What style of player or rating group below your level give you the most trouble?

[NextLevel]

I hate players that are lucky so that the ball is always hitting the net and still landing or hitting the edge. Some are stupid lucky where you make a good shot deep to their BH and hit the ball back without looking or with the need to really twist their wrist and the ball still hits the net and rolls over or hits the edge.

There are some players I fear more for their consistent luck than their skill.

Don't give me this "it all evens out in the end" BS. It doesn't. That is like everyone flipping a coin 100 times and everyone getting 50 heads and 50 tails. It doesn't happen. Balls that hit the net and edges should be lets.

Usually, it means you are playing a flatter style (which compels your opponent to sometimes play a flatter style) or your opponent is playing a flatter style. Those styles usually involve more risk so you have to play with more spin to reduce the opponent's luck.

 

[tropical]

I hate players that are lucky so that the ball is always hitting the net and still landing or hitting the edge. Some are stupid lucky where you make a good shot deep to their BH and hit the ball back without looking or with the need to really twist their wrist and the ball still hits the net and rolls over or hits the edge.

There are some players I fear more for their consistent luck than their skill.

Don't give me this "it all evens out in the end" BS. It doesn't. That is like everyone flipping a coin 100 times and everyone getting 50 heads and 50 tails. It doesn't happen. Balls that hit the net and edges should be lets.

The net/edge balls are all part of the game and they may decide the outcome of a match but they are just part of the game. If you lose to these "lucky" players then you must improve your game more to avoid the couple "lucky" points cost you the game. As the 11 pt game is too short this kind of luck is more common.

And I find out people who punch the ball are less "lucky" compared to LP players and loopers. Why? I thought about this since I play LP and found out the dead ball is easier to "climb" the net if the ball brushes it, and a looped ball with spin can "climb" it if the ball is a bit lower than the net.

So depends on the style too that these balls are more than normal to certain players. But don't blame them just "lucky" as I think it is so lame!

 

[Lermanator]

for me its dead rubber players and sidespin/tennis-style players

 

[langel]

I hate players that are lucky so that the ball is always hitting the net and still landing or hitting the edge.

Yes, I feel very happy when the ball kiss my thumb, dance all trhough the sheet to collect all of the available spin, brush the net all through the left to the right, swinging between both sides of the table, and finally knocking exactly on the edge. It's spectacular and I love it, no metter who makes it - me or the opponent.

 

[brokenball]

The net/edge balls are all part of the game and they may decide the outcome of a match but they are just part of the game. If you lose to these "lucky" players then you must improve your game more to avoid the couple "lucky" points cost you the game. As the 11 pt game is too short this kind of luck is more common.

Do you know how much a lucky balls is worth in ratings points?

I agree with your evaluation of relative luck by style but I usually come out on the wrong side of it. I have a very good short back spin serve. Many of the returns hit the net and just fall over. I hate this so much. Usually weaker players just net the ball.

Still, I think edges and nets balls should be lets unless the person hitting the ball calls the shot like in pool. I have played too many games where I get three edges or net balls against me. That is the equivalent of a lot of ratings points.

It is so bad I even have names for different types of lucky shots. A Cal ball is one that hits the top of the net and then hits the edge of the table. Yes there is a person I play with named Cal. There are also Furman and Brad balls.

I can easily beat any of the three without the bad breaks.

 

[Der_Echte]

Kevin,

Sounds like O40/O50 Korean Lady style LP play.

I won't give you the "Don't serve underspin" response, I would +1 it and make it a point winning serve. The trick is to show a variety of all spins, placements, and depths from the same serve motion. Once you establish you can do that, if your serve is not high, often you win the point, often by surprise, because opponent is thinking it is a harmless light ball.

For me, there is ALMOST no greater joy in Table Tennis than serving to an LP player, and that player uses the pips and it doesn't or barely makes it to the net.

There are numerous other things an LP player can do for points, but accept this nugget to use his/her aggressiveness or uncertainty against them.

 

[tropical]

Do you know how much a lucky balls is worth in ratings points?

I agree with your evaluation of relative luck by style but I usually come out on the wrong side of it. I have a very good short back spin serve. Many of the returns hit the net and just fall over. I hate this so much. Usually weaker players just net the ball.

Still, I think edges and nets balls should be lets unless the person hitting the ball calls the shot like in pool. I have played too many games where I get three edges or net balls against me. That is the equivalent of a lot of ratings points.

It is so bad I even have names for different types of lucky shots. A Cal ball is one that hits the top of the net and then hits the edge of the table. Yes there is a person I play with named Cal. There are also Furman and Brad balls.

I can easily beat any of the three without the bad breaks.

This type of argument is really funny. Keep believing what you believe but you lose to these folks because you are weaker than them, period!

 

[tropical]

Kevin,

Sounds like O40/O50 Korean Lady style LP play.

I won't give you the "Don't serve underspin" response, I would +1 it and make it a point winning serve. The trick is to show a variety of all spins, placements, and depths from the same serve motion. Once you establish you can do that, if your serve is not high, often you win the point, often by surprise, because opponent is thinking it is a harmless light ball.

For me, there is ALMOST no greater joy in Table Tennis than serving to an LP player, and that player uses the pips and it doesn't or barely makes it to the net.

There are numerous other things an LP player can do for points, but accept this nugget to use his/her aggressiveness or uncertainty against them.

