Daily Table Tennis Chit Chat

[OldschoolPenholder]

Want to improve?

[begin Alec Baldwin voice]

ABP. A-Always, B-Be, P-Playing. Always be playing. ALWAYS BE PLAYING.

[/end voice]
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A TTDer posted:

Tip: to improve your game, always try to play against higher level players.

I disagreed with the 'always' part of the tip and replied:

I agree but disagree somewhat with this tip. I feel it is only 1/3 of the Path to Self-perfection. To improve your game, play against ALL levels of players!

You play the higher-level players to find your Weaknesses. You play them to get a sense of how they go about setting up to play their Winning shots. You play them with your higher-percentage shots which generally should be returned by them, which forces you to up your Game/Skill from a one-shot to continue to be steady/rally.

You play lower-level players to work your Game, to work your higher-percentage shots be it serves or the Rambo FH loop, etc. You also play them to learn to probe/see Weaknesses in your partner's Game and learn to exploit them.

Last but not least, you play same-level-as-you players ... your peers/equals. This will provide feedback to see if your Game works. At times, as you play your equals, they may play like a higher-level player and at times they will play as lower-level players... this will give you feedback on what you are doing right or wrong and how to go about winning the point.

Play anyone regardless of level. But have a basic idea of their level and look to work different aspects of your Game accordingly.

HTH.

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So yeah, HTH!

 

[Archosaurus]

Shuki, my self esteem doesn't need a boost. People trying to bring you down simply means that they're trying to bring you down to their level. There is no reason at all to impart a burden on your fellow man's shoulders: for his back is already at it's limit.

Besides, all my life I've got nothing but negative feedback. You'd think I'd have grown thick skin by now, wouldn't you.
I don't even disagree with most of the feedback, necessarily. I've never understood why anyone with any sense in their head would say anything good about me. Even then, it's no reason not to accept yourself. If you won't, who will?


I also do not think that most people here are trying to bring me down. This place is surprisingly civil, and the negative feedback, although negative, is still quite constructive. There was a time when I would take it personally and get insulted, but why get upset over people trying to help you? Even if the truth can be kind of ugly.

There are people out there who will point out the flaws of other people so they don't feel so bad about their own, but they never make any sense.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Alright Archo, here are a few drills you can work on:

1) that video where Brett shows how relaxed your grip should be, practice that.

2) when you do shadow drills practice making your arm floppy relaxed like in Brett's video.

3) have a friend hit to you really slow moderately high balls. Like a foot above the net. Have the person move you around all over the table and you move to and take EVERYTHING with just your FH. As you get better at it you can make it a little faster at a time.

4) you hit with a friend, the goal is to get as many in a row on the table as possible so you want the other person to get the ball back and they want you to get the ball back. Not fast. Not slow. The speed of a counterhit. Like the first thing pros do to warm up before they start looping. And the placement from both players is random. You both keep moving the ball around. You both keep hitting it at a moderate pace. You both make it so the other player has to watch where the ball goes and move to it. And you both make it so each shot is fairly easy to return.

1 & 2 are about relaxing that crazy tense forearm of yours.

3 & 4 are about you starting to work on tracking and moving to the ball.

But no matter how you slice it, you need to work on resetting after your stroke and getting to the ready position WAY faster. And you need to try to watch the ball and the other person's racket when they hit the ball.


Sent from the Subterranean Workshop by Telepathy

 

[NextLevel]

Alright Archo, here are a few drills you can work on:

1) that video where Brett shows how relaxed your grip should be, practice that.

2) when you do shadow drills practice making your arm floppy relaxed like in Brett's video.

3) have a friend hit to you really slow moderately high balls. Like a foot above the net. Have the person move you around all over the table and you move to and take EVERYTHING with just your FH. As you get better at it you can make it a little faster at a time.

