[LHTT #55_KOR Coach Lesson] Forehand Topspin against Backspin

says 2023 Certified Organ Donor
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Dude,

You are looping like Next Level... using almost zero hip explosion or zero use of leg lift to start the kinetic energy. Next Level loops like that because his hip and knees are all worn out and he cannot physically explode there more than a few times without it killing him. However, he knows how to time his movement and amplify it, so it doesn't kill him using mostly arm.

You should be able to consistently apply 70-80 percent power on that shot, which requires some good power at impact to land that fast shot with some good spin. You are not getting nearly enough power transferred to the ball and there are reasons for it. (inefficiencies - no legs, no hips, bad control of impact zone... all those make transferring power inefficient)

You are also doing the typical Korean "Speed Drive" vs underspin... which in English speaking TT we call a "Fast Loop" where you do a powerful swing and make the ball go real fast with good spin. For anyone demanding why OP isn't doing a slow loop heavy spin, coaches have players to mostly this loop until they get much better. Koreans like to hit the ball hard and teach that style early. Please - no one give OP a hard time about not doing medium or slow heavy loop vs that ball.

You are on average generating only 50-60 percent of your potential power. You are using mostly your arm snap with a pull from your shoulder... you do thousands of those and your shoulder will get tore up eventually. You are not using any hip explosion... not even a "Short Hip" you are not exploding upwards with your legs to start the energy.

You are dipping sown some on backswing prep, (I see your hip level gets below table - GOOD) but I see your hip level staying same level below table on impact consistently - REAL BAD. Your legs and hips never raise up even a cm. Look at the vid yourself again. You get top of hips several cm below table level, you swing and hit ball... hips are exactly same height as your prep phase...

This is making you compensate with other areas of your body... eventually, looping like this will tear you up if you do it high power repeatedly. You are all wore out at 3:30 I see that you overusing your arm and shoulder is not helping you. If you used legs and hips to go with your arm power... overall it would be much easier on your body.

You should be exploding upwards with legs and forward short hip explosion and letting the arm do its thing. That gets you 70% power and that will make a good fast loop. If you "pull the ripcord" (use your free hand and keep it loose and pull your arm towards you like you are pulling a rip cord to start an engine) you will get that extra 10% power (from shoulder rotation) to get that nice 80% power... which can be a damned fast shot with good spin when you strike it in the right part of the impact zone.

I usually do not write technical advice for you on your video threads, I normally comment about aspects of Korean clubs or coaches in your threads when I do comment.

What observations I see, I write it for you and for others to see... such a thing is a common problem with amateurs.

At this stage of you development... if I play a match vs you, I would give you underspin to your FH and INVITE you to fast loop it... you would miss more than 50% of them and I would have low risk and win easy. A Div 5 player or Hope Div player could use that tactic against you until you stop doing that in a match.

When I get back to Korea, I plan on taking a tour of most of the ex-pro clubs down there in that are south of Seoul (KTS, RSM, KJH) (also coach Yoo's Long Pip training club in Yong-In)

If I see that coach, I will kindly ask her to give you an extra hard time about that (lack of using legs/hips) as a professional courtesy trouble making mission thing.
 
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Dude,

You are looping like Next Level... using almost zero hip explosion or zero use of leg lift to start the kinetic energy. Next Level loops like that because his hip and knees are all worn out and he cannot physically explode there more than a few times without it killing him. However, he knows how to time his movement and amplify it, so it doesn't kill him using mostly arm.

You should be able to consistently apply 70-80 percent power on that shot, which requires some good power at impact to land that fast shot with some good spin. You are not getting nearly enough power transferred to the ball and there are reasons for it. (inefficiencies - no legs, no hips, bad control of impact zone... all those make transferring power inefficient)

You are also doing the typical Korean "Speed Drive" vs underspin... which in English speaking TT we call a "Fast Loop" where you do a powerful swing and make the ball go real fast with good spin. For anyone demanding why OP isn't doing a slow loop heavy spin, coaches have players to mostly this loop until they get much better. Koreans like to hit the ball hard and teach that style early. Please - no one give OP a hard time about not doing medium or slow heavy loop vs that ball.

You are on average generating only 50-60 percent of your potential power. You are using mostly your arm snap with a pull from your shoulder... you do thousands of those and your shoulder will get tore up eventually. You are not using any hip explosion... not even a "Short Hip" you are not exploding upwards with your legs to start the energy.

You are dipping sown some on backswing prep, (I see your hip level gets below table - GOOD) but I see your hip level staying same level below table on impact consistently - REAL BAD. Your legs and hips never raise up even a cm. Look at the vid yourself again. You get top of hips several cm below table level, you swing and hit ball... hips are exactly same height as your prep phase...

