The jurassic man in action

[NextLevel]

Well, go to a club and play better players. Ranked players. League players. Plenty of the stuff you are saying is similar to what many basement players who have never been to a club say, just with more sophistication.

One of the reasons I went to a clubs to train and become better was because I knew there was a real gap between players like me and players who played at clubs in tournaments, even at the lowest level. You may be beyond that level, but it is quite likely you are also overestimating how far beyond that level you are unless you have at least one player who plays tournaments on a regular basis that you play against.

We get the odd person who comes to my club and plays a nice guy who is lofting the ball to them and says the are 1600 )(this was when I was 1600). I would then proceed to give them an education on how a 1600 player players by beating them at scores close to zero. Unfortunately, I think my approach was a bit harsh.

One of my co-workers once said that he didn't remember losing to anyone in table tennis and he wanted to play me. So I invited him over to my club. We played maybe about 20 games or more. I didn't even change into my gear and then I didn't wear the knee braces that I should have worn to protect my knees. I ended up playing in work shoes and work pants. He didn't win a game. I was already about 1950-2050 at this time just with worse serves and strokes. Now this guy was really good, IMO, for what he was, and I think he could have given other players in my club even in the 1500 range issues, because he knew how to play fairly well with dead paddles. But even he didn't realize what was involved in club play and after seeing how I spun him off the table, he became afraid of playing with weaker players who hit the ball harder (he fell for the illusion of table tennis thinking that the people who hit the ball harder are the better players) and didn't play anyone else.

So go to a club/league and see how you shape up.

 

[Archosaurus]

A sound idea.

Only thing is, the closest actual table tennis club that actually has players in it is in the capital city, which would be a fairly expensive trip for me, and I wouldn't even be let in to play unless I'm a member, I would need to show up at 6PM to a session and I would need to have a friend with me, because club rules everywhere specifically state that you will NOT acquire a partner by asking someone to play.

Let's just say that table tennis in Finland is nearly nonexistent after the 80's.

I'm still looking, though. Maybe there's some place that offers coaching and I just haven't found it, for example.


How did you guys find your regular club? Living in the city or not?

EDIT: There is a pretty high level in tabletennis in the country, though. It's not completely dead.

Just a bit, let's say, hard to access. Finding any kind of information is really hard, and I'm a native speaker too!

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

What I do as a profession is called "teaching yoga". I was explaining to a client today that it is not always an accurate description. But there isn't a description that gets at what I actually do when I work with people.

I am creative. I improvise while working. I use any tool at my disposal to help whoever I am working with. A client I saw earlier today, when I told her that I often have no idea what I will do and how I will work with a person until I see them, was a little surprised a few weeks ago when I told her that. Today she saw exactly why I want to be open to figuring out on the fly what a person needs: open to improvising.

In the middle of what we were doing, something came up for her and I immediately changed what we were doing and had her do a few different things to help her lower back and her shoulder. They worked. The back and shoulder pain that she started with were much, MUCH better when we were done. She had been cross country skiing and there were a few extra kinks from how she normally is. But once I saw what was going on it was easy to change gears and help her feel better.

When I work with someone, I also don't care what they think the root cause for a problem is. Like if someone was sitting too long or felt a twinge while showering, or if they have some odd theory about what is going on. Sometimes straightforward, specific info like, "I have bulging disks in L-4 and L-5," or "when I sit for extended periods, my back starts bothering me," I can use that info and know a bunch of things to have the person try. But I still have to have them try things to see what helps and what doesn't. When I see someone doing something in a way that is causing their back to tense up, I have to get them to change how they are doing the movement ASAP so they don't make things worse.

I am happy if my clients have no idea how often I have saved them or their bad back from bad mechanics and dysfunctional movement patterns.

All I care about is that what ever is wrong gets better. It makes me very effective in my work.

If I don't see the process and I don't see the before and after and your technique improves, I will still be happy.

And being a movement analyst, I do have a feeling that, if you see footage of the FH stroke from the front, you will better see a couple of things that will help you tweek your form so that you improve.


Sent from Deep Space by Abacus

 

[Der_Echte]

I have to choose between haircut and food, and I think I will choose food.

I had to choose between Bread + Water ... or... Bread + Water

I chose Bread and Water. I figured if the hair got to where I couldn't see, I could use the scissors at school to fix it enough to see.

 

[yuri.saldon]

In São Paulo we have much more clubs than I expected, mainly because the japanese immigration three generations ago.
But club it's not that nearly at my home, actually I spend 1 hour on the traject.


Sent from my 2014819 using Tapatalk

 

[Der_Echte]

The best players I know are often the most humble about their skillz (that is spelled Der_Echte style). We all make mistakes. So, I don't hold things against people long term. But it would be nice if you did get over yourself sooner rather than later.

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I don't know if anyone can spell humble and Der_Echte in the same sentence and attempt to keep a straight face for more than a few seconds. I don't think anyone will accuse me of that word. I do, however, have this habit of under-rating my game play to grease the skids to make it easier to setup and finish off Chicken & Beer Bets.

Must be something from my young/hungry days I had at Arch's age.

