HELP choosing my new bat!!

Slap · Aug 1, 2018

Hi guys,
I'm a beginner-Intermediate player. I've played table tennis properly in a club in 2014 and 2015 and I wasn't a bad player but not the best looper or anything. I then stopped and now I've started again about a month ago to play seriously and I will be playing league in September. I need a new bat as I have found out my old bat doesn't suit me. Right, My current bat has an Artengo 700 blade ( One from decathlon so nothing too fast or special - Advertised it says it has a speed of 5 and control of 9) but its a cheap one. My rubbers are: DHS Hurricane 3.50 and Butterfly Tackiness Chop 2. I was using the butterfly for forehand and dhs for backhand. My back is quite strong with good technique and I can execute smashes loops, flicks 60-70% of the time when I need it and I was using the butterfly on my forehand while doing the proper ''in pai'' hip and waist rotatement until someone pointed out to me that its a defensive rubber. When I researched it came out as a high end defensive rubber with lots of control (112) and no speed what so ever (40). So, on my last session, I started using the dhs for forehand and butterfly for backhand and immediately, my backhand shots were very weak and inconsistent and my forehand was harder to control and it felt a bit weird tbh. Although, when I did forehand rallies with the coach I was really good and I could keep the ball going with the DHS and the proper wait rotation and leg movement.
I have decided to buy a new bat and the style I am developing is an offensive style with lots of looping (mainly) not too far from table and quick chops and flicks and smashes from the backhand and strong forehand (chinese style).
I have looked at wood and rubbers and decided I want a good quality 5 layer All wood with good flex and consistency and feel. And, not too expensive rubbers in case I need to change or experiment.
So I have decided on the following:
Blade: I have choses 2, both have same control and make-up but one is faster and one is slower.
- Butterfly Maze Magic All wood OFF- (Faster)
- Butterfly Andrzej Grubba ALL+ (Slower)Which one do you think I should get or if not these, any similar/better alternatives.

Forehand rubber: DHS Hurricane 3 NEO ( A slight upgrade from H3.50 as a little more spin and harder sponge)
Backhand rubber: This is where my uncertainty kicks in, I chose '' Yasaka Mark V'' as it is soft and non-tacky and is faster than my FH and has quite good spin so I can use it with ease to execute the shots that I need.

Please help me out and correct me if I am wrong. Open to all suggestions and options, not only stuck on famous brand or high price.
Thanks

yogi_bear · Aug 1, 2018

Try the Stiga Azalea Offensive or Xiom Offensive S. Both have very good feel and control.

TTEquipment.co.uk · Aug 1, 2018

Hi Slap,

You say you play in a club, so do you have a practice session over the summer and see if you can try out a few other players bats. There is nothing better than getting your hands on a few and giving them a go. Most players will gladly let you have a hit with their setups

Do you have access to a coach? They can see your style and then make recommendations on what you need before you buy. Most coaches usually have 2 or 3 setups of their own you can try too.

I've helped quite a few players in our league with new setups and the biggest thing I find is that the beginners "want" to play a style but don't realise they don't have the shots or skills yet to play that style. Once they try a few bats (I usually have 6 or 7 different setups for people to try out) then they find what they feel comfortable first and then develop their preferred style after that.

The other alternative gets expensive very quickly when you buy based on recommendations or reviews, but we have all been there too

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PiZa · Aug 1, 2018

New model of Butterfly Andrzej Grubba All+ is junk so i do not recommend this blade, unless you have possibility to buy old version.

Slap · Aug 1, 2018

seems like a good idea to ask people what rubbers they have and try them out, maybe this will point me more in the right direction as you said but lots of them are overprotective as they use butterfly stuff and all..

Slap · Aug 1, 2018

PiZa said:
New model of Butterfly Andrzej Grubba All+ is junk so i do not recommend this blade, unless you have possibility to buy old version.

Could you tell me why it is? From what it looks like it seems like a nice blade. If not, what about the Maze Magic?

Slap · Aug 1, 2018

I can't seem to find the xeom offensive s available in the uk but would the set-up I have chose be good or is the wood or rubbers a bad choice?

UpSideDownCarl · Aug 1, 2018

Have you tried either the Maze Magic or the Grubba?

What I would do if I was you, if you play in a club, start by trying people's rackets. Try lots. Anyone who will let you, try their racket for a few hits. If you are patient and do that for a few weeks, you will start to have a better idea of what kind of rubbers and what kind of blade you really....actually want.

Being honest, either of those blades should be fine. Here is a list of other blades you could look at to compare and decide:

1) Xiom Offensive S (part of why you may have had a hard time finding this blade is that you spelled Xiom incorrectly. I am not sure. But that may be the case. Yogi is right. This is an EXCELLENT choice.)