4) you hit with a friend, the goal is to get as many in a row on the table as possible so you want the other person to get the ball back and they want you to get the ball back. Not fast. Not slow. The speed of a counterhit. Like the first thing pros do to warm up before they start looping. And the placement from both players is random. You keep moving the ball around. You keep hitting it at a moderate pace. You make it so the other player has to watch where the ball goes and move to it. And you make it so each shot is fairly easy to return.

1 & 2 are about relaxing that crazy tense forearm of yours.

3 & 4 are about you starting to work on tracking and moving to the ball.


Sent from the Subterranean Workshop by Telepathy

The biggest thing Archo needs is a friend who wants to get good at TT as badly as archo does. That by itself will do magical things for archo's game. A soliloquy of the sort he presently engages in only results in internal chaos or delusional order.

 

[42andbackpains]

Last weekend went to my club to train with one of my coaches for a hour before i went to meet the Goon Squad in the NYC get together.

1. I decided to heed the advice of many online friends(NextLevel mainly) and play MX-P on my forehand and T05 on my backhand. Previously i was using H3 Neo(Secret Sauce added) and Short Pips on my backhand for about 2 years. Just couldn't get to the level i felt like i was confident. Right off the bat the MX-P felt bouncier and it was doing work for me and not the me doing the work for H3. And with some advice from my coach to flatten out the stroke(angle adjustment), i was forehand looping like it was 20 years ago again. Coach told me to slow down so i don't hurt myself because i am prone to injuries but i felt like i wasn't going very hard. I was going about 80% and during multiball forehand looping versus incoming downspin...i was getting great friction and force into the ball(the arc was pretty good too)..so i was a happy camper.....Then i got tired and switched to backhand.

2. I have been playing shortpips backhand for 2 years and decided to go back to smooth inverted rubber. At first the ball was flying off the table because of the bounciness of T05 and my muscle memory of the shortpips technique(shortpips have no tensor self bounce effect). About 5 minutes into it and i was starting to get the technique back. Coach said use less wrist and a little more arm and lift the ball. It will take another session or two before the backhand is where i want it but right off i feel the T05 backhand is already stronger than my shortpips backhand.

At 4 went to meet the Goon Squad and you can read all about it from USDC, NL, DE and OSPH in the NYC thread.

 

[Archosaurus]

Alright Archo, here are a few drills you can work on:

1) that video where Brett shows how relaxed your grip should be, practice that.

2) when you do shadow drills practice making your arm floppy relaxed like in Brett's video.

3) have a friend hit to you really slow moderately high balls. Like a foot above the net. Have the person move you around all over the table and you move to and take EVERYTHING with just your FH. As you get better at it you can make it a little faster at a time.

4) you hit with a friend, the goal is to get as many in a row on the table as possible so you want the other person to get the ball back and they want you to get the ball back. Not fast. Not slow. The speed of a counterhit. Like the first thing pros do to warm up before they start looping. And the placement from both players is random. You keep moving the ball around. You keep hitting it at a moderate pace. You make it so the other player has to watch where the ball goes and move to it. And you make it so each shot is fairly easy to return.

1 & 2 are about relaxing that crazy tense forearm of yours.

3 & 4 are about you starting to work on tracking and moving to the ball.


Sent from the Subterranean Workshop by Telepathy

Those sound good. I do 1 and 2 constantly. I THINK it's starting to show some small results. I will just keep working at it, it'll eventually click.


However I'd really need a partner who wants to advance to a high level, like NL says. I don't understand why other people can't see what's so good about this sport.

Sometimes I really wonder if I picked the wrong sport, you know. Maybe I'd been better off just ignoring the table tennis table at my school. At least it'd be much quieter around here, hahaha.

 

[ttmonster]

If you really think you have picked this Sport Archo, this is what you should immediately do :

1. Buy table tennis shorts and shoes , practising in jeans really does not help.
2. Find a coach or club and beg them to let you play for free, figure out to get there by hitchhiking or cycling or whatever economic method you can come up with
3. Find a group of amateurs who are willing and ready to practice with you atleast 4-5 times a week what you learn from your coach .

