Using D05 for a week, it too fast and hard to control... how to use it ?

[Tony's Table Tennis]

I played TT 20+ years , and I still can't play good with D05, too many errors. Maybe my skill sucks. Vis for beginners is OK, but D05, meh I don't think so.

dont' worry, I gave up after 2 hours of usage.
my skills sucks more.

 

[ben1229]

Pro,=be able to request sponge,and rubber hardness, thickness. That's the difference . All pro equipment are from commercial base model. Just modified.

 

[NDH]

It is different, just most amateurs can't distinguish it

That's a really easy comment to make online with no supporting evidence though (which is my point).

It isn't only my friends experience of using various European pros equipment, but I also know of other "lesser known pros", who used or was gifted rubbers from top pros, and all commented that, the pro's one felt so much better.

I think I struggle to really understand the methods behind it all - Unless there is some significant cost barrier (for the manufacturer), why not make the "best" rubbers available to all?

Surely the increased profit/market dominance would be the goal, rather than producing a small batch for a Pro.

Unless there was certain characteristics in the Pro rubber that didn't translate well to the mass market?

It'll always be a hard one for me to trust, because the reports are all 2nd and 3rd hand accounts of what people think (with no source being particularly specific).

Whilst there may well be subtle differences, I'd love to see and feel just how obvious these differences are in person.

Comparing my forehand loop with D09C and Timo's forehand loop with D09C just isn't a fair comparison...... For Timo! 😂😂

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

I think I struggle to really understand the methods behind it all - Unless there is some significant cost barrier (for the manufacturer), why not make the "best" rubbers available to all?

Surely the increased profit/market dominance would be the goal, rather than producing a small batch for a Pro.

Unless there was certain characteristics in the Pro rubber that didn't translate well to the mass market?

It'll always be a hard one for me to trust, because the reports are all 2nd and 3rd hand accounts of what people think (with no source being particularly specific).

Whilst there may well be subtle differences, I'd love to see and feel just how obvious these differences are in person.

Comparing my forehand loop with D09C and Timo's forehand loop with D09C just isn't a fair comparison...... For Timo! 😂😂

I think you raise very valid questions.

D05 for example, Butterfly said, they made this for highly skilled players, then we have people here saying its okay for amateurs.
You just can't define what is "okay", since you mentioned, everyone's context is different.
Why doesn't CNT players all use the same special edition, and each player have customized to minute figures? ie 41.5 vs 41 degree or 42 vs 42.5 degrees

So, from a business stand point, I think Butterfly made the spec they think is okay for the masses and classify them accordingly to what they feel is appropriate, and the masses are the ones that are "delusional" at times (but this is some other subject to Pro stuff, but closer towards this thread, haha)

Tenergy 05 Hard, I felt was in that direction of what you said.
Pro version became retail spec

 

[Lowday20298]

At least for H3, pro version has 41.5 degree.... But the pro version doesn't mean better, just means more specific and maybe with more precise manufacture process.

Of course the quality will be top notch, some would be harder and maybe they give differently processed sheets to players depending on their preferences. Regarding boosters and whatnot.

 

[ben1229]

If you wonder how the pro equipment play, why not buy one and try? Then you will know the difference, there are a lot of pro equipment on the market. Try it and tell us the story.

 

[jammmail]

That's a really easy comment to make online with no supporting evidence though (which is my point).



I think I struggle to really understand the methods behind it all - Unless there is some significant cost barrier (for the manufacturer), why not make the "best" rubbers available to all?

Surely the increased profit/market dominance would be the goal, rather than producing a small batch for a Pro.

Unless there was certain characteristics in the Pro rubber that didn't translate well to the mass market?

It'll always be a hard one for me to trust, because the reports are all 2nd and 3rd hand accounts of what people think (with no source being particularly specific).

Whilst there may well be subtle differences, I'd love to see and feel just how obvious these differences are in person.

Comparing my forehand loop with D09C and Timo's forehand loop with D09C just isn't a fair comparison...... For Timo! 😂😂

Intrestingly Iba Diaw posted a gluing video - in the comments section he replies to someone talking about his rubbers. He replies saying "Can you buy the same racket as Djokovic or the same club as Tiger Woods ?"

https://youtu.be/wiZm_DfdBq4?si=CFfCgfrz1UNk2dD4

A couple of things. though:
Is the glue green - it looks weird?
He also used loads of glue on the blade. He also said he leaves it for 3 hours before putting the rubber on the blade - wow never left it that long.

 

[NDH]

Intrestingly Iba Diaw posted a gluing video - in the comments section he replies to someone talking about his rubbers. He replies saying "Can you buy the same racket as Djokovic or the same club as Tiger Woods ?"

A couple of things. though:
Is the glue green - it looks weird?
He also used loads of glue on the blade. He also said he leaves it for 3 hours before putting the rubber on the blade - wow never left it that long.

This is part of the problem - All these little comments which makes it seem like pro's are using magical unicorn based equipment that is so incredibly different from what us mere mortals can get.....

It may be different.... But who knows how much.

Is the glue green - it looks weird?

I think it's white, but WOW..... That man loves glue.

Not surprising he needs to leave it for 3 hours to be honest 😂

 

[jammmail]

This is part of the problem - All these little comments which makes it seem like pro's are using magical unicorn based equipment that is so incredibly different from what us mere mortals can get.....

It may be different.... But who knows how much.



I think it's white, but WOW..... That man loves glue.

