x as long to explain them with rambling Goon Squad story telling.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Yes, you think I haven't seen the trend ... I guess its reverse trolling .. or something ..

Aha, I am deeply honored to be credited with knowing so much about the topic I started... when all I am really doing is tossing out a bone to get people to chew on so I can watch and learn myself.

Reverse trolling? Is that like letting the Goon Squad chase you while you drive in reverse and engage the trap door at just the right moment?

Nah, it is much less risky to hire a girl in a mini-skirt and stockings for a an hours work to bend over and pretend to pickup Pro versions of National rubber from the floor to funnel the Goonies to the kill zone.

Trolling = a troll makes comments to snag people into debates for the purpose of gaining attention, even if it ends up being negative attention.

Reverse Trolling = Der_Echte makes comments to try and bring attention and accolades to others who he lures into making good posts with his leading comments.

Hahahaha.

Der_Echte is The Original. We can see your game. [emoji2]

Say, is that PPH over there? Gotta go!


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[rokphish]

ROK, I'm not better than most coaches, just a heck of a lot different attitude and perspective different. I agree with many of "Mainstream" coaching fundamentals and their associated reasoning, but seriously differ on many contentious point. That alone doesn't make one better, just different.

Personally, I would gage the effectiveness of adult coaching by the degree the player grows in skill and results in matches and how/what areas the player grew. Is the player buying into an endstate or does the player have a plan to get there and a possible path? Is the player learning the root causes of problems, why they happen, how factors affect each other and how to deal with them? Does the player have a progressive path or a solution that needs only one remedy?

These are a few measures I would employ to discern the effectiveness of one who coaches adult learners.

It is true many who coach adults use the same methods they use for children to adults. I firmly believe that doesn't work well with adults in all areas. That is where I begin to differ and it grows from there.

I do not have any players who have been committed to work with me (like NL has) so I have zero track record to measure myself against the standards I discussed. However, many players have a good bullshyt filter and can tell if something effective or not. Maybe that is the basis I would receive any credit for taking in ideas I have heard and seen and taking 5x as long to explain them with rambling Goon Squad story telling.

You say different, I say better. Ha!

I'd still back up what I said earlier. That you're better than many coaches. Your reply just part of confirmation on that. And if you were to be a coach, you'd be a damned fine one. Whether you get any students worth coaching is different matter.

I've my fair share of coaches, used to pay for coaching from one of national team members who won medals for the country. And also varying degrees of achivements of other coaches. I see for myself the great results of fairly less known coach with good methods vs famous/high ranking players who coaches, sadly to say just stringing people for money.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Is it something like this? Ot something else?

When I used to use inverted on the backhand, the residual mark much more visible.

[emoji2]

Wear patterns from fingers on my OSP blade:

Soon the Karis M on the KJH will look like that too.


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[Ilia Minkin]

[emoji2]

Wear patterns from fingers on my OSP blade:

Soon the Karis M on the KJH will look like that too.


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The spots suggets that you play a lot of penhold

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

The spots suggets that you play a lot of penhold

That is my BH rubber. That is all from my index finger being at many different angles. I don't play any penhold. [emoji2]

I will try and get a photo of the FH rubber. It has some wear from my thumb. But not in as many different areas.


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[BeGo]

The spots suggets that you play a lot of penhold

Or,

Most of Carl opponent did not survive post the service, rendering service grip mark as the most prominent rubber "wrinkles" [emoji14]

Sorry Carl, You are not a Chimpanzee. I don't think Your index finger long enough to leave the mark on bottom left part of Your BH rubber. I am more convinced that the aforementioned mark are from Your thumb when servicing. [emoji28]

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[BeGo]

The spots suggets that you play a lot of penhold

Or,

Most of Carl opponent did not survive post the service, rendering service grip mark as the most prominent rubber "wrinkles" [emoji14]

Sorry Carl, You are not a Chimpanzee. I don't think Your index finger long enough to leave the mark on bottom left part of Your BH rubber. [emoji28]

Sent from my i5E using Tapatalk

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Or,

Most of Carl opponent did not survive post the service, rendering service grip mark as the most prominent rubber "wrinkles" [emoji14]

Sorry Carl, You are not a Chimpanzee. I don't think Your index finger long enough to leave the mark on bottom left part of Your BH rubber. I am more convinced that the aforementioned mark are from Your thumb when servicing. [emoji28]

Yep. The hand print on the left side of the rubber is my hand from serving. Not the thumb though. My thumb is on my FH rubber when I serve. But I definitely shift my grip without thinking. Different shots need slightly different angle of blade and when you do that the grip also switches.


