Your ultimate setup...

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Well.....hasn't a lot happened....not what I intended when I asked the question but much more:)

I have to echo Shuki's comments about Carls post, I mean what more can you ask for, I think I'll print it out and keep it in my bag so I can refer to it when people talk about blades, it will make me seem knowledgeable :confused:

Maybe I'll ask him about rubbers...........

That does explain why people that try my bat always say its heavy though, guess that's the 7 ply and the max rubbers, I don't mind it, other peoples bats now feel light to me but it does also make me lean towards a 5 ply should I decide to change my blade in the future.

What this little discussion has also made me realise is that getting caught up the technicalities of science can confuse the basic fact that proper technique and commitment to your shots is as important as anything so I thank you all for that.

A good tradesman never blames his tools ;)
 
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My IF zlc actually feels somewhat slower than my TBS, althouh it could be atributed to the difference in the weight (85gr vs 92gr)

As someone that has carbon addiction but is still below 2000, imo innerforce will hit the spot for someone like me. the blade has a lot of feedback and easier short game, where ALC blade is particularly bad

Yeah. Similar speed category. Depending on the weight of each an IF ZLC could be faster or slower by a modest margin than a TBS. A 92 gram TBS would also feel better and be faster than an 85 gram TBS. Ditto on the IF ZLC.

Do you have any recommendations for a nice all-round blade for developing players? I probably already own it :p (Grubba, Innershield ZLF, Kim Kyung Ah, Liu Shiwen, Innerforce Layer Series, Garaydia Series, Timo boll w7, hadraw SK/SR, samsonov black edition, chen defender, victas matsush ita, xiom vega pro, ebenholz 7, waldner champion 89, timo boll t5000, xiom axelo, xiom aigis, balsa carbo x5, mazunov, joo se hyuk, rossi emotion, etc...)

Here are blades I would recommend for someone who is an advanced-intermediate or lower level player. These blades would be pretty decent for anyone who is lower level than semi-pro (in no particular order):

1) Nittaku Acoustic
2) Nittaku Violin
3) OSP Virtioso Off-
4) OSP Virtuoso Plus
5) Nexy Peter Pan
6) Stiga Allround Evolution
7) Tibhar Stratus Power Wood
8) Yasaka Sweden Extra
9) Stiga Offensive Classic
10) Stiga Tube Allround
11) Xiom Offensive S
12) Tibhar Kim Jung Hoon (it is actually a 7 ply but plays like a 5 ply and has similar flex to a decent 5 ply)

As far as I can see, none of these were on your list and most of the blades on your list were 7 ply and/or carbon.

The advantage of a 5 ply all wood blade with decent flex, good dwell time, and a decent amount of feeling can only be assessed when you have used one for a few months without using other blades, AND THEN you take a few knocks with a carbon blade. I can't explain it so easily. But you would understand if you did that experiment.

Maybe I'll ask him about rubbers...........

I have to be honest, these days I don't know much about rubbers except what I like, and a few less expensive options that are good for people learning to looping and using their first tensor type rubber.

NextLevel and AndySmith are the man, or men, when it comes to up to date info on equipment.

The rubbers I like these days are T05 and MXP/FXP. ELS sounds like it may be worth a try for BH but I would still probably like the extra catapult of FXP better. Can't tell unless I try. But, to me it is not important. What I have works. [emoji2]

That does explain why people that try my bat always say its heavy though, guess that's the 7 ply and the max rubbers, I don't mind it, other peoples bats now feel light to me but it does also make me lean towards a 5 ply should I decide to change my blade in the future.

I have to be honest, I love blades that have a little extra weight and inertia behind them. My blade is a 5 ply that weighs about 91 grams. There is still a value to the thinner blade with the extra flex even if you got one that was a similar weight to a 7 ply blade.

What this little discussion has also made me realise is that getting caught up the technicalities of science can confuse the basic fact that proper technique and commitment to your shots is as important as anything so I thank you all for that.

Yeah, in this case technology, for a player refining and developing touch, feel and the technique to spin the ball HEAVY, can actually hinder progress.

