what new hybrid rubber?

[mil]

Hi there,

I had a very good time with the RAKZA Z EXTRA HARD RED on the FH (BH Rakza PO, blade Persson PowerCarbon OFF+).
I bought two new ones but they have no speed - heavy yes, cheap yes, low catapult, but no speed, I want to try something else, but what?

The regular Rakza Z is not for me - easy to play and much more catapult which is fine, but not good enough for power topspins or smashes/flat hits.

I have a black DYNARYZ ZGR:
good for service, push, short-short, speed is there when attacking.
PROBLEM: a totally flat trajectory, a very short dwell time.
The offensive works for me only with very fast swings if I stand well and take the ball early - so it is 50:50 - one winner, one miss. The biggest problem is the opening topspin, the slow spinny safe curved loop is something I cannot produce with this rubber. Also I play mostly in cold conditions which does not help.

Should I buy a DYNARYZ ZGX version?
It should be way softer while still hard, longer contact time, more arc. Or try something different? What?

I play mostly close to the table.
I need both the slow SPINNY opening loop and the powerloop to finish the point. I do not play pure Chinese rubbers (I cannot generate power from nowhere, the rubber needs to have some power), I would prefer a speedy hybrid. K3 is not an option - I tried a worn out one, not tacky at all, did not like it and they are said to wear out very quickly...

 

[jk1980]

it really depends if it needs to be tacky.
There are quite a few rubbers that might be easier to play, but still harder than all the 47,5° rubbers.

Note: these are not sticky, even though they are called hybrid:
- Stiga DNA Hybrid M & H

 

[exotick]

Surprised you never mentioned 09c as it falls in the category of rubbers you have used. You say you played with rakza z EH and like everything but missing the speed. In that case 09c should be perfect for you - same hardness, same good short play/control but higher speed at the top end.

 

[IB66]

Tibhar K3 and Xiom J&H H52.5 could be other options, along with Bluegrip C1 and Xiom Omega VII China Guang.

I have used J&H H52.5 and Rakza Z / Z EH, the J&H H52.5 is a very nice rubber, I like this as much, if not, more than Rakza Z EH (i would be happy to use both!!) the only issue with the J&H H 53.5 is that it is not available in UK / Europe, you have to order from Far East, I am currently waiting for 2 sheets of J&H H to turn up, they were ordered just under a month ago!!!

 

[enoxzr]

Sticking to European/Japanese hybrids your most logical options are Tibhar Hybrid K3, Stiga DNA Hybrid H/XH or even Dragon Grip, Andro Rasanter C53 and even though its pricey, Dignics 09c.

Otherwise, you could try to go Chinese and try out their harder options, for a fraction of the price.

 

[mil]

CHINESE is not an option at all - I used to play ESN with 47-48 degrees with power and catapult before switching to hybrid.

No BUTTERFLY please (I boykot them since 2010? Their price policy is a rip-off, 80 EUR for a rubber, it would have to be both magical and super durable, it is a no-go for me, I do not mind their blades, though still way overpriced, my blade would be in the 250+ EUR/USD region if it had a butterfly sticker...)

IB66:
can you write something about the J&H 52.5? specially compared to RZ EH?
J&H should be available here: https://www.stolnytenis.sk/potah-xiom-jekyll-hyde-v52-5/

I am thinking of buying two rubbers - one sticky hybrid and one non-sticky. I simply do not know which ones.

HYBRID:
- ZGR with 57 degrees sponge is too hard and flat trajectory for me, though fast
- RZ EH I can get now it too chinese with no catapult or speed
- Rakza Z is OFF- in my opinion
- Golden Tango is not produced any more
- K3 I do not have and do not want due to very bad durability

I am thinking of 52-53 degrees hybrid which I can get within/around 50 EUR. The candidates are:
ZGX, J&H 52.5, C53, Dragon Grip should be too hard

ESN:
MX-D, Z1, acuda S1 Turbo...

P.S.
I have never liked ESN under 47 degrees, but tried the 50 degrees only twice: MX-S - absolutely not for me and some Gewo or something. That was before my experience with hybrid 50+ degrees rubbers.