Nitpicking on technicalities that higher level players are discussing is not going to do you any good, I know this has been said over and over but it is really the truth ...

Those sound good. I do 1 and 2 constantly. I THINK it's starting to show some small results. I will just keep working at it, it'll eventually click.


However I'd really need a partner who wants to advance to a high level, like NL says. I don't understand why other people can't see what's so good about this sport.

Sometimes I really wonder if I picked the wrong sport, you know. Maybe I'd been better off just ignoring the table tennis table at my school. At least it'd be much quieter around here, hahaha.

 

[Archosaurus]

If you really think you have picked this Sport Archo, this is what you should immediately do :

1. Buy table tennis shorts and shoes , practising in jeans really does not help.
2. Find a coach or club and beg them to let you plan for free
3. Find a group of amateurs who are willing and ready to practice with you atleast 4-5 times a week what you learn from your coach .

Nitpicking on technicalities that higher level players are discussing is not going to do you any good, I know this has been said over and over but it is really the truth ...

I think I should probably forget the sport entirely until I've moved to a place where those are even remotely possible. You'd be surprised what kind of niche table tennis is around here.

I wouldn't even post here if I had a regular club and trained 5 times a week: getting me out of the club for the weekend would be difficult enough.

However, I will keep those in mind when I eventually move to a place that actually likes this sport.

 

[NextLevel]

Last weekend went to my club to train with one of my coaches for a hour before i went to meet the Goon Squad in the NYC get together.

1. I decided to heed the advice of many online friends(NextLevel mainly) and play MX-P on my forehand and T05 on my backhand. Previously i was using H3 Neo(Secret Sauce added) and Short Pips on my backhand for about 2 years. Just couldn't get to the level i felt like i was confident. Right off the bat the MX-P felt bouncier and it was doing work for me and not the me doing the work for H3. And with some advice from my coach to flatten out the stroke(angle adjustment), i was forehand looping like it was 20 years ago again. Coach told me to slow down so i don't hurt myself because i am prone to injuries but i felt like i wasn't going very hard. I was going about 80% and during multiball forehand looping versus incoming downspin...i was getting great friction and force into the ball(the arc was pretty good too)..so i was a happy camper.....Then i got tired and switched to backhand.

2. I have been playing shortpips backhand for 2 years and decided to go back to smooth inverted rubber. At first the ball was flying off the table because of the bounciness of T05 and my muscle memory of the shortpips technique(shortpips have no tensor self bounce effect). About 5 minutes into it and i was starting to get the technique back. Coach said use less wrist and a little more arm and lift the ball. It will take another session or two before the backhand is where i want it but right off i feel the T05 backhand is already stronger than my shortpips backhand.

At 4 went to meet the Goon Squad and you can read all about it from USDC, NL, DE and OSPH in the NYC thread.

Great to hear. If you want to relax more, get something even softer on both sides. I switched to T80 from T05 and I finally started blocking and smashing even better. Not saying you should per se, but my point is that you are still using some of the most challenging Euro/Japanese rubber and you can get even less challenging things. MX-P and T05 tend to respond to the same stroke technique even if they feel and respond somewhat differently so you can switch the forehand and backhand whenever you want to.

Also, work on your slow spin. It will bail you out when you are tired. This is one area where MX-P is simply not as good as T05.

 

[ttmonster]

My sincere and honestly non-cynical advice is that you do the opposite, for now till "that" time , keep reading / asking questions but refrain from explaining or giving advice .... walk the walk and then talk .... "do as I say not as I do" does not really work in this sport man, how many coaches do you see who were not pro players, the only high profile personalities you see who have little background in this sport are the administrators and they are the ones who are ruining the sport and we all understand why.
As long as your aspiration is to become Ma Long and not Adham Sahara ... I think you should keep your opinions to yourself and once you have the practical tools to validate your ideas you can tell it to others instead of purely speculating and trying to use "alternate experiences" to explain table tennis technique ...

