My old practice session videos. Feedback appreciated.

[Siva Schopenhauer]

Yeah, those shots, maybe they work in matches for you, but the technique, it is not so good. I am not going to judge that. There are a lot of things people do in matches to win points that don't represent good technique. But if you want to see good technique just refer to the Samson Dubina video or the Petr Korbel video.

But, I see that you actually just don't get it. Based on the information given about what good technique is, if you are asking whether those two shots represent good technique, then just go play and have fun. None of this really matters. Those shots will work against players of a certain level. And if they work for you, go for it.

BTW: Petr Korbel is a legend. Go look at Butterfly rackets and ask yourself why there is a Petr Korbel racket even though his prime was about 20 years ago.

It makes foolish but I just learned that I shouldnt focus on styles anymore. i will focus on developing my FH and BH based on my anatomy and strengths. I am going to put some time into working on those strokes. I am technique oriented guy and that is my way of experiencing fun. Winning points are fleeting but working on craft is on long run rewarding process. Now that a lot of useful suggestions have been provided and action is the only part missing. It would definitely benefit me to push a little bit harder on that part.

I will update with some training videos on this thread in the near future

 

[Siva Schopenhauer]

Why don't you get the same rubber for BH as what you plan to get for FH? But any decent Chinese rubber would fit the bill. Or, what about Air Illumina Alpha or Delta. Yinhe Big Dipper, Dawei Inspirit, 2008XP, one of the Gambler rubbers. So many. Choose something you are familiar with and already know you like.

Thanks for the suggestions mate When I look at each one's profile, they seem to have two different rubbers on use. So, naturally I had the opinion of finding a new rubber for my BH. Can I have one rubber as tacky and other one as soft. How does that work?

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Baal made a thread about this. Look for it. Or, better yet, here, have a read:

http://www.tabletennisdaily.co.uk/f...me-rubber-on-both-sides-for-offensive-players

There is no reason not to use the same rubber on both sides if the same rubber works for you. If you knew about the rubbers and what your BH needed and knew the FH and BH needed different things than we could talk. But if you don't really know, you may be better off with just the same thing on both sides.

Any rubber you can use on FH you can also use on BH. When you know why you want something specific for BH and something different for FH than you might be more helped by what you are asking about.

 

[Siva Schopenhauer]

Baal made a thread about this. Look for it. Or, better yet, here, have a read:

http://www.tabletennisdaily.co.uk/f...me-rubber-on-both-sides-for-offensive-players

There is no reason not to use the same rubber on both sides if the same rubber works for you. If you knew about the rubbers and what your BH needed and knew the FH and BH needed different things than we could talk. But if you don't really know, you may be better off with just the same thing on both sides.

Any rubber you can use on FH you can also use on BH. When you know why you want something specific for BH and something different for FH than you might be more helped by what you are asking about.

I lack wisdom for such coversation. But future seems bright for such conversations Thanks for the response

 

[Archosaurus]

Siva, I tried to take pictures to explain but I don't think I can.

So here's a chart of where I am saying the weight should be when in the stance vs where it should not be. Of course, due to your own leg anatomy and shoes (I'm a bit flat footed and use quite flat soles shoes) it's gonna be different and this is just based on my feeling on where I think it goes.

But generally, have the weight more "forward" and "inward" towards the middle of your body rather than backwards and away from the center. Maybe Carl could elaborate on why this is/how it should exactly be done. I feel my own stance is not exactly perfect but I see a tendency in many lower level players to stand in a very anchored to the ground way, or if they're not anchored, they might risk rolling over their ankle like I did.

 

[Der_Echte]

[email protected][/email]]Sure Der_echte. My first question is I am recording my videos on Mobile. But, I looked at amazon for a Tripod and could only find the ones in the height of 4 cm for mobile phones. Do you have some experience with recording videos on phone within the hall?

I think recording is a big problem for me to sort out. I would like to record a lot of my play in the coming weeks within this thread. It would also help me to know how my game stands in reality. I too feel for the fact that game understanding is little different from training. But, improving strokes would definitely benefit the game quality in overalls sense

If you have difficulty finding an adapter to fit on a standard tripod, you could always CARVE one out of a piece of wood. I have seen several people make and use them in my region.

You could always buy something designed to hold a phone on a tripod that has the standard screw on the bottom... Here is one from amazon.de for 15,55 Teuros before shipping.

https://www.amazon.de/Arkon-MG21420-Stativ-Adapter-Telefon-Halter-Samsung/dp/B00I58NYQQ/

You could get a real cheepo tripod 22,50 Teuros more...

https://www.amazon.de/AmazonBasics-Leichtes-Stativ-inkl-Tasche/dp/B005KP473Q/

The adapter screws on the tripod, then you stick your phone in the mount -BINGO !! You are ready to shoot videos on your phone in under one minute setup time... all for under 40 Teuros.