Not surprising he needs to leave it for 3 hours to be honest 😂

Exactly - personally I think its very fine nuances. And impossible to know really. Unless you actually know Timo 🙃

Its funny, hes saying you only need a bit on the blade, whilst putting so much on it looks like he's decorating a wall!

 

[Der_Echte]

I play at a much higher level given what age i started and my age and all that... and I have always said i was not good enough to use T05 (except way back when they made the sponge softer in base T05)...

... and I frequently say that I am not good enough to use 05D or 09C Diginiski properly.

One needs a different swing and impact to get the ball in the right place on the rubber/sponge with either and I never have this impact except on one kind of swing... which I do not use much.

The consideration for equipment selection, rubber specifically given you have an appropriate blade you like is to get a rubber that makes it EASIER to perform the shots that count the most to you that contribute the most to opening the rally, keeping even or get advantage in rally, and to finish.

This is something unique to each player.

What I frequently see (and then drink beers and talk negatively about it on the forum) is that players want a rubber that makes it easier to do something they never did before... which is often counter vs a strong incoming ball to make an uber fast counter (which often misses, but what the heck - that one was a screamer!) and the feeling of that is the hook for them to buy.

Plyers do this with blades too.

I have the most inexpensive blade and rubber that could be reasonably played at the advanced amateur level and the entire bat costs less than a sheet of the beloved Diginiski... and my Aurus rubbers are good for 250-500 hours of play... are not very spin reactive and allow me to make heavy spin pon ALL speeds of looping, particularly slow/heavy.

This bat is also very appropriate for a beginning learner as it is important to feel the ball and make it easier to topspin in all shot situations.

It isn't 100 out of 100 on ANY kind of shot... but this setup is 96 or 97 out of 100 in making it easy to do any shot... and that should be a goal for equipment selection.

Maybe a player gets to the top 5% of all players around them and is ready to handle a faster rebounding stronger rebounding rubber or blade... great and good for them if they discover that.

Most players make horrible mistakes in selecting equipment... but that is good too as it is a learning experience... but often it takes 10 years plus for many to discover it.

 

[Tyce]

I think the gigantic selection of equipment possibilities with vague stats, glue made from unicorn tears and rubber that's been ritually trampled upon by wood trolls during a new moon to get it softer are a destructive factor as to why this sport isn't bigger.
... Only for the Pros to play with even other equipment that is falsely labeled to be something commercially available.

These forums, as well as many other stories, tell many examples of people who are disheartened by the game, while in fact it's their ill selected gear which is holding them back. I know a handful of these stories personally, people who just gave up on the sport because they were unable to play with this premium gear.

Most golfers could handle Tiger Woods' driver. Same goes for Djoko's tennis racket, or running in those godawful Nike Vaporfly shoes. It won't screw up your basic technique, just burn a lot of money.
Table tennis is different, and the pure jungle of equipment makes people get inappropriate gear, and eventually makes some of them quit.

 

[_ak]

I am always wondering if it is the rubbers or the player that is breaking in, .......or both 😁

Pros hire semi-pros to break their rubbers in 🤣

 

[lodro]

I think the gigantic selection of equipment possibilities with vague stats, glue made from unicorn tears and rubber that's been ritually trampled upon by wood trolls during a new moon to get it softer are a destructive factor as to why this sport isn't bigger.
... Only for the Pros to play with even other equipment that is falsely labeled to be something commercially available.

These forums, as well as many other stories, tell many examples of people who are disheartened by the game, while in fact it's their ill selected gear which is holding them back. I know a handful of these stories personally, people who just gave up on the sport because they were unable to play with this premium gear.

Most golfers could handle Tiger Woods' driver. Same goes for Djoko's tennis racket, or running in those godawful Nike Vaporfly shoes. It won't screw up your basic technique, just burn a lot of money.
Table tennis is different, and the pure jungle of equipment makes people get inappropriate gear, and eventually makes some of them quit.

I think this is a fair comment .
I remember years ago saying to some of my fellow players that there is no blade or rubber in this world that will make me a better player. Always knowing and firmly believing it, I have since spend quite a bit of money and time to experiment with many different rubbers and and blades. I enjoy doing that. I think with my attitude I can't go wrong but if one really thinks that there is a blade /rubber combo out there that is going to lift one to the high level of TT-play , one is definitely doomed to fail.

 

[Der_Echte]

lodro, I hear you... equipment itself will not anyone better...

...BUT... IF... you were using equipment way to fast rebound and hard for what you do... THEN you switch to equipment appropriate for what you do that makes it easier to do the shots you do... then you DO become better from equipment.

just not from equipment, but a change from inappropriate to appropriate.

I train people for free when I visit Churches... some players have used way too fast or stiff or whatever equipment and use my bat in my sig and are WOW, I can feel the ball, it goes in, and I can still hit hard. WOW. happens a lot since many players end up with inappropriate equipment and the joker fanboyz on forums are encouraging it. FINE, we respect freedom of speech, but a player needs to develop discernment over time.

 

[Tyce]

I also feel fragmentation of knowledge is part of the problem. If every trainer/coach got taught the absolute basics on what level of player corresponds to which gear (and please, not only for their sponsored brands!) and every club had access to certified trainers, you wouldn't get the situation where a trainer doesn't want to advise on gear and/or the player will think they know much better.
Next step in this problem is transparency. All brands use their own metrics (if any) and all rubbers are "very good in speed and control and provide the ultimate spin sensation".
I can actually see a spot in the market for a new TT brand that simply labels their products for what they are...