ITTF World Team Table Tennis Championships Finals Busan 2024

says Shoo...nothing to see here. - zeio
says Shoo...nothing to see here. - zeio
Well-Known Member
Jan 2018
7,473
9,480
18,745
says Shoo...nothing to see here. - zeio
says Shoo...nothing to see here. - zeio
Well-Known Member
Jan 2018
7,473
9,480
18,745
Watanabe also gave his reasoning on that. Hayata is the trump card, Hirano is the fail-safe in case Harimoto stumbles. It's safe to assume he is letting Harimoto get as much experience as possible ahead of Paris 2024.
TAKAGI Mina asked Watanabe on putting Hirano in the 3rd singles spot. Watanabe says he was worried about Hirano's condition after the selection race and he needed to give Harimoto as much exposure as possible ahead of Paris 2024.

パリ五輪シングルス代表の平野美宇はなぜ1点起用だったのか?女子代表監督が理由を明かす【世界卓球】
https://www.tv-tokyo.co.jp/tabletennis/news/2024/02/033011.html
なぜ女子日本の2番手である平野が1点起用なのか? 平野ではなく張本が2点起用されたのはなぜなのか?
その理由を渡辺監督に聞いた。

「平野には3番で確実に点を取ってほしいというのがあった。安心して3番に置ける選手ですし、1試合に集中できた方がいいのではないかと。あとはやっぱりオリンピックで張本にもバンバン試合に出てもらわなきゃいけないので、この世界選手権でたくさん経験を積ませたかった。それで張本を2点使いました」

さらに渡辺監督は1月の全日本選手権まで、厳しいパリオリンピック代表選考レースを戦い抜いてすぐのタイミングで世界卓球を迎えた平野のコンディションを気にかけていたという。

「全日本まですごいハードで過酷な代表レースをして、すぐにTリーグがあって、事前合宿があって、世界選手権でかわいそうだなと思っていた。果たして気持ち的に上げていけるのか。それを一番心配していました。でも、その心配をよそに平野は木下グループのメンバーと必ず午前、午後の2部練習をしていた。疲れて1回だけ休んだことがありましたけど、本当にしっかりルーティンを作って練習をして、だんだん調子が良くなっていったんです」

それだけ心身をすり減らしていた平野。

そこへ来て今大会は予選グループリーグで、バック粒(ラケットのバック面に粒高ラバーを貼っている)のアシュタリ(イラン)や隻腕の左利きでパラリンピックメダリストのアレシャンドレ(ブラジル)ら、普段はほとんど対戦機会のない選手との試合が相次ぎリズムを掴むのが難しそうだった。

平野本人も初戦が最もきつく「正直、全日本がし烈すぎて、ちょっと切り替えられていない部分もあった」と言い、特色あるプレースタイルの選手との対戦で「自分が何をしているのか。つなぐのか、コントロールするのか、狙うのかがあまり定まらない試合だった」と振り返る。

しかし、王芸迪に勝った中国との決勝では「客観的に見ても自分が何をしたいのかが分かる試合ができた」と語っている。

ちなみに平野と王芸迪の対戦はこれが6回目。

直近では2023年WTTシンガポールスマッシュで平野がフルゲーム勝利、世界卓球2023南アフリカではストレートで王芸迪が勝っており、今回平野が勝ったことで平野の2勝4敗となった。

今回の勝因だが、互いに得意なバックハンドの攻略だったという。

「私もバックは得意で相手もバックが得意。右対右(右利き同士)なので、どういうペースに持っていくかを考えていた。相手は早い展開が上手いので、自分は緩急を入れたりして戦った。そこでほぼ負けなかったし、かなり相手に圧力をかけられたと思います」

パリオリンピック本番では1番にダブルスが入ってくる。そのため今後平野はオリンピックのシードに影響する自身の世界ランクを上げることを第一に、ダブルスの強化にも取り組むこととなる。

来月はポイントの高いWTTシンガポールスマッシュ(3月7~17日)とWTTチャンピオンズ仁川(27~31日)に出場し、4月スタート予定のパリオリンピック代表合宿に参加する見通しだ。
Why is Hirano, the 2nd player on the JNT, used for 1 point? Why was Harimoto used for 2 points instead of Hirano?
I asked coach Watanabe about the reason.