EDIT: Last summer, I was in a Korean club in LA, and the lady coach there had an adapter on a tripod for her full sized iPad and shot vids of the training, then went over them with the girl right there. Lots of good stuff you can do... big advantage is you are already carry phone, so little additional gear needed.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Siva, I tried to take pictures to explain but I don't think I can.

So here's a chart of where I am saying the weight should be when in the stance vs where it should not be. Of course, due to your own leg anatomy and shoes (I'm a bit flat footed and use quite flat soles shoes) it's gonna be different and this is just based on my feeling on where I think it goes.

But generally, have the weight more "forward" and "inward" towards the middle of your body rather than backwards and away from the center. Maybe Carl could elaborate on why this is/how it should exactly be done. I feel my own stance is not exactly perfect but I see a tendency in many lower level players to stand in a very anchored to the ground way, or if they're not anchored, they might risk rolling over their ankle like I did.

View attachment 10293

Best not to give advice on what you don't know. You really can be dangerous all the while thinking your are being helpful.

If the weight is forward on the balls of the feet, what you are talking about about having the feet planted and the heels on the ground can't happen. If you have your weight forward and you are taking a stroke, where the weight is will move as you are taking a stroke.

So, as a right handed player takes a backswing the weight might usefully be on the outside of the right front of the foot and the inside of the the left front of the foot. During the swing the weight will shift through the center on contact and end up on the inside front of the right foot and the outside front of the left foot.

YOU SHOULD NOT have to think about any of this. If you have your weight forward enough to pull your heels off the ground and take a stroke like that, where the weight is in the front of the foot will take care of itself as you do the movement. You should not have to think about your feet.

And, Archo, if you watch the video of Petr Korbel and watch the parts where they show his feet, you probably would not have been posting silly comments that cause trouble. It would be bad for your knees to try and keep your feet planted and immobile: like being only on the insides of your feet during a rotational movement like a TT stroke would ultimately damage the medial collateral ligaments and the medial menisci of your knee joint.

 

[Archosaurus]

Best not to give advice on what you don't know. You really can be dangerous all the while thinking your are being helpful.

If the weight is forward on the balls of the feet, what you are talking about about having the feet planted and the heels on the ground can't happen. If you have your weight forward and you are taking a stroke, where the weight is will move as you are taking a stroke.

So, as a right handed player takes a backswing the weight might usefully be on the outside of the right front of the foot and the inside of the the left front of the foot. During the swing the weight will shift through the center on contact and end up on the inside front of the right foot and the outside front of the left foot.

YOU SHOULD NOT have to think about any of this. If you have your weight forward enough to pull your heels off the ground and take a stroke like that, where the weight is in the front of the foot will take care of itself as you do the movement. You should not have to think about your feet.

And, Archo, if you watch the video of Petr Korbel and watch the parts where they show his feet, you probably would not have been posting silly comments that cause trouble. It would be bad for your knees to try and keep your feet planted and immobile: like being only on the insides of your feet during a rotational movement like a TT stroke would ultimately damage the medial collateral ligaments and the medial menisci of your knee joint.

Yeah, I figured as much. That is why I said "during the stance" because it's a bit black and white to say for example "Never put your weight on the heels" when I'm sure there are times when it's ideal for technique and safety.

Now, my point was really about footwork. If you step on the outside of your foot, there's a pretty big chance of straight out rolling over your ankle, and in my experience it doesn't just take care of itself: you might not even notice you're doing it if you don't know what the right stance feels like.

Is this why coaches say to hop a bit during a rally? To automatically take care of problems like this?

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Yeah, I figured as much. That is why I said "during the stance" because it's a bit black and white to say for example "Never put your weight on the heels" when I'm sure there are times when it's ideal for technique and safety.

Now, my point was really about footwork. If you step on the outside of your foot, there's a pretty big chance of straight out rolling over your ankle, and in my experience it doesn't just take care of itself: you might not even notice you're doing it if you don't know what the right stance feels like.

Is this why coaches say to hop a bit during a rally? To automatically take care of problems like this?

It is much less likely for this to happen if your weight is in the balls of your feet. Much more likely for this to happen if your weight is in your heels.

In stroke and footwork, your heel may touch down. But it is not ideal to have your weight all the way into your heels, and I can't think of a scenario that would cause that to be ideal.

