German National Championships 2014

[MDanielCRO]

Yes and this is why you see the chinese players when they engage in counter top-spin rallies with players like Mizutani or Timo often borrowing the power that is produced from Timo's spinny top spin - they've found a way to deal with these short stroke top spins and can be easily exploited by swinging the arm and through the ball using a hard sponge tacky chinese rubber. It's like the tacky rubber almost grips the ball and sends it back on the table. What happens then, when Timo Boll tries to reloop that ball again usually hits the net because the brush stroke doesn't have enough forward momentum to send the ball back. And that's when he loses. In today's table tennis it's not enough to win major titles by having just one kind of top spin. Maybe it was 10 years ago when Timo Boll was 1st in the world.

I've seen Dmitrij Ovtcharov also adopting this technique of borrowing opponent's power by just relooping the ball from the top of the bounce - not like Timo Boll Who always stoops down to the ball and then lifts it again - no wonder he gets injured. Timo Boll never borrows the power he always uplifts it again. It looks like he's always trying to sneak up to the ball and brush-stroke it upwards and that is his formula for winning matches, but it doesn't always work especially when the chinese looping which is much stronger and has clearly proved a better way to loop. If I find a video I'll show you how Dmitrij Ovtcharov borrows the power from opponents top spin.

Your arguments are invalid. Chinese players have better coaches, better sparings, and they have harder training seasons than anyone. That's why they can handle the ball longer than Timo in counter loop rallies.

You are saying that timo never uses opponent's power? Okay. what about this:

3:02, he does it really often!
and what about the match against Zhang at wttc 2011.

6:01 and 6:35

 

[Filip]

Watch the two last games of this match, he does nothing else but using the power of xu xin. I think that is a strong point of him, he can really use the opponents energy, whoe else can couterloop like that so close to the table?

 

[Steven]

Quarter final results:
Ovtcharov 4-2 Süss
Filus 4-0 Steger
Franziska 4-0 Duda
Mengel 1-4 Boll

Han Ying 4-0 Barthel
Mittelham 4-2 Silbereisen
Solja 3-4 Ivancan
Scheld 0-4 Shan Xiaona

Tomorrow's semi finals:
Ovtcharov vs Filus
Franziska vs Boll

Han Ying vs Mittelham
Ivancan vs Shan Xiaona

 

[Filip]

Does anyone know where we can watch the final live? The semi finals have been played and Timo and Dima are in the finals

 

[TableTennisDaily]

Last two points between Dimitrij Ovtcharov and Timo Boll!

 

[mefisto81]

Timo won?

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[Steven]

Final day results:
Ovtcharov 4-1 Filus (-5,4,8,3,6)
Franziska 0-4 Boll (-8,-8,-5,-7)

Han Ying 4-0 Mittelham (11,6,6,8)
Ivancan 1-4 Shan Xiaona (-3,-9,8,- 4,-7)

Ovtcharov 4-1 Boll (8,4,-9,7,10)
Han Ying 2-4 Shan Xiaona (-6,-10,-10,9,15,-7)

 

[TableTennisDaily]

Congratulations Dima!

 

[TTLondon2012]

D.Ovtcharov is the 2014 German National Champion!

 

[izra]

boll's technique is not outdated or worse than any other technique. if you look at the older generation of players (80's and 90's) nobody plays quite like him. if you look at his results and the players he's beat it's obvious his technique is not "worse" than chinese, or he would never be able to beat any of them since they have better training conditions and training partners than him.

his technique is just different, because he focused on spin more than speed from a very young age and built his style around that. dima is younger and in better form than boll, that's why he can beat timo, not because of superior technique. the chinese beat boll because their training is much more intense from a younger age and they have stronger training partners, also nowadays because timo is getting older and slower.

dima is unique in his own way, with his backhand oriented game he pushes his opponents to play the way that he wants and anticipates. he can already challenge the chinese on a good day, it's just that his level is still not high enough to pull it off in important events.

congrats to dima anyway.