 

[Archosaurus]

Carl, I get your point. The next time I do a "private session" with my friend, I'll see if I can get an angle. If there's something worth showing, I'll show it, too.

Right now, my main priority is to fix my forehand contact, and at the same time work on actually moving in game like I do in drills, because I know I can make it a habit, even if it means I'll be at the ball before it even hits my side.

The good thing about a technique sport like this is that you can always learn no matter who you're playing.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

This is more like real game footwork than most drills:

Random.


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[UpSideDownCarl]

Just bear in mind that my play in the video is not even half of what I can normally do.

I've been thinking about this.

When I was in the circus I got to see lots of footage of myself and my teammates. It was a different sport I was doing. But certain things cross over. There were many times I was filmed while I was riding drunk or stoned and I skated like crap. But the technique was approximately 95% the same. Strength, power, accuracy, timing wasn't the same. But the technique wasn't what varied that much. There were a few times where I rode on multiple days of 3 hours of sleep. After 2-3 days in a row like that, you really can't launch and fly the same way as when you are well rested. But it still was strength, timing and execution that was the issue. Not technique.

There have been many times when I played TT on way too little sleep after a really long day of work. Same thing. Even though I didn't see the footage. I may have been playing bad. But I am pretty sure the mechanics did not change that much. But my strength, timing and execution were in the trash can.

We are probably still looking at the basic technique you have even if the execution is not as good as it would be if you were in top form.

But the nice thing here is, now you have a reason to be motivated to get some better footage of yourself.


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[Archosaurus]

I've been thinking about this.

When I was in the circus I got to see lots of footage of myself and my teammates. It was a different sport I was doing. But certain things cross over. There were many times I was filmed while I was riding drunk or stoned and I skated like crap. But the technique was approximately 95% the same. Strength, power, accuracy, timing wasn't the same. But the technique wasn't what varied that much. There were a few times where I rode on multiple days of 3 hours of sleep. After 2-3 days in a row like that, you really can't launch and fly the same way as when you are well rested. But it still was strength, timing and execution that was the issue. Not technique.

There have been many times when I played TT on way too little sleep after a really long day of work. Same thing. Even though I didn't see the footage. I may have been playing bad. But I am pretty sure the mechanics did not change that much. But my strength, timing and execution were in the trash can.

We are probably still looking at the basic technique you have even if the execution is not as good as it would be if you were in top form.

But the nice thing here is, now you have a reason to be motivated to get some better footage of yourself.


Sent from Deep Space by Abacus

That's a valid point, but we need to remember that the basis for all strokes is footwork and positioning. Proper footwork requires positive muscle use and fast movements.

It's a bit tiring compared to just walking around with short steps, so if you don't have it a habit to always move like that, you will just get lazy and drag feet if you're too tired to do the proper movements.

Most people here, except the actually good players, also like to play on the table, mostly due to lack of great power or spin on their strokes, even if they have sensible footwork.

It's really easy to just stay at the table and win with better serves, blocking all their power strokes and having better strokes overall.

This is not anything like playing against someone who actually knows what they're doing, because the good players who stay at the table will most likely just hit through me if I let them.

So the "play with actually good players" advice rings true in this regard, too. The game changes a lot when anyone can pressure you away from the table. I get a bit too much slack sometimes.

 

[Shuki]

I can only recommend not hitting so hard. When you're not doing a game and have someone willing to do forehands with you. Start off with both of you blocking, get 100 balls on the table. Then move on to counterhitting or allowing one player to loop and the other to block. In this video you're just smacking it hard at him over and over again.

Now I can't see where the ball is going, but I can see your contact, and I can tell that it's not in the same spot every time. This is making it quite difficult for your opponent to give you more balls to hit. ESPECIALLY if this opponent is worse than you, like you said.

you said this isn't even half of the quality of shots you can usually give. I feel sorry for the soul who would have to block a 100% shot from you just to allow you to warm up.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

My form was like yours half a year or so ago, but I trained intensely and made sure my mechanics are solid and I am essentially always doing the same stroke with as little variation as possible. You should as well.

And in light of the footage, statements like this start to sound totally ridiculous.


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[Archosaurus]

I can only recommend not hitting so hard. When you're not doing a game and have someone willing to do forehands with you. Start off with both of you blocking, get 100 balls on the table. Then move on to counterhitting or allowing one player to loop and the other to block. In this video you're just smacking it hard at him over and over again.

Now I can't see where the ball is going, but I can see your contact, and I can tell that it's not in the same spot every time. This is making it quite difficult for your opponent to give you more balls to hit. ESPECIALLY if this opponent is worse than you, like you said.

you said this isn't even half of the quality of shots you can usually give. I feel sorry for the soul who would have to block a 100% shot from you just to allow you to warm up.

This is at the end of the day when we just said "Eh whatever, just serve long and smack it". Usually he'd be doing some smacking too, but he was reeeaallyyy out of shape that day, worse than me or not.

Earlier, I wasn't hitting as hard and had a spinnier contact, and we were practicing blocking power shots. That'd make a better video.

He served, I pushed long and pretty high intentionally, he smacked it, preferably with spin, and I blocked. We alternated. To get a bit of a fell for attacking and blocking.