It is worth knowing that EVERY offensive player in the top 100 in the world would be pretty okay with any of the blades on my list. In fact, back in 2007-2009 Ma Long used a Nittaku Acoustic. If you watch footage from back then, his shots were faster but they had less spin. His technique has improved. But he still would be fine with that blade he used to use.

In 2005 8 of the top 10 used all wood blades. Today 9 out of 10 use a composite blade like an ALC. But they all could use all wood still.

However, many intermediate players get the kind of blade that guys in the top tier use without knowing it hinders their progress.

A 5 ply, all wood blade, like one of the ones I am talking about, would be a worthwhile switch for upwards of 90% of all TTDaily members. Even some of the guys who are in the elite player level would still benefit from the higher spin/speed ratio and the ability to place the ball with higher angles while maintaining placement and control.



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When I was first learning about blades and wood, this page helped me a lot.

http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=7194

One thing you see is that there are so many blades with very similar ply constructions. Often small changes in thickness of plies and gluing process change how the blade plays.

But when you try different blades and look at the woods used for them, you start knowing better what feels best to you and/or what works best for you: which are often not the same thing.

There are lots of blades, as I was beginning, that felt AWESOME to me but definitely hindered my skill level and development. Often what feels best to your brain is not exactly what you want. Especially if you tend to like blasting the heck out of the ball without putting too much spin on it.


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So I think I mentioned in another post I do have a Stiga Tube Offensive blade 5ply but am using A Donic Persson Powerplay 7 ply, I'm thinkin there wouldn't be a great deal of difference between these blades and you'd probably suggest trying them both with the same rubbers to get a genuine feel for them?.?

The Donic weighs 94g and the Stiga 86g.

The OSP Virtuoso you talk about does look a lovely blade but having done a few searches seems pretty hard to get hold of from UK stockists.
 
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Somehow a Tube Allround is WAY better than a Tube Offensive. Tube Offensive a little too thick and blocky. But it would feel crisper and a little more alive. But 85 grams is a really light Tube Offensive. It may feel hollow and sort of like vanilla if that is the case. It is worth trying it. But the Offensive is not the same as the Allround.

OSP: they make those blades custom to order. So it is worth going to the OSP website and ordering for them to build it for you.

When you order you can choose handle, blade face size/shape (they offer 3 options) and I have always specified the weight I want. Those blades feel better in the heavier range of eight possibilities. So if you asked for a Virtuoso Off- or Plus, I would ask for it to be about 88-90 grams. It won't feel as heavy as that sounds because the handle is decently solid.


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Well that is exactly how I found the Tube Offensive, tinny and hollow, but when I used it some years ago I had some strange 729 rubbers on it and just used to blast everything.

Oh I see about OSP, I found their website, they do look lovely indeed.

Unfortunately that brings up more questions that I have never really considered, what handle shape is best for me, size and shape??

Pretty sure I like the heavier blade as the Powerplay is pretty heavy and I am used to that now.
 
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The Power Play is really a pretty good blade. It is close enough in performance to anything for me to restate, "there is no need to change it."

That being said, for me, my Virtuoso Off- and Plus are pretty amazing. I would say they are worth it. Based on what you are using, I would say to try a V+ if you try one.

I would also let you know, I have 4 blades from OSP. Every single one of them, felt really weird for the first few days of training.

I have made the assumption that it was the fact that they were just built, glued and the wood was truly fresh off the cutting board. Whereas, with a mass produced blade, they sit on a shelf for a long time before they are distributed and sold.

I am not sure I am right that that is the reason. But, I will stick with it until I know otherwise.

When I first used each of them, the felt bizarre, springy, like a trampoline, too much feeling, so springy and reactive that I thought, with the 1st one: "Oh, no! This was a mistake!" Then within a few days the blade broke in or settled in or something and began feeling great. The right amount of feeling and control.

With the 2nd one I was not as surprised by the weirdness of the first few days of training before it broke in. And with the 3rd and 4th one I was prepared.