This is making you compensate with other areas of your body... eventually, looping like this will tear you up if you do it high power repeatedly. You are all wore out at 3:30 I see that you overusing your arm and shoulder is not helping you. If you used legs and hips to go with your arm power... overall it would be much easier on your body.

You should be exploding upwards with legs and forward short hip explosion and letting the arm do its thing. That gets you 70% power and that will make a good fast loop. If you "pull the ripcord" (use your free hand and keep it loose and pull your arm towards you like you are pulling a rip cord to start an engine) you will get that extra 10% power (from shoulder rotation) to get that nice 80% power... which can be a damned fast shot with good spin when you strike it in the right part of the impact zone.

I usually do not write technical advice for you on your video threads, I normally comment about aspects of Korean clubs or coaches in your threads when I do comment.

What observations I see, I write it for you and for others to see... such a thing is a common problem with amateurs.

At this stage of you development... if I play a match vs you, I would give you underspin to your FH and INVITE you to fast loop it... you would miss more than 50% of them and I would have low risk and win easy. A Div 5 player or Hope Div player could use that tactic against you until you stop doing that in a match.

When I get back to Korea, I plan on taking a tour of most of the ex-pro clubs down there in that are south of Seoul (KTS, RSM, KJH) (also coach Yoo's Long Pip training club in Yong-In)

If I see that coach, I will kindly ask her to give you an extra hard time about that (lack of using legs/hips) as a professional courtesy trouble making mission thing.

Although this feedback is not meant for me, but it is very generous and elaborative. i have read it at least 10 times and I still would like to read it again and again. So, thank you for sharing your experience. From my perspective, I see that OP is rotating and also bending so how did you know that his mechanics are poor? How did you figure it out? Also, are there any tips to fix this bad form in practice. Like, how do I use more of my body in the shot and how do I know (without peer feedback) that I am doing it correctly?
Thanks once again. I really appreciate the insights you share and the time you give selflessly for others benefit.
 
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says 2023 Certified Organ Donor
says 2023 Certified Organ Donor
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I see that OP is rotating and also bending so how did you know that his mechanics are poor?
Look at the vid. Look where on the prep phase where OP dips waist below table. Look at leg and hip movement after prep and before impact. You will see that consistently, OP does not use legs and hips.

Generating energy and transferring power vs an underspin shot requires the legs and hips as both power starters and leverage.

The OP is transferring power to the ball only with arm. This is very difficult to time and transfer power. Next Level can do it... he has had to adjust how he uses his body to generate power, because of joint issues.

Speed and spin are created from a transfer of power. The OP is not very efficiently transferring power. The fast loop vs underspin requires a good deal of power transfer... or else the shot is just a drive that relies on gravity to pull down the ball instead of spin.

I am not saying that a drive vs underspin is not a valid shot... that shot is valid and is a good option for those who cannot spin... however, making the shot with more spin allows a player to hit it harder and still land it... with even more safety.

I meant the feedback for everyone, many players do not efficiently transfer power.

The power transfer needed to make this shot explosive and safe is a SEQUENCE of muscle explosions done in order with leverage and amplification.

There are many ways to generate, amplify, and deliver power to impact. Everyone has different variations of technique, but physics do not lie. If you want a very fast and decently spinny shot vs an incoming underspin... you need to be able to generate and transfer a lot of power to the ball.

Doing that task with just the arm is poor efficiency. Next Level, who uses what looks like pretty much the arm, is actually using legs and hips as power starters and leverage... albeit using much shorter motions for obvious reasons he has explained before. His shot is a variation one he uses due to his joints. he simply cannot get down much and explode with full range of motion repeatedly, it would kill his joints.

The OP is showing a very good ability to get his hips down (meaning he bent knees and rotated hips some)… OP gets his hip level below table... One has a very good potential to generate power from that position... but OP is not using the legs and hips to start and amplify power... it is very easy to see on the vid.

The solution isn't to try to hit harder (in the same manner) but to generate the power of the shot using legs, then hips, then torso, then shoulders turn, then slow upper arm, then use forearm, then wrist, then fingers...all this if done in sequence with loose muscles used at the right time with leverage, will generate a ton of energy which can be transferred to the ball when timed right with leverage.

This power transfer should appear to a spectator to be done almost effortlessly. The spectator should be left wondering how that player just banged that ball and made it look like he wasn't half trying.

It is easy to describe these principles, but much more challenging to get an adult player to do them, especially when the player has been doing it inefficient for so long... the time required to wipe the hard drive, reformat it, reload it... that is a long process usually. Rarely happens right away. However, some players discover stuff quickly and put it to use quickly.
 
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