"I wanted Hirano to make sure that she scored in 3rd singles, and I thought it would be better for her to be able to concentrate on one match at a time because she is a player who can be placed in the 3rd singles spot with confidence. Also, I will have to get Harimoto to play in many matches at the Olympics, so I wanted to give her a lot of experience at this WTTC. That's why I used Harimoto for 2 points."

In addition, Watanabe said that he was concerned about Hirano's condition at the WTTC just after she had competed in the tough selection race for the Paris Olympics until the Zennihon Takkyu in January.

"She had a very hard and grueling competition until the Zennihon Takkyu, and then there was the T.League, then there was a training camp, and then the WTTC, which I felt for her. Is it really possible to get it going emotionally? That was what I was most worried about. However, despite these concerns, Hirano always practiced with the members of the Kinoshita Group in 2 sessions, one in the morning and one in the afternoon. She had to take 1 break due to fatigue, but she really made a routine and practiced well, and started to feel better."

Hirano was wearing out her mind and body that much.

In the group stage of the qualifying round, it seemed difficult to find a rhythm in the match against players who usually had few opportunities to play against each other, such as Ashtari (Iran), who has long pips on backhand, and Alexandre (Brazil), a left-handed player who is a Paralympic medalist.

Hirano herself said that the first match was the toughest, "To be honest, the Zennihon Takkyu was too intense, and there were some parts where I couldn't transition much," and she recalled that "it was a match where I wasn't really sure what I was doing, whether I was connecting, controlling or aiming."

However, in the final against China, where she defeated Wang Yidi, she said, "I was able to play a match where I could see what I wanted to do objectively."


By the way, this is the 6th match between Hirano and Wang Yidi.

Most recently, Hirano won a 5-gamer at the Singapore Smash 2023, and Wang Yidi won in straight games at the WTTC 2023 Durban, and Hirano's win this time brought Hirano's H2H to 2-4.

The reason for this victory was that both players were good at backhand attacks.

"I'm good at backhand and my opponent is also good at backhand. And it's righty-versus-righty, so I was thinking about how to go about it. My opponent is good at playing fast, so I tried to play by varying the pace. I almost didn't lose there, and I think that put a lot of pressure on my opponent."

At the Paris Olympics, the first match will be the doubles. As a result, Hirano will focus on improving her world ranking, which will affect her Olympic seeding, as well as strengthening her doubles skills.

Next month, she will compete in the Singapore Smash (3/7-17) and WTT Champions Incheon (3/27-31), and is expected to participate in the Paris Olympics training camp scheduled to start in April.
 
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
Oct 2014
12,718
18,347
45,975
Read 17 reviews
9-2 h2h Vs Harimoto is not a fluke, this result today was not a fluke.
I think going forward at least in the short term; the results of their matchups would be based on WCQ's condition. If he's all gun blazing, super confident and has clarity of what he has to do. They'll just be overwhelmed in the 3rd/4th ball like you saw today and have seen many times in WCQ Vs TH matchups.

Hari has found a way to stay in the rally and win them. If he finds a way to stay on an equal footing in the opening exchanges; his winning rate may rise.

Felix still looks largely confused on what to do both in opening exchanges and the rallies. I'm not sure this is something he can solve in 4 months, but home crowd is a booster/downer that shouldn't be underestimated.
Beating someone you are 3 to 4 years younger than is pretty normal even If you are close to the same level. The issue is whether those are things that can be addressed as you get more experience and training or not. After all, Fan Zhendong had a far worse record vs Ma Long at the same time.

In this case though, he is struggling to read the serve and judge the length and it is letting it drop his overall level. If he can read it better, the matchup can flip significantly. Pushing long is not a real solution as he is currently executing it.
 
