Tibhar Evolution EL-S and FX-S

[ajtatosmano2]

Could you please compare hardness between fxp and fxs.

What is difference in throw, speed, spin, pasive block between els and fx-s and tenergy 05.*
Which is more suitable for game very near the table?( ten 05 or fxs or els)
Thanks

FX-S harder than FX-P. Here you will find every information: http://www.tt-spin.de/tibhar-evolution-belagtest/
Google translate enough to understand and images and charts help a lot.
For advice you should describe your style, level and rubbers you have used. But for a really helpful advice you will have to post videos about yourself playing.

 

[FloKing]

I found this review of EL-S.
http://www.tabletennisdb.com/rubber/tibhar-evolution-el-s.html

Do you agree?

 

[Essam Zedan]

A very good rubber

 

[NextLevel]

I found this review of EL-S.
http://www.tabletennisdb.com/rubber/tibhar-evolution-el-s.html

Do you agree?

That review is the kind of thing that makes me hate reviews without a player's style and level next to the review. Claiming that the arc of MX-S or MX-P is higher than EL-S can only be true if power looping at high speeds with deep contact.

 

[gianlucamusco]

That review is the kind of thing that makes me hate reviews without a player's style and level next to the review. Claiming that the arc of MX-S or MX-P is higher than EL-S can only be true if power looping at high speeds with deep contact.

The arc of MX-P and MX-S is higher than EL-S also in slow topspin, I stuck the 3 rubbers in 3 same blades and I tried that so I can only confim. Besides if you look the backside of the packages of the rubbers also the value of catapult by factory is this:

MX-P>MX-S>EL-S

 

[AndySmith]

Personally, I don't attach much value in what's written on the packaging. It might give a general idea, but it's too vague for any real evaluation, and I suspect much of it is pure marketing to ensure equipment fits in to a product range in ways which suit sales targets.

If you compare the catapult (which doesn't necessarily link directly to throw), you'll notice that the bar is a different size on all three packets. What does this mean, do you think?

Anyway, having tried all three rubbers myself I have to disagree in general with your evaluation on the throw on slow topspins. But this is where I must come back to NL's point - context about the player is important. The only time MX-P and MX-S has a higher throw on slow impacts for me is for extreme brushing strokes. And without that piece of information readers might be misled, so it's something I would probably mention.

I certainly find that EL-S is the easiest of the three to generate a high throw, and so I would say that it's the highest throw of them all on average, but with the caveats already mentioned.

 

[sspark80]

Hi, Andy.
How would you compare the EL-S and FX-S to the Omega V Asia that you have been using?

 

[gianlucamusco]

Hi Andy, you are right but I think the throw depends also which type of blade you use. I will try again all the 3 rubbers and I will ask to my friend to check the throw in my topspins slow and powerful: I will try also to make topspins with big brush and with less brush but with fast movement of my arm to see the difference. I will let you know, bye

 

[AndySmith]

Hi, Andy.
How would you compare the EL-S and FX-S to the Omega V Asia that you have been using?

Starting with EL-S - it plays softer overall of course, and has more early catapult. It's also easier to generate spin and arc through the middle gears with EL-S - OVA requires more brush in the low/medium gears for this and is more demanding IMO. They are both quite spin sensitive, but EL-S is more jumpy due to the bigger catapult, so I'd say that EL-S is tougher to use during passive play in general (without being too much of a handful - certainly easier than T05, for example). The real headline is EL-S has an amazing quality when playing a general topspin attacking game, where it rivals T05, and looping/relooping/counterlooping/attacking backspin is super easy. OVA is more demanding in those areas, but is far more solid in the short game due to far less catapult and more linear behavior.

FX-S is obviously softer than EL-S, but seems to cross a line for me and results in too much instability for me to enjoy. Unlike many softer ESN (and Japanese) rubber, there seems to be a lot of low-speed damping going on, and then a lot of catapult, which I found hard to adapt to. I'd like a bit more time to really judge this though.

I have to admit though, as much as I can see how these rubbers have a lot of quality and performance, I don't think they're going to suit me. I've been using OVA for a full season now and I've grown to love the rock-solid stability and big brush spin it gives, so my FH wing is hard to change now. And I don't seem to like FX-S on my BH wing, so that only leaves EL-S as a BH option for me.

Hi Andy, you are right but I think the throw depends also which type of blade you use. I will try again all the 3 rubbers and I will ask to my friend to check the throw in my topspins slow and powerful: I will try also to make topspins with big brush and with less brush but with fast movement of my arm to see the difference. I will let you know, bye

OK, great stuff. Thanks for putting the time in, but don't bust a gut. The point is only that it's really tough to get a truly objective comparison of equipment without knowing something about the person using it.

 

[sspark80]

Thanks for the detailed comparison, Andy. It's very helpful; I might try EL-S when my current rubbers wear out.

 

[FloKing]

I doubt EL-S will fit my game better than MX-P but you all hightlighted so much quality that I want to give it a shot!
What about serves? MX-P is really great for that. Is EL-S as good?

 

[crbn]

Could you compare hardness of EL-S with T05/T80 and FX-S with Baracuda/T05 FX, please?

 

[Ilia Minkin]

Could you compare hardness of EL-S with T05/T80 and FX-S with Baracuda/T05 FX, please?

You can find the number on the packages. As posted before, EL-S is 33.5-35.0, T05/T80 is ~36, and T05FX is ~32. I don't know about Barracuda though.