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[UpSideDownCarl]

Here is one of my main serve grips:

The markings on that side are from the serve grip.

The markings where my index finger is:

Can range anywhere in between these two positions depending on BH, FH, FH hook, FH topspin, FH fade etc. The hand position switches with the wrist for different shots.


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[BeGo]

Here is one of my main serve grips:

The markings on that side are from the serve grip.

The markings where my index finger is:

Can range anywhere in between these two positions depending on BH, FH, FH hook, FH topspin, FH fade etc. The hand position switches with the wrist for different shots.


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That a really small blade Carl. Look like 150 * 140,

Assuming You are 170 from Your vids with Der Echte.

OK,
I take back what I have said. [emoji28]


And this is photos of my usual grip, and I guess I am really lucky that I wont have finger mark on my rubber with my grip. [emoji28]

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[UpSideDownCarl]

I made these two videos awhile ago on the subject of switching grips.

For a long time I did not realize I switched grips. Then I started realizing that, without trying to or meaning to, as my wrist shifts position for different shots, my fingers are forced to shift as well.

The main part of how I hold the blade is with my index finger and thumb on the blade face. Not with pinky, ring and middle fingers on the handle. I can take them off and still actually loop.

Because of this grip, any shift in the angle of the wrist causes how the thumb and index finger to shift how they are holding.

When I hit fade shots my grip is totally different from when I hit loops. And I when I hit BH the amount I supinate my forearm and flex my wrist makes it so there is no way my fingers can be in the same position as when I hit a FH pronate my forearm and extend my wrist.

But that process of holding the blade face with index finger and thumb definitely helps you adjust grip and grip pressure in a way that helps your TT skillz.


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[BeGo]

Here is one of my main serve grips:

The markings on that side are from the serve grip.

The markings where my index finger is:

Can range anywhere in between these two positions depending on BH, FH, FH hook, FH topspin, FH fade etc. The hand position switches with the wrist for different shots.


Sent from The Subterranean Workshop by Telepathy

That a really small blade Carl. Look like 150 * 140,

Assuming You are 170 from Your vids with Der Echte.

OK,

I take back what I have said. [emoji28]


And this is photos of my usual grip, and I guess I am really lucky that I wont have finger mark on my rubber with my grip. [emoji28]

Sent from my i5E using Tapatalk

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Interesting BeGo. Both blades have a 150x157mm head.

But how I was showed to hold and what I settled on when I tried several different grips was that the index and middle finger hold the blade face at the base of the rubber where the writing on the rubber is.

The thing they this does is, having those fingers on the actual blade face helps you feel the ball more. And when you increase grip pressure on the thumb and index finger as they press into the rubber on the blade face, it stabilizes the blade face which allows you to transfer more spin and power into the ball.

The coach I originally got that from Jennifer Wu ( Wu Yue).


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[Der_Echte]

A coach would cringe at some of the grip adjustments I do.

All I could say simply to anyone wanting to start touch is to have a real light grip and get right to the ball off the bounce. The adjustments start from there.

Taking finger slightly off blade at impct... firming up the fingers at impact... staying loose and a quick impulse with lower arm and allow loose wrist to go through off bounce... moving blade back a bit with fingers and wrist being a shock absorber... tiny back up with increasing firmer grip a bit.... sides wipe with any of the above.

These are some of the variations. There are others I haven't learned or discovered and started this mess to learn others.

Call me mega troll if some others deservedly get FaceTime and credit... I am still gunna learn something somewhere.

All the measures to discern effective coaching I believe Next Level believes and practices them all.

Matt H and Dan would have a heap to contribute if we could engage them.

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