Rubber for Ma Lin Ghost Serve

[Tony's Table Tennis]

I think the answer here is 'boosting'

...Rajd...

Bad advice!!

You don't need to boost DHS (hard sponge rubbers) to generate ghost serve.
It is the skill, not the equipment

In fact, when you boost DHS rubber, it is more difficult to generate ghost serve due to the more springy sponge

 

[chiz]

The harder the easier to to ghost serve - meaning you have full control of when the ball leaves the sponge

I don't understand, it seems to me that the harder the sponge the less dwell time I get.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

I don't understand, it seems to me that the harder the sponge the less dwell time I get.

I am guessing your problem is with your angle + contact point.

No matter if you use hard or soft sponge, or how much dwell, if the above is not correct, you will have the "same" issue.

 

[chiz]

I tried doing it this way

before just to see if I can get the ball to come back to the table but no luck. The way it is done in the video is pretty simple and I think I'm doing it the same way, maybe I'm messing up at contact point. I always thought that the more dwell time I have the more spin I'll be able to put and softer sponge = more dwell time.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

I think then you are "pushing" the ball forward, so the acceleration force is way too much.

You should brush the ball and allow the ball to move out of the rubber naturally.
So this is why I say, rather get the ball to scoup into the air and bounce high over the net first

In other words, focus on scouping the ball and not just underspin the ball forward. SO NB!! no forward force

 

[chiz]

I think then you are "pushing" the ball forward, so the acceleration force is way too much.

You should brush the ball and allow the ball to move out of the rubber naturally.
So this is why I say, rather get the ball to scoup into the air and bounce high over the net first

In other words, focus on scouping the ball and not just underspin the ball forward. SO NB!! no forward force

What the heck is scouping?

 

[Thewimo]

Only my opinion to make this serve easier regarding this video:

- Not with a straight arm, instead lose it up a bit

- Hold the bat different: I do it with thumbs and index finger only, when doing services
(More Acceleration for Spin)

 

[chiz]

Only my opinion to make this serve easier regarding this video:

- Not with a straight arm, instead lose it up a bit

- Hold the bat different: I do it with thumbs and index finger only, when doing services
(More Acceleration for Spin)

I know I usually position myself differently when serving, I just wanted to replicate the serve exactly as it is done. I'll try it out next time I go playing.

 

[Thewimo]

Yeah tell us your progress then, it's best to just "try experimenting" when making serves (Xu Xin also said that...Always experiment)

 

[Rajah*]

Bad advice!!

You don't need to boost DHS (hard sponge rubbers) to generate ghost serve.
It is the skill, not the equipment

In fact, when you boost DHS rubber, it is more difficult to generate ghost serve due to the more springy sponge

This is the key..
so keep on boosting! Hehe

 

[Rajah*]

What the heck is scouping?

Scooping manner of brushing is like taking an icecream from its container (spooning) by hitting the opposite face of the ball facing your opponent, not the part underspin facing you, that way you wont be pushing your ball forward.. focus more on brushing not pushing the ball

 

[cakezxc280]

Idk....personally I find the H3 too grippy, it tends to "eat" part of the spin.....
The easiest rubber i've tried thus far was the 05.....it spits the ball out nice and easy so no much of the "scooping" action was needed, all you need was to hold your blade fh facing towards you and serve the ball with an upward motion, and boom, even half long serves will turn around at the end of the table.

 

[Der_Echte]

I always tell my students to try and serve and scoop the ball so it bounces over the net as high as possible. This way, it is easier to get spin for ghost serve.
Once they get the "feeling", they can start aiming for proper net height service

I agree. The most important part of developing a short underspin serve is developing the feel for the impact and the timing of it without worrying over how to make the serve tight. Many players get too "Tight" trying to make a perfect tight serve when they haven't mastered how to impact the ball. At that stage, height control is not a focus. Effective impact first, then the height control can be worked on. Trying to do both will lead to an Epic Fail in almost everyone for too long before they figure it out, if they do.

Once a player can 100% make it short, but high as a kite, then they can worry about how to make the serve low and how to control the exact depth of the short serve.

I often advise players who are waiting for a table to take advantage of the time spent normally sitting by practicing the impact.

HOW can someone practice impact when all tables are filled up?

One can go to an open area off to the side, standing up, toss the ball up like a serve, and practice chopping UNDER the ball 6 O'clock or even a little to the front of 6. Make the ball go out a meter or two and spin back. Yes, there is the arm and wrist snap to adjust to the timing, but it can be sorted out.

First practice using mostly arm, and as timing gets better, more wrist. SHORT stroke is what I advise, but some can time it well with a longer stroke. Shorter is easier, and just as deceptive when you learn how to swing the arm in semi circle like pendulum and impact the ball on a different part of the semi-circle.

You can even do this practice sitting down or at home on a wood or tile floor.

 

[Der_Echte]

chiz, if you try doing a short serve and it is going long without even landing twice on the table, then your bat angle at impact is NOT totally horizontal to the table at impact. Could also be poor bat speed at impact with too much solid contact. A lot of us THINK we impact the ball on the bottom, but we don't. When we backswing, we naturally tilt the bat open. That is OK as long as you correct the angle by the time of impact.