MX-P:
I did not like it the first time at all, too bouncy and indirect, different to hybrid, put it on a Stiga Infinity allwood blade for fun and it was better, I will try it again on my carbon blade. But the MX-P shrank by 0,5 cm since I left it two weeks on the shelf, I fresh-glued it just to stretch it onto the infinity, I do not know how the rubber will play/behave long term.

 

[IB66]

CHINESE is not an option at all - I used to play ESN with 47-48 degrees with power and catapult before switching to hybrid.

No BUTTERFLY please (I boykot them since 2010? Their price policy is a rip-off, 80 EUR for a rubber, it would have to be both magical and super durable, it is a no-go for me, I do not mind their blades, though still way overpriced, my blade would be in the 250+ EUR/USD region if it had a butterfly sticker...)

IB66:
can you write something about the J&H 52.5? specially compared to RZ EH?
J&H should be available here: https://www.stolnytenis.sk/potah-xiom-jekyll-hyde-v52-5/

I am thinking of buying two rubbers - one sticky hybrid and one non-sticky. I simply do not know which ones.

HYBRID:
- ZGR with 57 degrees sponge is too hard and flat trajectory for me, though fast
- RZ EH I can get now it too chinese with no catapult or speed
- Rakza Z is OFF- in my opinion
- Golden Tango is not produced any more
- K3 I do not have and do not want due to very bad durability

I am thinking of 52-53 degrees hybrid which I can get within/around 50 EUR. The candidates are:
ZGX, J&H 52.5, C53, Dragon Grip should be too hard

ESN:
MX-D, Z1, acuda S1 Turbo...

P.S.
I have never liked ESN under 47 degrees, but tried the 50 degrees only twice: MX-S - absolutely not for me and some Gewo or something. That was before my experience with hybrid 50+ degrees rubbers.

MX-P:
I did not like it the first time at all, too bouncy and indirect, different to hybrid, put it on a Stiga Infinity allwood blade for fun and it was better, I will try it again on my carbon blade. But the MX-P shrank by 0,5 cm since I left it two weeks on the shelf, I fresh-glued it just to stretch it onto the infinity, I do not know how the rubber will play/behave long term.

Note that the version shown on the link, is for the V version of J&H, there are 6 or so versions of J&H, the J&H H52.5 version is the only one with a 'slightly tacky' top sheet, Hence the 'H' for Hybrid!!!

So, please remember that this is MY PERSONAL impressions, everyone is different and has their own technique and are of a certain level of play, I would class my standard as intermediate.

When looking at the newer 'Hybrid' rubbers, there are a few that are very similar indeed, similar amount of tackiness, similar sponge hardness, made by ESN,
Xiom Omega China Ying, 60 degree sponge. Donic Bluegrip C1, 60 degree sponge
Xiom Omega China Guang, 55 degree sponge. Donic Bluegrip C2, 55 degree sponge.
Joola Golden Tango, Tibhar K2
It's possible that the pairs of rubbers above are the same, or very very similar!!!
Loki (Arthur Asia, Europe & China) and Xiom use black cake sponges of varying hardness, both made by ESN

Getting back to the J&H H 52 / Rakza Z/Z EH comparison,
J&H H is not as tacky maybe a tad less spin sensitive &,therefore its a little quicker, spin as good, if not better than R Z/Z EH, throw angle not as high as R Z/Z EH, which is noticeable in both short game and looping, a more open blade required to push a backspin ball with R Z/Z EH, a more closed face for looping with R Z/Z EH. slightly easier to play a topspin open up against back spin with R Z/Z EH
I used the J&H H on a Zhang Jike ALC (similar to a Viscaria) I played very well with J&H H on my FH, no ball slippage compared to Dragon Grip.
Looping is great with J&H H, it's good with R Z / Z EH, but the J&H H just felt better for me.
short game is good with J&H H, blocking solid.
Overall, both are great hybrid rubbers.