If you watch the feet in the Korbel video that starts at 1:58, his heel does touch down a few times. But the weight never goes all the way into his heels.

What is probably happening for you when you move laterally is that your heel lands as you are moving and the outside of your outside foot, the heel touches down and then you role your ankle. What I would say to you about that is that you probably should practice ladder footwork drills and lateral sprints which will help give your feet develop more coordination. That will help make that problem happen less frequently. But, while you are doing those foot coordination footwork drills, you still should not be thinking about what part of the foot you are bearing weigh on. THAT WILL TAKE CARE OF ITSELF. Your feet just need extra coordination training. Trying to do it with your mind will only make matters worth. Do the drills.

 

[Archosaurus]

It is much less likely for this to happen if your weight is in the balls of your feet. Much more likely for this to happen if your weight is in your heels.

In stroke and footwork, your heel may touch down. But it is not ideal to have your weight all the way into your heels, and I can't think of a scenario that would cause that to be ideal.

If you watch the feet in the Korbel video that starts at 1:58, his heel does touch down a few times. But the weight never goes all the way into his heels.

What is probably happening for you when you move laterally is that your heel lands as you are moving and the outside of your outside foot, the heel touches down and then you role your ankle. What I would say to you about that is that you probably should practice ladder footwork drills and lateral sprints which will help give your feet develop more coordination. That will help make that problem happen less frequently. But, while you are doing those foot coordination footwork drills, you still should not be thinking about what part of the foot you are bearing weigh on. THAT WILL TAKE CARE OF ITSELF. Your feet just need extra coordination training. Trying to do it with your mind will only make matters worth. Do the drills.

Oh, I don't have the problem anymore myself. I was DEFINITELY nearly all the way on the heels and your explanation makes sense. Pretty much went away when I forced myself to stay on the soles and made it habit.

Of course, an added benefit is that it's a lot easier to move to balls. Like night and day. It will first stress the legs more if your legs aren't conditioned for lateral movement like this, but for me it was a matter of a few weeks of adjusting and now I can't go back.

So, good to know that you don't even need to think about what the feet are doing if you're in the right stance.

 

[NextLevel]

Oh, I don't have the problem anymore myself. I was DEFINITELY nearly all the way on the heels and your explanation makes sense. Pretty much went away when I forced myself to stay on the soles and made it habit.

Of course, an added benefit is that it's a lot easier to move to balls. Like night and day. It will first stress the legs more if your legs aren't conditioned for lateral movement like this, but for me it was a matter of a few weeks of adjusting and now I can't go back.

So, good to know that you don't even need to think about what the feet are doing if you're in the right stance.

Lots of problems you don't have any more. Good for you...

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Oh, I don't have the problem anymore myself. I was DEFINITELY nearly all the way on the heels and your explanation makes sense. Pretty much went away when I forced myself to stay on the soles and made it habit.

Of course, an added benefit is that it's a lot easier to move to balls. Like night and day. It will first stress the legs more if your legs aren't conditioned for lateral movement like this, but for me it was a matter of a few weeks of adjusting and now I can't go back.

So, good to know that you don't even need to think about what the feet are doing if you're in the right stance.

Somehow, I am not sure what you say sounds like it rings true. But...Okay....I'll ignore it and let it pass. Now, no more hijacking the thread.

 

[NextLevel]

Above is me practicing my favorite forehand loop. It is relaxed without hook (my real or match forehand has a lot of hook to it partly because I hold the racket and contact the ball a little differently). In this drill, I am taking the ball relatively late for a couple of reasons. The truth is that if you get a weak ball to take early, then your opponent should not be blocking it close to the table. In any case, I don't necessarily loop with that kind of power but I often do loop with that kind of placement and it ruins the drill for my partner who is not going to move (he was actually a higher rated player than I am when he was active but had an accident that lead to some paralysis). Another reason is that it is a motion to allow me to relax and build up to more aggressive motions. IF you start slow and let your muscles get into proper conditioning, just about everything becomes easier. Finally, the loop that spins up the below the net height ball with quality is what most people without footwork need the most practice doing depending on their athletic level and playing distance. Unfortunately, most people like to display themselves driving high balls (And no, I do not agree with David who said that loops mask a lot of errors). Take a step back or try to get the blocker to make the ball lower if this is consistently what you are practicing against as you need the challenge and variation. You will see that against low tricky balls, loops that come across the body just do not work. Whether you are looking at Ma Long or Zhang Jike or Timo Boll or Ding Ning or even your local pro, they all have a loop that is adapted to picking up these kinds of balls and it is usually their base loop. Don't fall into the trap of looking at or copying their loops that are not able to pick up tricky balls as those are not the loops that give them the confidence to play the way they do. IT is when you can loop any ball that your footwork and confidence develops the technique to loop more aggressively as you can do more when you get to the ball early but know you can still play with quality when the ball is tricky. IT's really about racket acceleration and being able to create the friction to catch and arc the ball with spin.