 

[LethalForehand]

good vs. wrong technique, I think the lack of power in those forehands make him (Timo Boll and also M Maze) focus more on spin, bc you can't do anything else than spin the ball if you hit the forehand like that. Try it yourself, how easier it is to just spin and how much more difficult it is to give power to the ball when the racket is closer to your body (elbow more bent). I think its not just coincodence that both TB and Maze have serious injuries. Its very unnatural if you try to generate power with their type of forehand.

Whether its wrong or not is a question is whterher they do it this way on purpose or just by necessity (bad habit, was too late to change). If its on purpose then its their call, including the injuries and the drawback over a chinese stroke. However, I see a strong resemblance to the speed-glue forehand technique. In the SG era you could generate power even with such a bent elbow, it mihgt be the european coaches just did not adapt to the post SG conditions, making their players work harder for power, resulting in more injuries. The chinese have much fewer serious injuries. You can say its bc they are more fit but that also part of the training of a top athlete.

 

[bzing]

Timo Boll's technique is totally wrong, he'd been winning because of his fast equipment that he always relies on. In fact he wouldn't stand a chance if he used a setup the chinese players use. Dmitrij Ovtcharov has won a decisive 4-1 and it's just a prove of how bad Timo Boll is because it's not one time but a numerous victory now over Timo with his sappy top-spin.

You don't know what I mean about borrowing ones power. He borrows opponents power but he rebrushes the ball, not necessarily engages the ball directly into the sponge because of his carbon blade and a springy rubber, moreover he never lifts the elbow, he always keeps the elbow close to the body because he thinks he can win points by sneaking up to the ball and looping those short spinny topspins that worked in the speed-glue era but unfortunetaly it doesn't anymore now and he has faced the consequence of being impervious to developing a more comprehensive topspin and instead just sticking to his short chicken wing stroke.

Those that do not agree probably use the typical carbon blade + tenergy 05 FH, tenergy 05 BH or some other springy rubbers themselves, how boring.

 

[MDanielCRO]

Timo Boll's technique is totally wrong, he'd been winning because of his fast equipment that he always relies on. In fact he wouldn't stand a chance if he used a setup the chinese players use. Dmitrij Ovtcharov has won a decisive 4-1 and it's just a prove of how bad Timo Boll is because it's not one time but a numerous victory now over Timo with his sappy top-spin.

You don't know what I mean about borrowing ones power. He borrows opponents power by rebrushing the ball but not necessarily engages the ball directly into the sponge because of his carbon blade and a springy rubbers, moreover he never lifts the elbow, he always keeps the elbow close to the body because he thinks he can win points by sneaking up to the ball and looping those short spinny topspins that worked in the speed-glue era but unfortunetaly it doesn't anymore now and he has faced the consequence of being impervious to developing a more comprehensive topspin and instead just sticking to his short chicken wing stroke.

Those that do not agree probably use carbon blade ALC + tenergy 05 FH, tenergy 05 BH themselves, lol how lame.

Equipment doesn't matter. Chinese players also nowdays couldn't do anything if they would use his blade. How can you say that he is winning because of equipment? I will get you his own blade and you can play 10 years with it, and you will never be 1/10 of what Timo Boll is.
Like people said before he is not in the best shape right now, but I have to say again his technique is unique, and it different, it's not wrong.
If he had technique like Dima, he would never do what he did this way, because Dima is much more explosive than him.
Please stop shitting around about former NO1 player in the world and go train yourself to become better.
that's all from me. Good luck everyone

 

[bzing]

It's not unique because many other players like Michael Maze have a very similar technique and especially forehand almost identical. No wonder it results in major injuries because they do it wrong. And I'm not shitting like you said but stating the true facts what has become.

Of course the chinese couldn't do anything if they used his blade, because most of the balls would shoot in the air but if they wanted to they would get used to it like Timo Boll but they don't want to because that would mean they would have to lose the need to use the body's plentiful energy and depend on the power of the blade because Timo Boll either doesn't know how to use the rest of his viable body parts to exert more power like more and more players now are discovering like Ovtcharov or he thinks he can get away with it but it has been proved now due to his failures of recent years that he can't.