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Member
Jul 2019
420
247
857
Beating someone you are 3 to 4 years younger than is pretty normal even If you are close to the same level. The issue is whether those are things that can be addressed as you get more experience and training or not. After all, Fan Zhendong had a far worse record vs Ma Long at the same time.

In this case though, he is struggling to read the serve and judge the length and it is letting it drop his overall level. If he can read it better, the matchup can flip significantly. Pushing long is not a real solution as he is currently executing it.
Referencing FZD and ML is really interesting because virtually nobody that wants to make history wants to be FZD. And even Hari has mentioned in interviews that although ML became champion because he played well, he wants to blaze a trail like ZJK. A FZD and ML situation here will be WCQ winning majors here and there until he's in his 30s and as he ages, Hari/Felix starts winning. I mean a win is a win obviously; but for a thousand year talent, it's far from special. And we can't even predict the trajectory that Lin Shidong or Wen Ruibo might fly along.
The objective should be to win now and keep winning because the waves from the next generation are getting harder to repress.
 
  • Like
Reactions: NextLevel
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
May 2011
1,235
1,351
3,274
And the ELO system takes into account injury and inactivity? It takes into account stakes? Does it rate only ittf matches or does it rate matches outside the Ittf?

The ELO as a playing strength measuring system is usually designed to be more accurate at measuring playing strength, but it doesn't reward activity or measure stakes, which the ITTF system does a better job of doing. Seeding isn't entirely about strength, it also has performance under pressure elements built in as well as activity, and the points system do a better job reflecting this. In tennis, no one argues that because Djokovic who is #1 loses to Sinner who is #4 that the system is inaccurate. But when it happens in TT, the system is broken.

So did you put the player and team ELOs into some machine before deciding that Germany was below the other teams?
Your criticism of the ELO system is entirely valid, there are certainly deficiencies to an entirely ELO based system. But take tennis for example, this question has been studied before and ELO is more accurate than official rankings. I'll concede that Germany has a very good case as the #2 team though, with Qiu and Ovtcharov being two very highly rated ELO players. Clearly by either measure Chuang pulled off a big upset against Qiu which was instrumental in knocking them off of the podium.
 
  • Like
Reactions: NextLevel
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Member
Jul 2019
420
247
857
In this case though, he is struggling to read the serve and judge the length and it is letting it drop his overall level. If he can read it better, the matchup can flip significantly. Pushing long is not a real solution as he is currently executing it.
Yeah he's struggling to read the serves, a lot of the receives are not even long, they're half long but they come off the table and in Ma Long like fashion, WCQ's ready to pounce on it with little regard to the backspin. Also on Felix's serves, he found it difficult to combat the Chiquita.

In the rallies, he somehow wasn't able to use his RPB to dictate the rhythm as he did against LYJ, so his issues were multifaceted today. But it all starts from the first 3 boards.
 
  • Like
Reactions: NextLevel
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
Oct 2014
12,718
18,347
45,975
Read 17 reviews
Your criticism of the ELO system is entirely valid, there are certainly deficiencies to an entirely ELO based system. But take tennis for example, this question has been studied before and ELO is more accurate than official rankings. I'll concede that Germany has a very good case as the #2 team though, with Qiu and Ovtcharov being two very highly rated ELO players. Clearly by either measure Chuang pulled off a big upset against Qiu which was instrumental in knocking them off of the podium.
Franziska is probably the only non-Chinese person to have beaten Ma Long, Fan Zhendong and Xu Xin. Also one of the top players in the TTBL (he and Jorgic lead Saarbrucken and it isn't clear who is ther #1). He is admittedly an underachiever of sorts. Regardless, his loss to Kao was a huge upset as well, though Kao is clearly growing as a player. Gauzy would likely lose to Franziska.

Germany are also the European Games champs and their second team (led by Boll and Duda) came second at the Euro Champs behind Sweden.

Doesn't mean you are wrong, again, just pointing out that these rankings are not useless just because they don't always predict as well as ELO. Sometimes they predict results that the ELO would not and these predictions are sometimes not discussed with equal attention.
 