I noticed some dulling of the rubber surface with the J&H H 52, but not to reduce performance, this could be something that needs keeping an eye on though, especially as K3 is 53 degree hardness sponge, similar top sheet, Similar ESN hybrid rubbers!!!!!
(you mentioned poor durability of K3, whereas R Z/Z EH I've had no issues with durability)

hope this helps!!

 

[Kolev]

I had a hit for an hour with Rakza Z and PK-50 on an Innerforce ALC and definitely liked more the PK-50. Lower arc, faster, firmer feeling, the same or more spin...Im not sure but It is probably lighter or at least the same weight as the RZ

 

[hclnnkhg]

I had a hit for an hour with Rakza Z and PK-50 on an Innerforce ALC and definitely liked more the PK-50. Lower arc, faster, firmer feeling, the same or more spin...Im not sure but It is probably lighter or at least the same weight as the RZ

PK50 is no longer manufactured since August 2023. Some shops still have them in stock but it has been removed from Nittaku's website.

 

[mil]

J&H - I can get only the V-version of, so the rubber is ruled out. The V is too hard for a non-sticky rubber.
PK50 - if it is no longer manufactured, it is ruled out. I do not want old remains, the same goes for Golden Tango, rubber ages over time.

I will try out the ZGR on infinity if is plays better on a noncarbon blade and MX-P on my standard wood Persson PowerCarbon again next week when I can play.

Otherwise there is not much left
- the ZGX might be an option - semi-sticky and 52.5 degrees, if it does not work, I am done with Joola, lot of hype, ads and colours...
- the normal Rakza Z as a cheap compromise or some non-sticky rubbers like Z1 and MX-D.

 

[mil]

ZGR vs. ZGX

Can someone compare ZGR and ZGX? Is it a big difference of just a slight variation? If I do not manage to topspin properly with the low-trajectory ZGR, is it worth bying a ZGX, which is even more expensive?

 

[SlowPower]

Maybe Rhyzen ZGX?

 

[Syed Karar Haider]

try Stiga Mantra M. I love it and can't change

 

[TensorBackhand]

Im gonna tell you the best kept secret in TT rubber.

Get a Rhyzen ZGR and boost it with seamoon. Very good arc, very good speed, excellent grip and spin, high catapult.

Rhyzen zgr boosted is better than any of the premium hybrid rubbers like dynarz zgr or dragon grip or C53

 

[mil]

But I do not boost... it is too complicated for me. I was hoping for a rubber which would play well unboosted, I can freshen up with VOC towards the end of lifetime.

 

[vossi39]

Maybe Rhyzen ZGX?

Definitly not. It is just a rebranded Rhyzen ZGR.

 

[SlowPower]

He was talking about the dynaryz, so I threw in the Rhyzen.
The zgx should be a tad softer than the zgr (56 to 53°)...

Btw, how heavy is the rhyzen zgx?

 

[vossi39]

The zgx should be a tad softer than the zgr (56 to 53°)...

Thats what the name suggest, but it is not. I have both at home (ZGR and ZGX) so I know what I'm talking about. Rhyzen ZGR is discontinued and replaced by TRONIX ZGR.
Still don't believe me?

The Rhyzen ZGX according to Matt H. should be a lower level version of the Tronix ZGR, but definitly not softer. The Joola catalogue has the Rhyzen ZGX at 56°.

The weight of the Rhyzen ZGR/ZGX cut to normal blade size (157mm, 150mm) is around 50g.

 

[Choosikick]

Great question, @mil! I'm also looking for something similar that could replace the chinese sticky rubbers on the forehand, but not the Butterfly.
To be honest, I am very surprised by the inertia of table tennis equipment manufacturers. After 20 years of H3 dominance, it was already possible to do something better...

 

[vossi39]

A Victas V>22 could be an alternative. It is a bit softer than the Dynaryz ZGR and as well has a grippy (not tacky) surface. Speed in passive game is still a bit higher than with ZGR. I expect the Dynaryz ZGX to be a very similar rubber.

It is hard to find a rubber with high arc and still dense and compact sponge.