2) Yasaka Sweden Extra
3) Stiga Allround Evolution
4) Stiga Offensive Classic
5) Butterfly Primorac Off-

I don't want to give you too many. But all of those blades are as good as it gets for how you described your needs.

As far as rubbers, it really would be worth trying a few people's rackets to see if you really would like H3 for FH and what you would like for BH.

H3.50 is softer than regular H3 and may actually be a better choice. H3 is pretty hard. A mid level player can use it. But to really get what the rubber offers out of it, it actually requires HIGH LEVEL technique.

Rubbers like:

Xiom Vega Intro, Vega Pro or Vega Europe
Nexy Karis M (this may be hard to find, but well worth the search)
Tibhar Aurus or Aurus Soft

Or even something like:

Tibhar Evolution FXP

Might be good rubber choices for you.

One more question:

Any reason why you think you should have different rubbers on FH and BH?

Often people who are a little better than beginners but don't understand how to get equipment that would be right for them think they are supposed to have different rubbers on FH and BH. It doesn't help that many prebuilt rackets come with different rubbers for FH and BH like the one you seem to have. But if that prebuilt was made for someone who is a modern defender, it would make sense to have different rubbers. Whereas, for most people who WANT TO develop as offensive players, you want to START with the same rubber for FH and BH so the two wings can develop somewhat evenly. And then, you would only get specific different rubbers for each wing WHEN YOU FULLY UNDERSTAND what each wing needs that is different.

Or, if you knew your BH was a little weaker than your FH (which is pretty normal) you would get the same basic rubber with a very slightly softer sponge for BH. So everything else would be basically the same, but the slightly softer sponge on BH would help you sink into the ball better.

Last detail:

If you are developing your strokes and improving, slightly softer rubber than you may think you should use, helps you develop the touch and skill to get the ball to sink into the topsheet and sponge without hitting the wood which gives you the skill to add exponentially more spin to the ball. So rubbers that are mid-soft, like the ones I listed (rather than H3 which is brick hard) would actually help you develop your technique and improve faster. And a harder rubber would do more of the work for you but would slow your progress and make it harder to get your technique to the next level.

Slap · Aug 2, 2018

UpSideDownCarl said:
Have you tried either the Maze Magic or the Grubba?

What I would do if I was you, if you play in a club, start by trying people's rackets. Try lots. Anyone who will let you, try their racket for a few hits. If you are patient and do that for a few weeks, you will start to have a better idea of what kind of rubbers and what kind of blade you really....actually want.

Being honest, either of those blades should be fine. Here is a list of other blades you could look at to compare and decide:

1) Xiom Offensive S (part of why you may have had a hard time finding this blade is that you spelled Xiom incorrectly. I am not sure. But that may be the case. Yogi is right. This is an EXCELLENT choice.)
2) Yasaka Sweden Extra
3) Stiga Allround Evolution
4) Stiga Offensive Classic
5) Butterfly Primorac Off-

I don't want to give you too many. But all of those blades are as good as it gets for how you described your needs.

As far as rubbers, it really would be worth trying a few people's rackets to see if you really would like H3 for FH and what you would like for BH.

H3.50 is softer than regular H3 and may actually be a better choice. H3 is pretty hard. A mid level player can use it. But to really get what the rubber offers out of it, it actually requires HIGH LEVEL technique.

Rubbers like:

Xiom Vega Intro, Vega Pro or Vega Europe
Nexy Karis M (this may be hard to find, but well worth the search)
Tibhar Aurus or Aurus Soft

Or even something like:

Tibhar Evolution FXP

Might be good rubber choices for you.

One more question:

Any reason why you think you should have different rubbers on FH and BH?

Often people who are a little better than beginners but don't understand how to get equipment that would be right for them think they are supposed to have different rubbers on FH and BH. It doesn't help that many prebuilt rackets come with different rubbers for FH and BH like the one you seem to have. But if that prebuilt was made for someone who is a modern defender, it would make sense to have different rubbers. Whereas, for most people who WANT TO develop as offensive players, you want to START with the same rubber for FH and BH so the two wings can develop somewhat evenly. And then, you would only get specific different rubbers for each wing WHEN YOU FULLY UNDERSTAND what each wing needs that is different.

Or, if you knew your BH was a little weaker than your FH (which is pretty normal) you would get the same basic rubber with a very slightly softer sponge for BH. So everything else would be basically the same, but the slightly softer sponge on BH would help you sink into the ball better.