I wouldn't even post here if I had a regular club and trained 5 times a week: getting me out of the club for the weekend would be difficult enough.

 

[Der_Echte]

You guys do know that I have 24/7 access to the club in Philly, right?

No, actually, I didn't know, even from all those vids and all you 10,000 posts over the last 2-3 years.

I really thought you slept there, (on top of a table like Snoopy or under the table to avoid drip drop a drippity drop rain...) that is why I understood you had access.

Other that living in your club, nothing accounts for your progress over the last several years. You are a Bone-Crusher Man-Killer who is very well read.

 

[42andbackpains]

Great to hear. If you want to relax more, get something even softer on both sides. I switched to T80 from T05 and I finally started blocking and smashing even better. Not saying you should per se, but my point is that you are still using some of the most challenging Euro/Japanese rubber and you can get even less challenging things. MX-P and T05 tend to respond to the same stroke technique even if they feel and respond somewhat differently so you can switch the forehand and backhand whenever you want to.

Also, work on your slow spin. It will bail you out when you are tired. This is one area where MX-P is simply not as good as T05.

NextLevel, Thanks for the recommendation. May try T80 on the next EJ splurge. Spent too much already booking 2 night stay in downtown Philly for this upcoming weekends Women World Cup. I felt relatively comfortable switching to MX-P and T05 coming off from H3. They are much easier to control when compared to H3 Neo. You need exact/perfect strokes and timing to bring out H3s potential and at my age and injuries, it is too much effort to use H3 Neo. I do notice T05 lets the ball sink in deeper and the MX-P may be a tad spinnier. I find both rubbers fast and i like them alot. Now i see why the MX-P so popular at that type of price point. Thanks again.

 

[NextLevel]

NextLevel, Thanks for the recommendation. May try T80 on the next EJ splurge. Spent too much already booking 2 night stay in downtown Philly for this upcoming weekends Women World Cup.

T80 surprised me enough that one day, at my level and with my slow blades, I might do T64. But the real point of this post was to say: See you there, I am going for all 3 days too. Unfortunately, your concubine, Ding Ning, and your girlfriend, Liu Shiwen, decided to pull out at the last second.

 

[NextLevel]

My sincere and honestly non-cynical advice is that you do the opposite, for now till "that" time , keep reading / asking questions but refrain from explaining or giving advice .... walk the walk and then talk .... "do as I say not as I do" does not really work in this sport man, how many coaches do you see who were not pro players, the only high profile personalities you see who have little background in this sport are the administrators and they are the ones who are ruining the sport and we all understand why.
As long as your aspiration is to become Ma Long and not Adham Sahara ... I think you should keep your opinions to yourself and once you have the practical tools to validate your ideas you can tell it to others instead of purely speculating and trying to use "alternate experiences" to explain table tennis technique ...

Well said. IF Archo posted a minute or two of serve practice on a daily basis or at least 3 times a week and asked for tips to improve his serve, then I can get him off the ignore list for that. Serves are something you can improve all by yourself and in fact, if you can get the serves better, you will learn to generate spin and your technique will automatically get better.

But the questions that are really disguised argument baits are a waste of my time. Those will never get responses.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

But the questions that are really disguised argument baits are a waste of my time. Those will never get responses.

Funny. I almost wrote something about how Archo "asks questions".

[emoji2]


Sent from the Subterranean Workshop by Telepathy

 

[Archosaurus]

Perhaps I can pull a Siva and become a serve jugaadu master who cannot return the spin that comes back but can definitely generate it.
At least I actually know something from real experience when talking serves. My serve level is perhaps even over 1000 USATT! Hahah.

I was going to post serve video yesterday, but my shoulder was hurting. I think I slept on it and then twisted it or something. Really did not want to raise my elbow to serve because for all I know it'll get worse if I push it. Although I was dumb enough to play some: no pain in my shoulder when doing strokes.