But all the blades on that list are really excellent.

As far as handles: I am not fussy about handles. I like flared. I used to like anatomic but I feel I get more hand relaxed manipulation of the blade with a flare. I don't like straight handles. But it all comes down to personal preference.

I am mostly holding with my index finger and thumb while the middle, ring and pinky fingers barely wrap so my grip is very relaxed. I got this idea from a woman who is in the Olympics as we speak for USA: Jennifer Wu (I think her Chinese name is Wu Yue). But there are lots of people on this forum like TT Monster, NextLevel, Der_Echte....etc who describe something that sounds similar to what I just described, but with different words.

In any case, the flared handle from OSP is, hands down my favorite handle EVER. To me it is a perfect handle. Not too thin. Not too thick. I feel like Goldie Lox and The Three Bears, I mean, three million blade handles. Hahaha.

So, look at the handles and decide which you want. I am sure they are all good even though I know I like flared.


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Got the perfect setup right here!! :D

IMG_20160806_131824.jpgIMG_20160806_131909.jpgIMG_20160806_131902.jpgIMG_20160809_210240.jpg
 
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@USDCarl, would you add the Yinhe W6 (a 5 ply) to your list? Yinhe has great build quality and pricing that often can't be beat...

It is a pretty nice blade. Less expensive than all the ones on my list. Close enough to as good that it could be added. Definitely a great value. Good feeling. The Yinhe 896 is also a great value. Not as good as the W6 but less than half the price, and that means less than half the price of a blade that is already a bargain. And the 896 is still pretty darn good.

I could play with either of those Yinhe blades and not look back. But the W6 is definitely the better of the two. :)
 
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Nice:cool:

So who can sum up the ideal characteristics of a player who would benefit from using Tenergy 05?

Anyone who can handle the rubber and who has decent loop technique. If you have a real, legitimate loop and you can handle short game and receive of serve with Tenergy, it is an amazing rubber to use.

If you hit more flat and are learning how to spin but have not got the touch of loop contact yet, there are plenty of rubbers that would save you a lot of money and be fine for you. It isn't until you have control of good brush contact that Tenergy starts being useful for your game.
 
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I tried out the 2mm M2 on my forehand today, got to say not a massive difference to the M3 max but definitely different. More feel on the rare chop that I do, slightly more control on serve returns and definitely more speed on drives, especially when everything else is in place, and that rubber was fitted this morning, I can only hope it's going to improve and feel more comfortable than it already does.
 
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Shuki says good things about T05 and he is of course right. However, that isn't the only rubber that can spin close to the table.

Anyone who has played on the other end will tell you that it is possible to spin with an 8 dollar rubber or a 80 dollar one.

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I can play nearly same level with any Nexy blade in the lineup 5 ply 7 ply carbon whatever.

Only one I can't hang with is Akrasia... winner of tt forum Worlds fastest blade challenge.

Favorite is KJH... but what the heck... any of my blades and same rubber combo in my signature I play the same level.

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Shuki says good things about T05 and he is of course right. However, that isn't the only rubber that can spin close to the table.

Anyone who has played on the other end will tell you that it is possible to spin with an 8 dollar rubber or a 80 dollar one.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

Without question, Der_Echte can get more spin with an $8.00 rubber on his BH (Dawei 2008XP) than many people can get with Tenergy.


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The Power Play is really a pretty good blade. It is close enough in performance to anything for me to restate, "there is no need to change it."

That being said, for me, my Virtuoso Off- and Plus are pretty amazing. I would say they are worth it. Based on what you are using, I would say to try a V+ if you try one.

I would also let you know, I have 4 blades from OSP. Every single one of them, felt really weird for the first few days of training.

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When I tried out Carl's V+, it must have been aired out and broken in. I did 25 FH and BH loops with the V+ decked with MX-P each side... felt like I missed 1-2 loops out of the 50, it must have been broken in pretty damned good, PP Holic was blocking and it was difficult for him to kep it on the table, dude is my level or better.
 
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