Last detail:

If you are developing your strokes and improving, slightly softer rubber than you may think you should use, helps you develop the touch and skill to get the ball to sink into the topsheet and sponge without hitting the wood which gives you the skill to add exponentially more spin to the ball. So rubbers that are mid-soft, like the ones I listed (rather than H3 which is brick hard) would actually help you develop your technique and improve faster. And a harder rubber would do more of the work for you but would slow your progress and make it harder to get your technique to the next level.

I haven't actually tried the Grubba or Maze but they seemed like good blades in the Allround power category with good speed, control and feel ( Butterfly is a very famous manufacturer, surely they're not going to be rubbish but I could be wrong).
The others blade are really good too but hard to find but it might be the case that I get the Xiom Offensive S because it has excellent speed and control and is quite famous.

For rubbers, my thought is to get a hard tacky Chinese rubber as unlike the European/Japanese, hard Chinese rubber has a more linear power production ( example: If I hit with 30% power I get 30%speed, If I hit with 60% power I get 60% speed, and so on), whereas with EU rubber (example: tenergy and others) if I hit with 30% power I get 50% so if you don't have very good technique or good strength then its better yeah but If I want 60-70% speed or more, I have to use like 100-110% power as the rubber capability levels off. Using chinese hard rubber, I thought this will allow me to play more powerful shots as I get better and allow me to improve more steadily, plus for hard chinese rubber I need to do the full hip rotation and leg movement and proper arm stroke so this will force me to do the proper technique and become a better player.

What are your thoughts on this?

Also, I want a soft, fast rubber with catapult effect (example: tenergy 05 which is too expensive and not for me at this level. But ones I am thinking of are: Yasaka Mark V or Tibhar Aurus soft in 2.1mm) because the backhand stroke is much smaller and more sudden than the forehand one( Where I can do a full swing) so my backhand flicks and smashes and chops and quick and spinny but also, when doing a forehand smash I can switch to the soft, fast backhand rubber as again it is a sudden contact.
The DHS H3 NEO and Tibhar AURUS soft seem like good rubbers and are cheap too so if I decide to change or experiment with different rubbers, it allows me to do that. Maybe with Xiom offensive S wood..

Please let me know what you think?

UpSideDownCarl · Aug 2, 2018

Often, theories like that sound good and logical. But I would have to see footage of you playing to know if they had any basis in reality.

And again, your best bet is to try lots of different things and decide what works best for you based on actually having tried them rather than on theory.

Again, if you were semi-pro and had amazing technique, you would get a lot out of H3. If not, I am not so sure. You would get used to it and it would feel normal. But it may slow your development. You need very precise and refined contact and very powerful impact to get the full benefit of H3. And it is highly unlikely that your theory of 60% effort will equal 60% speed because, to get anything out of H3, you also need to be 99-100% accurate. And that takes very high skill level.

But, in the end, you can choose what you want.

I still just think that if you are basing decisions on equipment you never tried, you are flying blind. If you get people to let you try their equipment, you will start to know what really works for you rather than it simply being theory.

Slap · Aug 2, 2018

UpSideDownCarl said:
Often, theories like that sound good and logical. But I would have to see footage of you playing to know if they had any basis in reality.

And again, your best bet is to try lots of different things and decide what works best for you based on actually having tried them rather than on theory.

Again, if you were semi-pro and had amazing technique, you would get a lot out of H3. If not, I am not so sure. You would get used to it and it would feel normal. But it may slow your development. You need very precise and refined contact and very powerful impact to get the full benefit of H3. And it is highly unlikely that your theory of 60% effort will equal 60% speed because, to get anything out of H3, you also need to be 99-100% accurate. And that takes very high skill level.

But, in the end, you can choose what you want.

I still just think that if you are basing decisions on equipment you never tried, you are flying blind. If you get people to let you try their equipment, you will start to know what really works for you rather than it simply being theory.

I agree with you, I will have to ask people to try their bats and ask what strategy they built it for and then get a feel and decide definitely, but that will happen next week but for now this is what I came up with. I am not an EJ, I simply need to build a good solid bat that'll allow me to improve and keep it for a long time until I am semi-pro and then change it later.