However if I raise my elbow right now, I still feel some slight pain. So I don't know if I will even play at all today. Maybe I'll get some footage tomorrow, on Friday.

Funny. I almost wrote something about how Archo "asks questions".

You can go ahead. However I think I'd be more interested in what I'm doing RIGHT. You see, other than hear what I'm doing wrong and end up not doing anything at all, I'd at least like to know what I can keep doing so I don't make everyone mad.
I will eventually need to post a post with my serves, and I don't think you want a "Hello, tell me how to improve my serve" because then you can't understand my goals at all or what I feel are my problems. I can do a wicked sidespin pendulum for example, but struggle in adding other spins to it, and you will never know that just on video alone.

 

[laistrogian]

NextLevel, Thanks for the recommendation. May try T80 on the next EJ splurge. Spent too much already booking 2 night stay in downtown Philly for this upcoming weekends Women World Cup. I felt relatively comfortable switching to MX-P and T05 coming off from H3. They are much easier to control when compared to H3 Neo. You need exact/perfect strokes and timing to bring out H3s potential and at my age and injuries, it is too much effort to use H3 Neo. I do notice T05 lets the ball sink in deeper and the MX-P may be a tad spinnier. I find both rubbers fast and i like them alot. Now i see why the MX-P so popular at that type of price point. Thanks again.

I actually find a boosted hurricane 3 to be more forgiving compared to Tenergy 05 on looping. It might be because of my stroke mechanics of how I just rip the ball up with a lot of arm acceleration (a bit like quadri aruna on the arm movement).

I can do a wicked sidespin pendulum for example, but struggle in adding other spins to it, and you will never know that just on video alone.

By all means archo, please post it I'm sure a lot of people are interested to see how good that serve is

 

[NextLevel]

Laistrogian,

You and 42andbackpains are still ball bashers. Nothing wrong with ball bashing per se, but since you both have movement issues, it caps your level since you don't recover quickly enough vs basic blocks. Embracing the rally is required to get better at table tennis for most players who are not able to play all forehands. That's why most people are coached early to embrace 5th ball table tennis so they have variety on their third ball game.

The fact that 42andbackpains finds MX-P spinnier tells me he is still sometimes driving the ball too much. But it takes time to change how you play. It's not an overnight thing. But again, I repeat, you can only get as good as your movement will support and if you continue to play as if you need to win the rally with one shot, you will not get better unless you have the serves and the movement to consistently take that one shot. If you put more of the power into spin, even if it is relaxed and slow, then it gives you time to move to the ball except against players who counter heavy spin aggressively. With a few coached exceptions, such players tend to be over usatt 2000.

 

[Boogar]

If you really think you have picked this Sport Archo, this is what you should immediately do :

1. Buy table tennis shorts and shoes , practising in jeans really does not help.
2. Find a coach or club and beg them to let you play for free, figure out to get there by hitchhiking or cycling or whatever economic method you can come up with
3. Find a group of amateurs who are willing and ready to practice with you atleast 4-5 times a week what you learn from your coach .

Nitpicking on technicalities that higher level players are discussing is not going to do you any good, I know this has been said over and over but it is really the truth ...

What i did was starting an outdoor league in my town. Thats how i got in the hours and experiences in the beginning. Now Still play about 5 Hours a week outdoors.
I met tons of cool people like this. Because the place i play at outdoors is a great tourist attraction i get to play with Chinese tt players all the time Well most of them are really bad tho. Also I got in contact with people from different clubs etc.

 

[OldschoolPenholder]

T80 surprised me enough that one day, at my level and with my slow blades, I might do T64. But the real point of this post was to say: See you there, I am going for all 3 days too.

Have fun Sir!

Unfortunately, your concubine, Ding Ning, and your girlfriend, Liu Shiwen, decided to pull out at the last second.

I'm going to make sure Mrs 42&bp twists 42&bp's ear and get him for the concubine and girlfriend LOL