Popularity of Inner Carbons in pro game.

[PaddyPolar]

Hey, i was just doing so pro equipment research, and i realised how popular Inner Carbon blades are with pros. For example, the W968, Long 5x, Otcharov and Harimoto ALC's are all inner carbons. This list of blades takes up a large majority of the top ten as of right now. I assumed, as the pro game is all based on power, super fast outer carbons would be all over the place with pros, blades way too fast for us mortals. But no, only a large majority have inner carbons which provide much more control, which is understandable if you are in the situation of duece in the 7th, with £50,000 at stake. What really surprised me, is the Ma Long uses an inner carbon. For someone who has so much power, and so calm, why doesn't he use an outer? Did this surprise anyone else?

 

[Lazer]

The game isn’t only about speed. With slower equipment you get a larger spectrum of slow and fast. I still prefer 5 ply wood blades. I don’t think the higher cost of a composite justifies the advantage, in reality it’s marginal.

Cheers
L-zr

 

[BaRanchik]

These pros can generate enough power with an all-wood blade too. In fact, Ma Long used Nittaku Acoustic in the past.
I guess it comes down to personal preference.

 

[Dominikk85]

Could be a Factor that rubbers got so much faster?

I guess after the speed glue ban outer carbon really became popular (like the boll alc or the primorac carbon) to compensate for the lesser speed but now rubbers are so fast again that pros don't need the super fast blade like they needed in the early 2010s?

 

[Choosikick]

Hey, i was just doing so pro equipment research, and i realised how popular Inner Carbon blades are with pros. For example, the W968, Long 5x, Otcharov and Harimoto ALC's are all inner carbons. This list of blades takes up a large majority of the top ten as of right now. I assumed, as the pro game is all based on power, super fast outer carbons would be all over the place with pros, blades way too fast for us mortals. But no, only a large majority have inner carbons which provide much more control, which is understandable if you are in the situation of duece in the 7th, with £50,000 at stake. What really surprised me, is the Ma Long uses an inner carbon. For someone who has so much power, and so calm, why doesn't he use an outer? Did this surprise anyone else?

In my humble opinion, everything here depends on the length of the players' movements. Accordingly, there are blades for long movements, which include most of the five-layer solid wood blades and blades with an internal layer of reinforcement, which are close to them. And there are blades for short strokes - outer layers of carbon, rigid single ply and solid wood seven ply (again, not all) blades, but keep in mind these short strokes must be very precise and at the same time pretty sharp. An example of such movements is Bruce Lee, who could extinguish a candle flame with a short fist-length movement. An example of short moves in table tennis is Fan Zhendong, Zhang Jike, Timo Bol, Werner Schlager and all of them played with outer carbon, that is, short-stroke blades.
There are probably more people who do longer movements, including among professionals.

 

[Trevize84]

It makes sense to me that powerful players look for control over speed. If your speed is already enough to score the point majority of the times, you don't look for more speed but rather control.

 

[PaddyPolar]

Could be a Factor that rubbers got so much faster?

I guess after the speed glue ban outer carbon really became popular (like the boll alc or the primorac carbon) to compensate for the lesser speed but now rubbers are so fast again that pros don't need the super fast blade like they needed in the early 2010s?

Yes, that makes sense. With super fast Dignics out, having that on a primorac would be a disaster, control wise, but I'm sure a pro could adapt to it within half an hour. These days the game is not so much about who can hit the quickest, it is more tactic based, set up your strongest shot. I see why a super fast blade may not be best for this.

 

[timdm]

But then there is also a movement towards hybrid rubbers (09c, k3, ...) and I wouldn't call them superfast rubbers.
I would think that those rubbers are going to be paired with outer carbon blades, which would re-shift the trend towards outer carbon again.
That, or a shift towards faster/harder inner carbon blades, like ovtcharov alc, xiom tmxi, etc...

 

[Migzkulit]

Yes, that makes sense. With super fast Dignics out, having that on a primorac would be a disaster, control wise, but I'm sure a pro could adapt to it within half an hour. These days the game is not so much about who can hit the quickest, it is more tactic based, set up your strongest shot. I see why a super fast blade may not be best for this.

Me when someone in my club runs primorac carbon with dignics 05 both sides(yes they national team level or coaches their equivalent):

Also Dima has an inner layer blade, harimoto has an inner layer blade.
One definitely has more power in their game than the other.

Fan zhendong, outer carbon.
Ma long, inner carbon.
Their method of winning is adjusted accordingly.
You won't see Ma long hitting backhand winners like fan does more often.
Ma long is a machine on the forehand side, yet he doesn't have the most power.

 

[kapahoo]

I thought the trend of slightly softer inner carbon blades (instead of viscaria-variants) was a consequence of the trend of harder sponges?

 

[SFF_lib]

Hey, i was just doing so pro equipment research, and i realised how popular Inner Carbon blades are with pros. For example, the W968, Long 5x, Otcharov and Harimoto ALC's are all inner carbons. This list of blades takes up a large majority of the top ten as of right now. I assumed, as the pro game is all based on power, super fast outer carbons would be all over the place with pros, blades way too fast for us mortals. But no, only a large majority have inner carbons which provide much more control, which is understandable if you are in the situation of duece in the 7th, with £50,000 at stake. What really surprised me, is the Ma Long uses an inner carbon. For someone who has so much power, and so calm, why doesn't he use an outer? Did this surprise anyone else?

Let's clarify a few misunderstanding here:

• Max speed - once fully unleashed, W968 has higher max speed than many outer ALC blade. Most pros can fully drive W968
• How to win a match - watch ML's games in 2022, inner ALC blade gives him a lot of gears and variety of shots. Table tennis is not all about power.

A bit of history about W968. Ma Long had changed his blade quite a few times. He developed his game style in the older era - FH, FH and lots of FH. So DHS made him W968. W968 with its powerful flex, is a FH weapon.

As the ABS ball was introduced and ML getting older, the new W968 has a toned down FH and much more crisp BH - changing in the direction of outer ALC.

So if you play the new W968, it feels a bit more like Viscaria than the older W968.

 

[blahness]

The answer is in the short game - inner ALC is just plain superior in terms of short control. They have very good fundamentals for producing a lot of power on loops anyway.

 

[Creek]

Even new w968 has very high catapult on hard shots ( even though it’s lower than old w968). I overshot a lot of hard FH, which is my deadliest shot, so I switched blades again