	Price	Quantity
×	TIBHAR AURUS SOFT TABLE TENNIS RUBBER - red, 2.1	£26.99	£26.99
×	DHS HURRICANE NEO 3 TABLE TENNIS RUBBER - 2.15, black	£20.99	£20.99
×	BRIBAR GRIP TABLE TENNIS BAT CLEANING SET	£12.99	£12.99
×	TIBHAR CLEAN COAT VARNISH 25G	£8.50	£8.50
×	TSP BIO FIX TABLE TENNIS GLUE 90ml	£13.99	£13.99

	Price	Quantity
×	TIBHAR AURUS SOFT TABLE TENNIS RUBBER - red, 2.1	£26.99	£26.99
×	DHS HURRICANE NEO 3 TABLE TENNIS RUBBER - 2.15, black	£20.99	£20.99
×	BRIBAR GRIP TABLE TENNIS BAT CLEANING SET	£12.99	£12.99
×	TIBHAR CLEAN COAT VARNISH 25G	£8.50	£8.50
×	TSP BIO FIX TABLE TENNIS GLUE 90ml	£13.99	£13.99

Items	Price	Quantity	Total	Remove
	Table Tennis Blade: Xiom Classic Offensive × 1	£33.99		£33.99	×
	Table Tennis Case: Stiga Stage Single Bat Wallet - Orange × 1	£12.99		£12.99

TTEquipment.co.uk · Aug 2, 2018

Slap, where are you based? At Wiltshire I can assure you that I could help you try between 5 and 10 setups that would be suitable and none of those would be butterfly where players would be too precious about you trying the kit.

You could always go with your theory though and just buy it and try it, then re-evaluate in 3 to 6 months what does and doesn't work for you.

P.s. check your pm's

Slap · Aug 2, 2018

TTEquipment.co.uk said:
Slap, where are you based? At Wiltshire I can assure you that I could help you try between 5 and 10 setups that would be suitable and none of those would be butterfly where players would be too precious about you trying the kit.

You could always go with your theory though and just buy it and try it, then re-evaluate in 3 to 6 months what does and doesn't work for you.

P.s. check your pm's

I'm based in Sheffield (South Yorkshire) so that's a tad too far from where you are unfortunately.

Slap · Aug 2, 2018

I have checked my pm's. Nothing new there, why?

Joe141 · Aug 3, 2018

Slap said:
Hi guys,
I'm a beginner-Intermediate player. I've played table tennis properly in a club in 2014 and 2015 and I wasn't a bad player but not the best looper or anything. I then stopped and now I've started again about a month ago to play seriously and I will be playing league in September. I need a new bat as I have found out my old bat doesn't suit me. Right, My current bat has an Artengo 700 blade ( One from decathlon so nothing too fast or special - Advertised it says it has a speed of 5 and control of 9) but its a cheap one. My rubbers are: DHS Hurricane 3.50 and Butterfly Tackiness Chop 2. I was using the butterfly for forehand and dhs for backhand. My back is quite strong with good technique and I can execute smashes loops, flicks 60-70% of the time when I need it and I was using the butterfly on my forehand while doing the proper ''in pai'' hip and waist rotatement until someone pointed out to me that its a defensive rubber. When I researched it came out as a high end defensive rubber with lots of control (112) and no speed what so ever (40). So, on my last session, I started using the dhs for forehand and butterfly for backhand and immediately, my backhand shots were very weak and inconsistent and my forehand was harder to control and it felt a bit weird tbh. Although, when I did forehand rallies with the coach I was really good and I could keep the ball going with the DHS and the proper wait rotation and leg movement.
I have decided to buy a new bat and the style I am developing is an offensive style with lots of looping (mainly) not too far from table and quick chops and flicks and smashes from the backhand and strong forehand (chinese style).
I have looked at wood and rubbers and decided I want a good quality 5 layer All wood with good flex and consistency and feel. And, not too expensive rubbers in case I need to change or experiment.
So I have decided on the following:
Blade: I have choses 2, both have same control and make-up but one is faster and one is slower.
- Butterfly Maze Magic All wood OFF- (Faster)
- Butterfly Andrzej Grubba ALL+ (Slower)Which one do you think I should get or if not these, any similar/better alternatives.

Forehand rubber: DHS Hurricane 3 NEO ( A slight upgrade from H3.50 as a little more spin and harder sponge)
Backhand rubber: This is where my uncertainty kicks in, I chose '' Yasaka Mark V'' as it is soft and non-tacky and is faster than my FH and has quite good spin so I can use it with ease to execute the shots that I need.

Please help me out and correct me if I am wrong. Open to all suggestions and options, not only stuck on famous brand or high price.
Thanks

Hi, what price bracket are you looking in as people recommend stiga infinity which is a 5 ply all wood blade that would fit your game and would pair nicely with hurrica e 3 on the forehand. However, you could try a blade with carbon nearer the inner core which wouldn't be as fast as other carbon blades. An example would be the joola Rossi emotion which also pairs well with them rubbers. The best thing is to go to bat testing days at various big clubs where companies like bribar bring a selection of rubbers and blades to try. Also speak to coaches.
Good luck

HELP choosing my new bat!!

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