If you are able to make a double bounce on the other side, but only with weak spin, then there could be several things going on.

1) Your bat speed at impact is too slow. Without enough bat speed at impact, you wont get much spin. You can make a very fast bat speed with a very short stroke. It is all about being loose and accelerating the bat with good timing control and feel.

2) Your swing plane may not be horizontal. Many players try to swing downwards some at impact, this takes away from the ball going forward, so players try to graze it even more and make a weak contact

3) You were DEATH gripping the bat. When a player is tight, he cannot accelerate the bat worth a crap.

If you get heavy underspin, but the ball still bounces 2-4 times and goes off the table, then there was just a tiny too much solid impact. Graze it a little more and be UNDER the ball a little more. It doesn't take much of a deviation from an effective bat angle to make the serve go longer than you want.

The looser you grip the bat, the easier time you will have.

When you practice, the IMPACT is the most important thing. The bat speed, the timing, the place on the ball where you impact (bottom or even a little to the front), how you accelerate the bat... these are a the MOST important at first. After you get the feel for this impact, there is only a tiny correction to control the height and depth with your bat angle and where you are trying to make the first bounce. You do not need to land it right next to the net, just a little past halfway is enough for a good short serve. Around 2/3 the way to the net and a little higher bounce than normal for a ghost serve.

In a real match, a ghost serve to a decent opponent is asking for that serve to get flip killed. It is simply too high.

yet, it IS important to learn how to do this serve because...

1) it looks really cool and makes you feel good

2) it helps you master the kind of impact you need for short serves, which are essential as your level improves.

 

[Der_Echte]

Bad advice!!

You don't need to boost DHS (hard sponge rubbers) to generate ghost serve.
It is the skill, not the equipment

In fact, when you boost DHS rubber, it is more difficult to generate ghost serve due to the more springy sponge

Taken literally, I would agree with you Tony. Regular, tuned, a little worn... whatever, as long as the rubber hasn't become slick like anti, one can do the serve with the right adjustments for the rubber.

Given Rajah's spirited opposition to Boosting, it would appear he is making a little humor... my kind of humor.

Then again, maybe you were using the same kind of humor in your post and both of you already understand it.

 

[chiz]

chiz, if you try doing a short serve and it is going long without even landing twice on the table, then your bat angle at impact is NOT totally horizontal to the table at impact. Could also be poor bat speed at impact with too much solid contact. A lot of us THINK we impact the ball on the bottom, but we don't. When we backswing, we naturally tilt the bat open. That is OK as long as you correct the angle by the time of impact.

If you are able to make a double bounce on the other side, but only with weak spin, then there could be several things going on.

1) Your bat speed at impact is too slow. Without enough bat speed at impact, you wont get much spin. You can make a very fast bat speed with a very short stroke. It is all about being loose and accelerating the bat with good timing control and feel.

2) Your swing plane may not be horizontal. Many players try to swing downwards some at impact, this takes away from the ball going forward, so players try to graze it even more and make a weak contact

3) You were DEATH gripping the bat. When a player is tight, he cannot accelerate the bat worth a crap.

If you get heavy underspin, but the ball still bounces 2-4 times and goes off the table, then there was just a tiny too much solid impact. Graze it a little more and be UNDER the ball a little more. It doesn't take much of a deviation from an effective bat angle to make the serve go longer than you want.

The looser you grip the bat, the easier time you will have.

When you practice, the IMPACT is the most important thing. The bat speed, the timing, the place on the ball where you impact (bottom or even a little to the front), how you accelerate the bat... these are a the MOST important at first. After you get the feel for this impact, there is only a tiny correction to control the height and depth with your bat angle and where you are trying to make the first bounce. You do not need to land it right next to the net, just a little past halfway is enough for a good short serve. Around 2/3 the way to the net and a little higher bounce than normal for a ghost serve.

In a real match, a ghost serve to a decent opponent is asking for that serve to get flip killed. It is simply too high.

yet, it IS important to learn how to do this serve because...

1) it looks really cool and makes you feel good

2) it helps you master the kind of impact you need for short serves, which are essential as your level improves.

I'm trying to put my bat at four oclock and I think I swing as fast as in this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YYAs5N5fsU#t=20 but still no good.

 

[mahomedy13]

I'm trying to put my bat at four oclock and I think I swing as fast as in this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YYAs5N5fsU#t=20 but still no good.

4 oclock is not the right position.
Try 6 oclock towards 7 or 8 oclock.

 

[chiz]

4 oclock is not the right position.
Try 6 oclock towards 7 or 8 oclock.

I know 4 oclock is not right, but I'm trying to give it more upward and less forward momentum. Just to get the ball to come back to me.

 

[mahomedy13]

what do you consider as 4 oclock? The side towards the net or facing you?

 

[chiz]

what do you consider as 4 oclock? The side towards the net or facing you?

the side facing the net