Very true. I am a LP player and use this tactic to beat other LP players with my FH. If someone serves dead or very little spin fast ball to my LP BH I have to try to be unpredictable by flipping, pushing, step around and attack, or twiddle, etc and of course position the ball all over the place and vary speed of the return as well. Otherwise I am a sitting duck waiting to be killed with the next strong loop attack.

 

[al_111]

If one tends to hit the edge/net frequently, it simply means he's not consistent enough in his shots to avoid it. Hence, he's also netting the ball and missing the table more frequently, too. It's just the opponent always thinks it was a forced error and takes it for granted

 

[Loopadoop]

Those former CNT members who play an aggressive style.

 

[Der_Echte]

Some types of shots are more prone to go over with net contact than others. Unfortunately, I don't hit too many of those shots.

A player with good touch on short receive will get those too, damn, I suck at short receive compared to them.

 

[Overseer Kevin]

One thing I've noticed. Long pip players by far get the most nets against me. I can't give a physics lesson on the dynamics, and I don't think i need to because we all know it's luck. Lol

 

[Der_Echte]

An edge or a net here or there is unfortunate if it happens to you and can be the wrong side of the odd calculation (think luck).

However, a player who constantly averages 4 or more net/edge shots a match... that isn't luck, it is actually skill.

There is a Korean club in LA (Pro TT) that has a huge banner saying as much, it ought to be one of a TTer's tourist destination checklist stops.

 

[langel]

However, a player who constantly averages 4 or more net/edge shots a match... that isn't luck, it is actually skill.

Thank you

 

[brokenball]

However, a player who constantly averages 4 or more net/edge shots a match... that isn't luck, it is actually skill.

Show us ONE example of a 'skillful' player that averages 4 or more net/edges a match.
I have never heard of a multi ball "hit the edge" or "hit the net and roll over drill".
These "skillful" players are "skillful" without practicing?
Do these "skillful" players 'cho' ( actually spelled qiu in pinyin ) their edges and net balls? Most players, even the best Chinese players, acknowledge their luck or good break.

 

[Lermanator]

Show us ONE example of a 'skillful' player that averages 4 or more net/edges a match.
I have never heard of a multi ball "hit the edge" or "hit the net and roll over drill".
These "skillful" players are "skillful" without practicing?
Do these "skillful" players 'cho' ( actually spelled qiu in pinyin ) their edges and net balls? Most players, even the best Chinese players, acknowledge their luck or good break.

That good behaviour is unfortunately decreasing. Alot of junior players at the Joola teams this year (not me) were choing, clapping and chearing on missed serves, nets and edges. In fact, at 1-1 in the first game this kid and his teammates choed really loud when I missed my serve and his mom yelled "haoqiu" (pronced hao-cho means "good ball" in chinese)

 

[pgpg]

Show us ONE example of a 'skillful' player that averages 4 or more net/edges a match.
I have never heard of a multi ball "hit the edge" or "hit the net and roll over drill".
These "skillful" players are "skillful" without practicing?
Do these "skillful" players 'cho' ( actually spelled qiu in pinyin ) their edges and net balls? Most players, even the best Chinese players, acknowledge their luck or good break.

You are taking 'skill' comment too literally, but here is a longer explanation why skill (and play style ) plays bigger role than you might think.

Choppers are trained to land their balls as close to the end line as possible and keep them low as well - I expect this will get more edge balls and nets right there.

Close to the table LP blockers will also frequently want to keep their chop-blocks low and short, trying to take as much pace off the ball as possible to produce very uncomfortable return - many more nets here as well, with slow net balls pretty much non-returnable.

Compare this to your typical looper who will rely on topspin to bring ball down, so these will usually clear the net with lots of room to spare, or if they do hit the net, it takes them long in 90% of the cases (too much speed and deflection angle works against you).

So, yes, producing slow and low, or deep and low backspin balls will get you more 'lucky' nets and edges, but it's a feature of that particular style. Won't be surprised if good lobbers get more edges as well, since they are mostly not aiming for the middle of the table either.

 

[brokenball]

mom yelled "haoqiu" (pronced hao-cho means "good ball" in chinese)

Yes, this is off topic but in China the older people say hao qiu to complement another persons good ball. The older people are more polite.

 

[NextLevel]

That good behaviour is unfortunately decreasing. Alot of junior players at the Joola teams this year (not me) were choing, clapping and chearing on missed serves, nets and edges. In fact, at 1-1 in the first game this kid and his teammates choed really loud when I missed my serve and his mom yelled "haoqiu" (pronced hao-cho means "good ball" in chinese)

People cheer missed dunks in NBA games too. At some point, it's best to develop ways to handle the pressure than to act as if it's a bad thing to want to win a zero sum game.

 

[pgpg]

People cheer missed dunks in NBA games too. At some point, it's best to develop ways to handle the pressure than to act as if it's a bad thing to want to win a zero sum game.

I'd say it's both: it is poor sportsmanship to cheer/cho missed serves (IMHO, at least if it comes from your opponent, parents and spectators are not subject to the same rules, I suspect). But - you must develop resistance/mental toughness against this behavior, or you will be at serious disadvantage.

I know it originally annoyed me a lot when opponent loudly said 'Thank you' after I botch the serve, so I'm kind of with Lermanator on this, but I also knew I had to learn to ignore it, because what else you can do - umpire is unlikely to call it, and, by the way, we don't have umpires anyway, so you are back to square one, but now they are in your head . I think I'm better at ignoring this now...