This user has no status.
Congrats to China, an excellent win.
Role reversal for the Lebrun brothers, both in performance and temperament.
Except if you watch the end of Alexis match (on the full stream YT video), the announcer says "ahhh a bit of a negative reaction there from Lebrun...." after the handshakes, but they didn't show it. I wonder if he smashed his bat ;)
 
  • Like
Reactions: IB66
says toooooo much choice!!
says toooooo much choice!!
Well-Known Member
Jul 2020
1,795
1,257
4,558
Read 11 reviews
Except if you watch the end of Alexis match (on the full stream YT video), the announcer says "ahhh a bit of a negative reaction there from Lebrun...." after the handshakes, but they didn't show it. I wonder if he smashed his bat ;)
At least he didn't show much frustration during the match!!!
It was interesting to see the Chinese players showing some emotions during the Men's Semi Final !!! body language and facial expressions mainly.
 
says Shoo...nothing to see here. - zeio
says Shoo...nothing to see here. - zeio
Well-Known Member
Jan 2018
7,473
9,480
18,745
Lee Sangsu has beaten ML, FZD, XX, ZJK, LGY.
LSS: WTT CS Frankfurt 2023 was the last hurdle (FZD)...

5 times
LGY (first 4 encounters all went to LSS)
2 times
ML, XX (first encounter went to LSS)
1 time
ZJK, FZD
 
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
Sep 2013
7,602
6,810
16,547
Read 3 reviews
LSS: WTT CS Frankfurt 2023 was the last hurdle (FZD)...

5 times
LGY (first 4 encounters all went to LSS)
2 times
ML, XX (first encounter went to LSS)
1 time
ZJK, FZD
I think gone are the days that if you loose to foreigner, you will be punished,
as loosing to foreigners will become more and more common

The days of 3-0 in games and 3-0 in match, and winning championships without dropping a game is over
 
  • Like
Reactions: IB66
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
Oct 2014
12,718
18,347
45,975
Read 17 reviews
I think gone are the days that if you loose to foreigner, you will be punished,
as loosing to foreigners will become more and more common

The days of 3-0 in games and 3-0 in match, and winning championships without dropping a game is over
Lin Shidong/Ruibo Wen: Hold my beer....

More seriously though, that has always been tough and was likely over with the ML, XX and FZD era.
 
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
Sep 2013
7,602
6,810
16,547
Read 3 reviews
Lin Shidong/Ruibo Wen: Hold my beer....

More seriously though, that has always been tough and was likely over with the ML, XX and FZD era.
waiting and see

Out of WCQ's generation, he is basically the only one to stay.
LSD and WRB being 18 and 17 would likely move up to the teams 5 soon, or atleast we know Ma Long's spot will have an opening.

IMO, I would of taken LSD instead of one of the 27/28 year bench warmers
 
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
Oct 2014
12,718
18,347
45,975
Read 17 reviews
waiting and see

Out of WCQ's generation, he is basically the only one to stay.
LSD and WRB being 18 and 17 would likely move up to the teams 5 soon, or atleast we know Ma Long's spot will have an opening.

IMO, I would of taken LSD instead of one of the 27/28 year bench warmers
I think he has humility issues they are working through. But he is also likely in Korea, without knowing, I would place more money on him being a practice partner than the alternative.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Tony's Table Tennis
This user has no status.
I think he has humility issues they are working through. But he is also likely in Korea, without knowing, I would place more money on him being a practice partner than the alternative.
I have seen LSD, ZQH and Xue Fei in practice videos. Xu Xin was in Busan too.
 
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
Oct 2014
12,718
18,347
45,975
Read 17 reviews
I have seen LSD, ZQH and Xue Fei in practice videos. Xu Xin was in Busan too.
The difference between CNT investment and normal countries lol. For CNT, even past coaches are available in various capacities for pep talk in stressful situations lol!
 
  • Haha
Reactions: Tony's Table Tennis
Top