I was thinking about just challenging him to a counterhit competition and seeing how much we can do. I'm pretty consistent with easy shots like that, but I'd really have to help him play the same shot and get consistent with it.

I think that's his biggest fault currently. I can probably get at the minimum a hundred drives in the same 10cm2 square, but I don't know about him. So we're doing that next.


EDIT: Carl, stop digging up things to nitpick. I am a complete moron and know nothing of what I am talking about, and can't hit a forehand to save my life. There, can we now get back to the constructive talk. I appreciate Shuki giving me/us advice on how to improve.

 

[Shuki]

This is at the end of the day when we just said "Eh whatever, just serve long and smack it". Usually he'd be doing some smacking too, but he was reeeaallyyy out of shape that day, worse than me or not.

Earlier, I wasn't hitting as hard and had a spinnier contact, and we were practicing blocking power shots. That'd make a better video.

He served, I pushed long and pretty high intentionally, he smacked it, preferably with spin, and I blocked. We alternated. To get a bit of a fell for attacking and blocking.

I was thinking about just challenging him to a counterhit competition and seeing how much we can do. I'm pretty consistent with easy shots like that, but I'd really have to help him play the same shot and get consistent with it.

I think that's his biggest fault currently. I can probably get at the minimum a hundred drives in the same 10cm2 square, but I don't know about him. So we're doing that next.


EDIT: Carl, stop digging up things to nitpick. I am a complete moron and know nothing of what I am talking about, and can't hit a forehand to save my life. There, can we now get back to the constructive talk. I appreciate Shuki giving me/us advice on how to improve.

Okay hold on I'm about to show you a video of my coach fiddling around with a bad blocker and showing us why NOT to do what you were doing.

 

[Shuki]

Tiny background on this. Not her paddle, Actually a dead one, she's NEVER touched this paddle before. So don't blame equipment. Also sorry about not turning the phone sideways, I'm an idiot.

This is what happens when you have an opponent blocking shots too fast for them. It messes with both the good and the bad player.


Edit: usually when explaining strokes she likes to use my raquet, but it's lying there on the table while the other guy is blocking. Strokes don't need to be long to have power, all her power comes from the knees.

 

[Archosaurus]

Vertical filming, and the balls going everywhere. I'm trying to hold my cringe back.

I get the point. That's why I'm gonna work him up slowly.

He's more consistent than that, though. I can give him one or two big ones and he'll return them in the same wing in nearly the same spot. Quite high and they can be smacked again, but it's something. Although I think he's only able to do that because I make sure to always play a simple shot, and he's been playing with me for over a year and knows my style and all it's faults and strengths inside out. Occasionally he blocks one right off the bounce down the line and catches me off guard.

If I fade or hook at him though, he falls apart. So we gotta work on that consistency and ball control at a lower pace.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

To get a bit of a fell for attacking and blocking.

EDIT: Carl, stop digging up things to nitpick.

Ummm, my memory is you making lots of comments about how good you are. How much better you are than many people.

You even made a comment about how I spell on a smart phone. And yet you write:

"To get a bit of a fell for attacking...."

Sorry dude. Again it's the attitude I'm talking about.

You make statements that directly indicate you think your better than someone like Dr Paco and the video footage seems to show he is probably at least at your level.

And somehow you think it is okay to say shite about someone else's typos. But, well, I guess yours must be okay.

You do really just need to grow up.


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[Archosaurus]

Carl, do you always start drinking at this time or what? During the rest of the day, your feedback is helpful and I appreciate it, but during this time of the day, you don't add any kind of value.

Do like Shuki is doing now, or start your own thread titled "Archosaurus is an immature, egoistic whackoff" with a poll that has

"Is Archosaurus:

An idiot [ ]
Not an idiot [ ]
"

or post something productive.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Carl, do you always start drinking at this time or what? During the rest of the day, your feedback is helpful and I appreciate it, but during this time of the day, you don't add any kind of value.

Do like Shuki is doing now, or start your own thread titled "Archosaurus is an immature, egoistic whackoff" with a poll that has

"Is Archosaurus:

An idiot [ ]
Not an idiot [ ]
"

or post something productive.

The guy who makes comments about other people's spelling, who likes to insult people, doesn't like it when he has been called out for his BS?

Funny. And then he tries to tell people what they can and can't post!!!!

You opened the door with statements like: "my form was like yours half a year or so ago," or "your spelling..." In the real world you can't say nonsense like that without it coming back at you.


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[Shuki]

Carl, do you always start drinking at this time or what? During the rest of the day, your feedback is helpful and I appreciate it, but during this time of the day, you don't add any kind of value.

Do like Shuki is doing now, or start your own thread titled "Archosaurus is an immature, egoistic whackoff" with a poll that has

"Is Archosaurus:

An idiot [ ]
Not an idiot [ ]
"

or post something productive.

This is an odd post from you since you basically called me an idiot earlier today

I somehow knew that you'd say exactly this. To the word.

@UpSideDownCarl
@NextLevel
@NDH

Someone with something smart to say, get in here.

and now as soon as one of those smart people says something you don't like you're upset with them too?