BTW, my EL-S are on their way

 

[AndySmith]

I doubt EL-S will fit my game better than MX-P but you all hightlighted so much quality that I want to give it a shot!
What about serves? MX-P is really great for that. Is EL-S as good?

EL-S lacks some of the crisp feel of MX-P, and you get a first impression of it being less powerful when you warm up with basic drives. EL-S's strength is putting big spin on the ball in comparison, and you notice it being a lot easier when looping.

I actually found EL-S to be better than MX-P for most serves - easier to keep the ball short with big spin. The only downside is with fast, flat serves where EL-S needs a bit more input from the player.

For existing MX-P users - if you want a slightly softer rubber, with easier access to spin but less direct power, EL-S is worth a go. But if you value MX-P's precision driving game more than anything else, EL-S might feel like a step backwards. I can't see Drinkhall using EL-S for example because I would imagine he would lose more than he would gain, considering his all-out approach.

Could you compare hardness of EL-S with T05/T80 and FX-S with Baracuda/T05 FX, please?

EL-S is very close to T05's overall hardness, with the topsheet being a little softer on the EL-S. Which makes it closer to T80 in some ways I suppose, but it plays closer to T05 IMO.

FX-S is a lot softer than baracuda - both sponge and topsheet. It's very close to T80-FX (same kind of arrangement as the EL-S/T80 comparison) but I find that FX-S feels different to the FX tenergy versions due to the lack of low-gear dynamics.

 

[FloKing]

EL-S lacks some of the crisp feel of MX-P, and you get a first impression of it being less powerful when you warm up with basic drives. EL-S's strength is putting big spin on the ball in comparison, and you notice it being a lot easier when looping.

I actually found EL-S to be better than MX-P for most serves - easier to keep the ball short with big spin. The only downside is with fast, flat serves where EL-S needs a bit more input from the player.

For existing MX-P users - if you want a slightly softer rubber, with easier access to spin but less direct power, EL-S is worth a go. But if you value MX-P's precision driving game more than anything else, EL-S might feel like a step backwards. I can't see Drinkhall using EL-S for example because I would imagine he would lose more than he would gain, considering his all-out approach.

Thanks a lot AndySmith!
I have some very effective fast and spinny serves in my arsenal. It looks I'm gonna have trouble to find the length and speed with the same ease given more input is needed.
I value the direct power of MX-P. I'm not sure now whether EL-S worth a try!

 

[crbn]

EL-S is very close to T05's overall hardness, with the topsheet being a little softer on the EL-S. Which makes it closer to T80 in some ways I suppose, but it plays closer to T05 IMO.

"it plays closer to T05" - What do you mean by that? EL-S is spinnier, slower, with higher throw than T80?

 

[AndySmith]

"it plays closer to T05" - What do you mean by that? EL-S is spinnier, slower, with higher throw than T80?

Spinnier depends on the situation really, but yes I think it's slightly slower and higher throw than T80. However....

Good news is that I have a training session tonight and I'll be able to compare directly to T80, T05 and T64-FX (last one not so useful, but still). So I'll sit on the fence until tomorrow for a final judgement.

 

[AndySmith]

Thanks a lot AndySmith!
I have some very effective fast and spinny serves in my arsenal. It looks I'm gonna have trouble to find the length and speed with the same ease given more input is needed.
I value the direct power of MX-P. I'm not sure now whether EL-S worth a try!

Yeah, this is the key factor for you, or any MX-P user really. I know some players at my club who specifically choose MX-P over T05 for similar reasons you describe, and I bet they wouldn't like EL-S as much. But it all depends, and there is no free lunch for anyone. You want more spin via a more flexible topsheet, you lose direct punchiness to some degree. But some would consider that a worthwhile trade-off.

 

[ajtatosmano2]

I worry about the power of EL-S and nobody uses Evolution in my neighbourhood (everyone is whether Tenergy-guy or use sthing much slower). Unfortunately my next mandatory rubber change will be at winter or at late autumn, so I won't be able to test it, unless you can convince me. Someone could write a rubber with the same speed/dynamics?

 

[MydasDiablo]

I am no testing expert, like Andy Smith who incidentally has it absolutely spot on in his assessment and advice, however here is my impression having played with pretty much every 45-50 degree ESN rubber over the last few years as well as a brief stint with T05:

EL-S is a fantastic rubber with grip comparable to Tenergy 05. This extra grip does also come with extra sensitivity to spin. Whilst it is the best alternative for T05 in terms of speed, spin and throw angle, I found it to be a rubber with no personality, ESN sponges under 47 degrees just feel bland and overly soft to me. Whilst EL-S may gain many fans as the highest spin and arc producing ESN rubber, I find it quite boring to play with. MX-P on the other hand never fails to put a smile on my face. I have written this review to warn MX-P and T05 users not to get EL-S if they have an addiction to that satisfying 'CRACK' and explosive power that comes from the MX-P's boosted 47 degree sponge and T05's infamous spring sponge. If you are looking for high spin, high arc and want a rubber that forgives more than T05 and MX-P then EL-S is your rubber, I myself am going straight back to MX-P as it is easier to control than T05 and still puts a big smile on my face when I engage the ball hard and get that crack reminiscent of the speed glue era. I can't see that any professionals using either T05 or MX-P would switch to EL-S. It is probably the best all round rubber I have ever played with, but it is just missing something that I can't enjoy the game without -

My personal opinion is that EL-S is not a T05 or MX-P replacement per-se, I think the players that stuck with Barracuda, despite all the new rubber releases, should give EL-S a try and I am certain they will love it as the sponge is a bit harder, far more consistent and more gears.