 

[Archosaurus]

NL, the bare beginner basics are things you can develop pretty fast. I might not have great footwork but I'm not attempting to roll over my ankle anymore.

What kind of loop would that shot be an example of then?

The difference is just height of the return you're looping, or what? The adaptability?

 

[Siva Schopenhauer]

If you have difficulty finding an adapter to fit on a standard tripod, you could always CARVE one out of a piece of wood. I have seen several people make and use them in my region.

You could always buy something designed to hold a phone on a tripod that has the standard screw on the bottom... Here is one from amazon.de for 15,55 Teuros before shipping.

https://www.amazon.de/Arkon-MG21420-Stativ-Adapter-Telefon-Halter-Samsung/dp/B00I58NYQQ/

You could get a real cheepo tripod 22,50 Teuros more...

https://www.amazon.de/AmazonBasics-Leichtes-Stativ-inkl-Tasche/dp/B005KP473Q/

The adapter screws on the tripod, then you stick your phone in the mount -BINGO !! You are ready to shoot videos on your phone in under one minute setup time... all for under 40 Teuros.

EDIT: Last summer, I was in a Korean club in LA, and the lady coach there had an adapter on a tripod for her full sized iPad and shot vids of the training, then went over them with the girl right there. Lots of good stuff you can do... big advantage is you are already carry phone, so little additional gear needed.

Yes mate. Thanks for the link to amazon. Probably in short time, I will be buying a tripod like you suggested. Yesteday, I somehow got to record the video by placing a chair above a short sofa and stacking some boxing gloves in Zig Zag fashion as a tripod. In India, we call this Jugaad.

So, that was a tripod for yesterday. The next time the resources could change depending upon creativity level and opportunity podential. Let' see. But, tripod would be the solution for future without a doubt

 

[Siva Schopenhauer]

Hi guys, Got new rubber after an eternity. Friednship Super FX on both sides, The shopkeeper advised the same rubbers for BH likewise by Carl. I played little late an hour after replacement, so the rubbers were still moist. Today, I could feel the hardness in the rubbers. That makes me an happy man.

Overall felt disappointed cos the rubbers don't have the spin ratio like my old Gewo nano on Forehand. Speed to spin ration is actually better which was quite opposite to my old rubbers. The beloved tackiness was damn miserable, there was no hook in the loops that made my life difficutlt.

But, I am trying to get used to the cheap ones. Probably, it was a bad choice to downgrade the setup. But, it is the way it is. I recorded some doubles match play and I ll upload it in a quite while. It could give an understanding on some miscallaneous skills

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

But, I am trying to get used to the cheap ones. Probably, it was a bad choice to downgrade the setup. But, it is the way it is. I recorded some doubles match play and I ll upload it in a quite while. It could give an understanding on some miscallaneous skills

Any time you change rubbers to something that different from the old ones, there is a break in period where you are getting used to them and can't do things you did with the old rubbers. You will get used to them. But going from springy Euro rubbers to hard, non-bouncy tacky rubbers is a hard adjustment and for some players it takes a few weeks to get used to. The contact you make with Chinese rubbers should be different than with Euro rubbers. You need to brush more with tacky. Then you get the speed from them. Take your time to get used to them.

 

[Boogar]

I would not say that Friendship are a downgrade.
Those are very good rubbers and perfect for learning, althought one could argue that they are a tad too hard. However i like hard rubbers as they require you to do correct strokes.

 

[Siva Schopenhauer]

Any time you change rubbers to something that different from the old ones, there is a break in period where you are getting used to them and can't do things you did with the old rubbers. You will get used to them. But going from springy Euro rubbers to hard, non-bouncy tacky rubbers is a hard adjustment and for some players it takes a few weeks to get used to. The contact you make with Chinese rubbers should be different than with Euro rubbers. You need to brush more with tacky. Then you get the speed from them. Take your time to get used to them.

Yes Carl, it felt liike I just picked up the game. My strokes didn't work. I felt like exerting more force to get to the usual strokes.

 

[NextLevel]

Yes Carl, it felt liike I just picked up the game. My strokes didn't work. I felt like exerting more force to get to the usual strokes.

While tacky rubbers are not good rubbers, IMO, at least, they reveal the limitations of your looping game more seriously than European rubbers do. So this will be fun to see.