I don't even want to use his equipment and never will - I would never even would want to try to prove I can play better if you gave me his equipment - I don't need to. I prefer to pursuit a better technique that players exhibit like Chinese and Ovtcharov even though I might not be as successful, I will have a better technique that will not result me in injuries.

 

[Filip]

what a load of crap from you Bzing. 'That shows how bad Timo Boll is', how dare you to disrespect such a good and humble table tennis player? You're a disgrace for our sport

 

[bzing]

what a load of crap from you Bzing. 'That shows how bad Timo Boll is', how dare you to disrespect such a good and humble table tennis player? You're a disgrace for our sport

If you can't stand a criticism just because he's your favourite player then better don't post at all. It's not meant to be taken out of context like you did. I did mention that Timo Boll has a great footwork and eye-sharp like precision, but even few others also agreed that his forehand doesn't win as much as it should have and leaves a lot more to be desired.

 

[johndol]

If you can't stand a criticism just because he's your favourite player then better don't post at all. It's not meant to be taken out of context like you did. I did mention that Timo Boll has a great footwork and eye-sharp like precision, but even few others also agreed that his forehand doesn't win as much as it should have and leaves a lot more to be desired.

Mate no disrespect to you, but the way you phrase the statement leaves many criticism from others. How can you say Boll's technique is obsolete and wrong when he used to be a world no 1, and still have the capability to beat chinese player when others failed to do so? I can agree with you when you say his technique may have caused his injuries, but his technique is wrong? There are hundreds way to play table tennis and anyone can choose which technique suits them best, but there is no wrong or right technique in table tennis.

Back to the topic, anyone has a video for the men's single final?

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[luqketti]

Of course the chinese couldn't do anything if they used his blade, because most of the balls would shoot in the air but if they wanted to they would get used to it like Timo Boll but they don't want to because that would mean they would have to lose the need to use the body's plentiful energy and depend on the power of the blade because Timo Boll either doesn't know how to use the rest of his viable body parts to exert more power like more and more players now are discovering like Ovtcharov or he thinks he can get away with it but it has been proved now due to his failures of recent years that he can't.

his equipment? Do you mean a timo boll alc wich is very VERY similar to a viscaria butterfly blade, wich is the most used among chinese players atm? like of the top 12 chinese players about 7 or 8 of them use viscarias.

The only diference in equipment is the DHS hurricane neo 3 the chinese use in their forehand, wich they grew up using, and they are more used to. Definitly behavies a bit diferent from tenergy but not so much that a chinese player couldnt play with any european pro equipment if they wanted to, and still be as awesome as they are.

I think the diference its 95% on the technique, and physical superiority of chinese players. Any chinese player if u take a good look, is full of muscles, from toe to head, not big muscles of course but if timo boll were to stand shirtless next to ma long or zhang jike, anyone would notice who is hitting the gym a lot and who looks like any other regular person.

Like in football 25 years ago or more, players rellied on technique alone, and now any normal player of any european league needs to have a VERY developed physical fitness beyond what a normal person looks like. The chinese apply this to all his main team players, thats why zhang jike looks like freaking bruce lee when ripping his shirt off lol

Europeans need to step up in that aspect of the game, copy the best aspects of chinese training and physical fitness training, and add their own ideas to that.

 

[Rajah*]

A very interesting debate here indeed..
And a very intellectual post from bzing.. with your sharp analysis on this matter..could you get yourself up to the worlds top5 slots? If not then shovee it up you ass and stop this nonsense, as of now BOLL has proven he is capable of winning over chinese..

"those that do not agree probably use the typical carbon blade + tenergy 05 fh, tenergy 05 bh or some other springy rubbers themselves, how boring." - bzing

Be careful with your mouth, equipment is players preference not yours.. :-D

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[SquareBall]

I wanted poll for women tournament also.